Club Cobra Keith Craft Motorsports  

Go Back   Club Cobra > Manufacturers, Engine Builders, tools, and parts. > Shelby American, Inc.

Welcome to Club Cobra!  The World's largest non biased Shelby Cobra related site!

  •  » Representation from nearly all Cobra/Daytona/GT40 manufacturers
  •  » Help from all over the world for your questions
  •  » Build logs for you and all members
  •  » Blogs
  •  » Image Gallery
  •  » Many thousands of members and nearly 1 million posts! 

YES! I want to register an account for free right now!  p.s.: For registered members this ad will NOT show

Keith Craft Racing
Nevada Classics
MMG Superformance
Main Menu
Module Jump:
Nevada Classics
Nevada Classics
MMG Superformance
MMG Superformance
Advertise at CC
Banner Ad Rates
Keith Craft Racing
MMG Superformance
Keith Craft Racing
May 2021
S M T W T F S
            1
2 3 4 5 6 7 8
9 10 11 12 13 14 15
16 17 18 19 20 21 22
23 24 25 26 27 28 29
30 31          

Kirkham Motorsports

Like Tree7Likes

Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Display Modes
  #1 (permalink)  
Old 08-30-2020, 03:19 PM
CC Member
Visit my Photo Gallery

 
Join Date: May 2020
Cobra Make, Engine:
Posts: 15
Not Ranked     
Default CSX4753 help with brakes

I purchased CSX47xx and had it delivered today. The brakes are terrible. The pedal is rock hard and you have to push a lot to get the car stop. It won’t lock the tires up. Really, it’s not safe. Could someone please explain the braking system so I can try to figure out where to start. I don’t see a regular brake booster. So how do they work? Thanks!

Last edited by CSXBill; 03-29-2021 at 07:40 PM..
Reply With Quote
Sponsored Links
Sponsored Links
  #2 (permalink)  
Old 08-30-2020, 05:08 PM
twobjshelbys's Avatar
CC Member
Visit my Photo Gallery

 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: Las Vegas, NV
Cobra Make, Engine: Shelby CSX4005LA, Roush 427IR
Posts: 4,227
Not Ranked     
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by CSXBill View Post
I purchased CSX4753 and had it delivered today. The brakes are terrible. The pedal is rock hard and you have to push a lot to get the car stop. It won’t lock the tires up. Really, it’s not safe. Could someone please explain the braking system so I can try to figure out where to start. I don’t see a regular brake booster. So how do they work? Thanks!
They are not power brakes. Neither was mine "two feet on the pedal" brakes. They are "man's brakes" though. Ie, it's not just moving the toes from the accelerator to the brake pedal, you need to move your foot over and apply steady pressure. Are you sure they are "broken" vs. just tougher than what you are used to?

I'd suggest that since you are asking the questions you are asking that a brake shop would be in order.

(PS. When the Cobra set the 0-100-0 record of 13.8 seconds word was that Miles actually did use both feet on the brakes and that more of the time was spent braking than accelerating.)
desgros@vtlink. and MKS427 like this.
__________________
Cheers,
Tony
CSX4005LA

Last edited by twobjshelbys; 08-30-2020 at 05:22 PM..
Reply With Quote
  #3 (permalink)  
Old 08-30-2020, 06:14 PM
CC Member
Visit my Photo Gallery

 
Join Date: May 2020
Cobra Make, Engine:
Posts: 15
Not Ranked     
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by twobjshelbys View Post
They are not power brakes. Neither was mine "two feet on the pedal" brakes. They are "man's brakes" though. Ie, it's not just moving the toes from the accelerator to the brake pedal, you need to move your foot over and apply steady pressure. Are you sure they are "broken" vs. just tougher than what you are used to?

I'd suggest that since you are asking the questions you are asking that a brake shop would be in order.

(PS. When the Cobra set the 0-100-0 record of 13.8 seconds word was that Miles actually did use both feet on the brakes and that more of the time was spent braking than accelerating.)
Iím sure itís not right. Iíve owned other non-power braked cars and these are just rock hard. No movement on the pedal, even with my 250lbs pushing hard.

Iíll take it to a brake shop. But what type of system is it? I donít see a brake setup under the hood.

