[eschaider]

Originally Posted by 767Jockey

Not at all, Ed. It's statements like this that are arrogant and ignorant. Likewise, I have seen you do much better than stooping to this. The fact that one rejects the notion pf paying twice the price for half the product doesn't necessarily mean that they are over their heads financially, whether it's me or anyone else. Sometimes it's just common sense. If you'd like to pay $400 for a tire that is not nearly as good as most $225 tires in more readily available sizes, have at it.

As cars (and replica's) age the cost to maintain them changes, typically increasing. What was affordable 20 years ago may be less so today.

MJJ hit the nail on the head when he said.

Originally Posted by MJJ

I would rather have the look of a decent performing 15 tire than the cutting edge performance of an 18” tire.

For those complaining about the cost of Avon’s, Just be thankful you don’t own an older Ferrari that requires engine out service every 3-4 years. Avon’s are a rounding error compared to something like that.

There are several important points he is making.

First he is recognizing the visual signature appearance of the 15 inch tire as opposed to a larger diameter, lower profile, better handling tire — that might also cost less than or equal to the 15" tire but significantly outperform it.

Unless you are racing the car, the ultimate performance tire is not what you are looking for 99% of the time and we know that by just looking at what owners buy for their cars. It is the 15" tire variants invariably.

Second he is recognizing the escalating cost of maintaining an original and to a lesser extent a replica. As he so accurately points out, the cost of the Avon tire can amount to little more than a rounding error for the required maintenance on some historical vehicles.

As the cost of maintaining your replica rises everyone eventually reaches a point where they say enough is enough and with, usually a fair amount of sadness, sell their toy.

Originally Posted by 767Jockey

As for Avon's I'm certainly not on a one man crusade to banish them. I couldn't care less who buys them. The fact is the only group that I have ever seen buy them as a preference to other brands is our Cobra group. If they were any good, than better handling cars such as Porsches, Vettes, BMW's, Lambos, Ferrari's and so on would use them. I have yet to see a single one of these cars use Avon's. Why? Because there are much better tires available in their size.

The answer is not what you are suggesting. The answer is what MJJ suggested.

Originally Posted by MJJ

I would rather have the look of a decent performing 15" tire than the cutting edge performance of an 18” tire.

There is a widely held and understandable preference for a DOT listed 15" radial tire that visually resembles the original Billboards without their twitchiness. This is a specially sized, specialty tire that most manufacturers do not offer today. Avon does. That alone makes them pricey..

Originally Posted by 767Jockey

We use them because, again, they're the best of a bad lot in our size, yet that doesn't make them good. If they were in fact good everyone would use them. Few do when they have another choice. I would simply like to see us have a better choice. I thought that perhaps others would see the benefit in trying to rectify the situation rather than succumbing to it. I see little support for that here, and that's fine. That's it.

You can't logically have both sides of the same argument. Either they are or are not and then pick your argument. After lines up you said,

Originally Posted by 767Jockey

If they were any good, than better handling cars such as Porsches, Vettes, BMW's, Lambos, Ferrari's and so on would use them.

You are missing it again. They are bought because they are the best performing 15" tire that does a reasonably good job at mimicking the Billboard look. It has nothing to do with modern performance cars it has to do with replicationg the Billboard appearance in a DOT listed tire that handles well for a 15" tire.

Originally Posted by 767Jockey

I doubt that the Avon ranks at the top compared to many, if any at all, of these ...

Again that is not the focus of the tire manufacturer or most buyers. If it were to happen that is great, if not that is also great. If you track your car, chances are you have large diameter low profile racing tires with a racing compound for the rubber.

Here we go jumping over the fence again taking the other side of the argument.

Originally Posted by 767Jockey

... In 15" there isn't. I posted that to show all the superior tires to the Avon at significantly lower prices. The fact that there are really few choices in 15" is the only reason people pay the high price for Avons. They're way overpriced for what you get. ....

Can you see the inconsistency?

You actually recognize MJJ's point and that of the many of us who have bought AVON's — In the 15 inch space they are very likely the best choice to replicate and appearance we have available. A nice side bonus is they are very likely the best performing 15" tire available.

Now, as soon as you are prepared to step away from the 15" tire style all kinds of new opportunities open up, again at different price points. But, if you want that original look you are in a 15 inch world at elevated pricing — sort of a similar experience to what MJJ was saying.

Originally Posted by MJJ

I would rather have the look of a decent performing 15 tire than the cutting edge performance of an 18” tire.

For those complaining about the cost of Avon’s, Just be thankful you don’t own an older Ferrari that requires engine out service every 3-4 years. Avon’s are a rounding error compared to something like that.

Ed