Thanks
Reply With Quote
  #4 (permalink)  
Old 08-30-2020, 06:44 PM
CC Member
Visit my Photo Gallery

 
Join Date: Apr 1999
Location: cleveland, OH
Cobra Make, Engine: CSX4000, 427
Posts: 1,991
Not Ranked     
Default

Your pads may be bad, whether you can shave them, or just buy new pads. May need to scuff up the rotors a little ?
__________________
"After jumping into an early lead, Miles pitted for no reason. He let the entire field go by before re-entering the race. The crowd was jumping up and down as he stunned the Chevrolet drivers by easily passing the entire field to finish second behind MacDonald's other team Cobra. The Corvette people were completely demoralized."
Reply With Quote
  #5 (permalink)  
Old 08-30-2020, 07:41 PM
LMH's Avatar
LMH LMH is offline
CC Member
Visit my Photo Gallery

 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: Tucson, AZ
Cobra Make, Engine:
Posts: 5,219
Not Ranked     
Default

Some times with these cars, owners will use comp brake pads which don't work well on a street car. They won't get hot enough. Might be something to look at.
Larry
Blue66 and t walgamuth like this.
__________________
Alba gu brŗth
Reply With Quote
  #6 (permalink)  
Old 08-30-2020, 07:44 PM
twobjshelbys's Avatar
CC Member
Visit my Photo Gallery

 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: Las Vegas, NV
Cobra Make, Engine: Shelby CSX4005LA, Roush 427IR
Posts: 4,227
Not Ranked     
Default

The CSX should have two fluid reservoirs, as I recall they are near the fender on the driver's side. One is for clutch, the other for brakes.

The CSX brakes were more than adequate.

Check fluid and possibly bleed them.

When was the car built? Has brake fluid been serviced? Could be cottage cheese by now.
__________________
Cheers,
Tony
CSX4005LA
Reply With Quote
  #7 (permalink)  
Old 08-30-2020, 08:19 PM
ERA 626's Avatar
CC Member
Visit my Photo Gallery

 
Join Date: Sep 2001
Location: Danville, CA
Cobra Make, Engine: CSX 6079 482CI CSX cross ram
Posts: 1,293
Not Ranked     
Default

The CSX car will have 3 reservoirs. one for clutch, one for front and one for rear on the drivers side fender well. there is no booster lol...
Reply With Quote
  #8 (permalink)  
Old 08-30-2020, 08:34 PM
CC Member / Sponsor
Visit my Photo Gallery

 
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: Provo, UT
Cobra Make, Engine: Daytona Coupe
Posts: 1,342
Not Ranked     
Default

What size are your brake master cylinders?
What size are the pistons in your brake calipers?
Can you post pictures?
__________________
PTH Racing Oil
www.PTHoil.com
Cubic Performance
Reply With Quote
  #9 (permalink)  
Old 08-31-2020, 12:34 AM
CompClassics's Avatar
CC Member
Visit my Photo Gallery

 
Join Date: Feb 2013
Location: Carlsbad, Ca
Cobra Make, Engine: SAI FIA, 289HP (5-bolt), 48IDA Webers
Posts: 1,037
Neutral     
Default

Which brake package do you have on your Cobra, Girling, Baer or Willwood? As Tom had suggested there may be a master cylinder issue or maybe a pad issue. If you opted for the Girling brake package the problem is more than likely the pads, there are several compounds available now from EBC.
I have retrofitted a power brake booster to a 6000 Series Continuation Cobra Ibuilt for a client that had had double knee surgeries that was very happy with the brakes after the install. I have also supplied the same booster to other clients so they could retrofit their Cobras with positive results.
Reply With Quote
  #10 (permalink)  
Old 08-31-2020, 04:38 AM
MKS427's Avatar
CC Member
Visit my Photo Gallery

 
Join Date: Jan 2017
Location: Glendale, AZ
Cobra Make, Engine: FFR MkIV 427
Posts: 548
Not Ranked     
Default

There's a lot of good advise and options here. I'm also certain the CSX cars all had adequate brakes at delivery and you stated the pedal is solid. I'd recommend having someone else look at the brakes to ensure it's not just the difference between power assist (which I'm assuming you a used to) and manual brakes. My FFR and the wife's GT350 brake pedals are night and day different.

Last edited by MKS427; 08-31-2020 at 04:42 AM..
Reply With Quote
  #11 (permalink)  
Old 08-31-2020, 07:32 AM
CC Member
Visit my Photo Gallery

 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Carlsbad, Ca
Cobra Make, Engine: SPF 2932 with 438 Lykins Motorsports engine. Previous owner of FFR 5452.
Posts: 2,509
Not Ranked     
Default

Just a thought, if your car has been sitting for a long period of time, the original pads might have turned to stone. Or, if your car was set up for racing, the pads might need to be hot before they work properly.
If your pedal is solid, that pretty much rules out the master cylinder and brake fluid.
My first step would be more friendly street pads on all four corners. Easy to do, relatively inexpensive too. Then see what youíve got.
Once again, as others have said, without a booster, you do need to stand on the pedal for best results. But then, you should be able to lock them up. If you canít lock em up, sumtingwong.
__________________
Jim
Reply With Quote
  #12 (permalink)  
Old 08-31-2020, 11:50 AM
CompClassics's Avatar
CC Member
Visit my Photo Gallery

 
Join Date: Feb 2013
Location: Carlsbad, Ca
Cobra Make, Engine: SAI FIA, 289HP (5-bolt), 48IDA Webers
Posts: 1,037
Not Ranked     
Default

I’ve never heard of brake pads changing their composition from sitting over a period of time unless they may have been subjected to chemicals in some manner.
It is known however that if the Cobra is equipped with the Girling type calipers that the pads that were supplied with the calipers were developed for track applications where there is a lot of heat developed and not street driving, EBC has released at least three different brake material compounds that are much more street applicable.
t walgamuth likes this.
Reply With Quote
  #13 (permalink)  
Old 08-31-2020, 01:26 PM
CC Member
Visit my Photo Gallery

 
Join Date: May 2020
Cobra Make, Engine:
Posts: 15
Not Ranked     
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by LMH View Post
Some times with these cars, owners will use comp brake pads which don't work well on a street car. They won't get hot enough. Might be something to look at.
Larry
Thanks, Iíll check that out.
Reply With Quote
  #14 (permalink)  
Old 08-31-2020, 01:28 PM
CC Member
Visit my Photo Gallery

 
Join Date: May 2020
Cobra Make, Engine:
Posts: 15
Not Ranked     
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by twobjshelbys View Post
The CSX should have two fluid reservoirs, as I recall they are near the fender on the driver's side. One is for clutch, the other for brakes.

The CSX brakes were more than adequate.

Check fluid and possibly bleed them.

When was the car built? Has brake fluid been serviced? Could be cottage cheese by now.
I see the three black round fluid containers. They arenít labeled, but I will open and see which one is different color than the other two.

It was built in 2004 in Vegas. Iím not sure if brakes have ever been serviced, so Iíll start by bleeding the system and putting new fluid in.
Reply With Quote
  #15 (permalink)  
Old 08-31-2020, 01:30 PM
CC Member
Visit my Photo Gallery

 
Join Date: May 2020
Cobra Make, Engine:
Posts: 15
Not Ranked     
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by CompClassics View Post
Which brake package do you have on your Cobra, Girling, Baer or Willwood? As Tom had suggested there may be a master cylinder issue or maybe a pad issue. If you opted for the Girling brake package the problem is more than likely the pads, there are several compounds available now from EBC.
I have retrofitted a power brake booster to a 6000 Series Continuation Cobra Ibuilt for a client that had had double knee surgeries that was very happy with the brakes after the install. I have also supplied the same booster to other clients so they could retrofit their Cobras with positive results.
It has Baer brakes. How hard was the conversion? What did it cost? Thanks!
Reply With Quote
  #16 (permalink)  
Old 08-31-2020, 01:31 PM
CC Member
Visit my Photo Gallery

 
Join Date: May 2020
Cobra Make, Engine:
Posts: 15
Not Ranked     
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by jhv48 View Post
Just a thought, if your car has been sitting for a long period of time, the original pads might have turned to stone. Or, if your car was set up for racing, the pads might need to be hot before they work properly.
If your pedal is solid, that pretty much rules out the master cylinder and brake fluid.
My first step would be more friendly street pads on all four corners. Easy to do, relatively inexpensive too. Then see what youíve got.
Once again, as others have said, without a booster, you do need to stand on the pedal for best results. But then, you should be able to lock them up. If you canít lock em up, sumtingwong.
Ok, Iíll change the fluid, bleed them, and put new pads on. Thanks for the advice.
Reply With Quote
  #17 (permalink)  
Old 08-31-2020, 01:36 PM
CC Member
Visit my Photo Gallery

 
Join Date: May 2020
Cobra Make, Engine:
Posts: 15
Not Ranked     
Default

I should say the car has just over 2,000 miles on it since it was built in 2004. So it could need some sorting out. When I bought it, the seller went to load it on the transport and it had a fuel leak. The seller was Dennis Collins who has a good reputation for taking care of his customers. He called fuel safe, shipped them the tank and they rebuilt it. It took two months to get it back and I just got the car. I love it, except the brakes. Lol
Reply With Quote
  #18 (permalink)  
Old 08-31-2020, 01:51 PM
twobjshelbys's Avatar
CC Member
Visit my Photo Gallery

 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: Las Vegas, NV
Cobra Make, Engine: Shelby CSX4005LA, Roush 427IR
Posts: 4,227
Not Ranked     
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by CSXBill View Post
I see the three black round fluid containers. They arenít labeled, but I will open and see which one is different color than the other two.

It was built in 2004 in Vegas. Iím not sure if brakes have ever been serviced, so Iíll start by bleeding the system and putting new fluid in.
Yes, sorry, there are three.

They will likely have the same fluid. Or at least mine did. DOT 3 as I recall for both brakes and clutch. It sort of doesn't matter - if it hasn't been serviced all of them need changing. (No matter what the fluid is contributing to the problem). Not knowing the service history you should just change everything that runs. If it's liquid, change it.
__________________
Cheers,
Tony
CSX4005LA
Reply With Quote
  #19 (permalink)  
Old 08-31-2020, 02:01 PM
t walgamuth's Avatar
CC Member/Contributor
Visit my Photo Gallery
Gold Star Contributor
 
Join Date: Jan 2018
Location: Lafayette, IN
Cobra Make, Engine: Looking to buy
Posts: 1,165
Not Ranked     
Default

softer pads will likely do the trick....finding some is a problem though.
__________________
Cobra loving, autocrossing Grandpa Architect.
Reply With Quote
  #20 (permalink)  
Old 08-31-2020, 02:22 PM
twobjshelbys's Avatar
CC Member
Visit my Photo Gallery

 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: Las Vegas, NV
Cobra Make, Engine: Shelby CSX4005LA, Roush 427IR
Posts: 4,227
Not Ranked     
Default

Brake pads don't wear out because they've sat on the car. It's likely the pads that are there were never properly bedded... A good hot run would probably make a world of difference. Change the brake (and clutch, and coolant and rear end and ...) fluids and then bed the brakes you have. You've got nothing to lose and will probably save your self some money and time. I had to run mine because they squeaked and made grinding noises like gravel.
__________________
Cheers,
Tony
CSX4005LA

Last edited by twobjshelbys; 08-31-2020 at 02:28 PM..
Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On



All times are GMT -7. The time now is 12:02 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.0
Copyright ©2000 - 2021, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Search Engine Friendly URLs by vBSEO 3.6.0
The representations expressed are the representations and opinions of the clubcobra.com forum members and do not necessarily reflect the opinions and viewpoints of the site owners, moderators, Shelby American, any other replica manufacturer, Ford Motor Company. This website has been planned and developed by clubcobra.com and its forum members and should not be construed as being endorsed by Ford Motor Company, or Shelby American or any other manufacturer unless expressly noted by that entity. "Cobra" and the Cobra logo are registered trademarks for Ford Motor Co., Inc. clubcobra.com forum members agree not to post any copyrighted material unless the copyrighted material is owned by you. Although we do not and cannot review the messages posted and are not responsible for the content of any of these messages, we reserve the right to delete any message for any reason whatsoever. You remain solely responsible for the content of your messages, and you agree to indemnify and hold us harmless with respect to any claim based upon transmission of your message(s). Thank you for visiting clubcobra.com. For full policy documentation refer to the following link: CC Policy
Links monetized by VigLink