Kinetic Racing Engines

[Shoo]

I'm planning to get a Cobra and I've been reading this forum and some others for a while. I'll probably get a Kirkham because it seems like good mix of modern performance engineering options and accurate classic good looks. I talked to them on the phone too and I liked their style. I had my mind set on big hp Roush engine probably because of their name and racing reputation. Now I've changed my mind and Roush is out.

I've seen numerous positive comments about Keith Craft and he seems to be recommended by Kirkham or at least there is a link from their site. They also have a link to Kinetic but I cannot really find any comments or user experiences of their engines. I'm thinking something like the Kinetic Cobra 495 engine.

http://www.kineticracingengines.com/...s/cobra495.htm

I'm looking to have 600 hp or maybe more. Just because.

I also like the idea of an engine with a modern fuel injection instead of carbs. But only if it is not a gamble. I've yet to talk to the Kinetic folks so I don't know if FI is even an option. Regardless, any feedback on their engines and work in general is greatly appreciated.

TIA

[RodKnock]

Originally Posted by Shoo

I also like the idea of an engine with a modern fuel injection instead of carbs. But only if it is not a gamble.

TIA

It's a big gamble based upon a preponderance of evidence from many FI posts. For every one person who's got their FI dialed in 100%, you'll probably find another 9 people having some sort of issue.

600+ HP is reasonably easy nowadays, assuming you have about $15,000-$40,000 to spend.

I'm not biased one bit, but I think you made the proper choice of Cobra manufacturers.

Psst. Don't say anything to the ERA guys. They drink THE "Kool-Aid."
(just kidding, leave me alone Patrick).

[Cashburn]

I would also like to get some reviews on Kinetic as well.

[tnlprt]

no problem keeping on topic

[Anthony]

I've heard nothing but good things. There are several members here with their engines, in their top-notch cars.

I heard that Kinetic built, for chevy, their engines for the lemans series vettes in the recent past.

[ERA Chas]

Originally Posted by RodKnock

Psst. Don't say anything to the ERA guys. They drink THE "Kool-Aid."
(just kidding, leave me alone Patrick).

So KMP owners drink THE Andre champaign??

Bad Rodknock-you forgot about me...

Shoo-talk to KCR, Tom Lucas and George Anderson before deciding.

[RodKnock]

Originally Posted by ERA Chas

So KMP owners drink THE Andre champaign??

Bad Rodknock-you forgot about me...

Shoo-talk to KCR, Tom Lucas and George Anderson before deciding.

It was late, I'm tired and under the weather. Sorry. I should have included you in my sarcasm.

As for the $11,000 used engine, yes, you got me on my range, if you include used engines.

[FUNFER2]

Look over Keith Crafts website then call him. He'll build you a killer 600 + HP/TQ engine and I'm sure a better price. He's the man.

http://www.keithcraft.com/

[Tom Kirkham]

In the first post there is a link to video of one Kinetics engines running inside CSX3170...
ORIGINAL Cobra wins OPTIMA Batteries Ultimate Street Car Invitational

[tnlprt]

same here deleted to keep on topic

[RodKnock]

Originally Posted by tnlprt

Yea I guess you can call it used
The block and heads have been used
but completely refurbished
The pistons and cam are used
Been freshened and sitting on the engine stand with zero run time
every thing else is new so yea you want to call it used be my guest
At least it dosent have a cast crank or off shore rods of questionable composition
Go to any of the BIG NAME BUILDERS and get the same parts
and compare the final bill
I think you will see about a 5 to 8K savings
but hey thats just my opinion the only reason its for sale is to build my other 3 Side Oilers

No disrespect Joe, but I don't think you can compare yourself with 40 posts to Keith Craft, Gessford or FE Specialties, three of this website's sponsors.

A brand new all aluminum sideoiler with a dyno-proven 600 +/- HP at $17K with company backing in the form of a warranty is just not the same as your offering. There are dozens of 482's out there with many miles, which have those "questionable" parts and have held up just fine.

Best of luck with your builds.

[tnlprt]

deleted to keep on topic

[computerworks]

The thread is a request for feedback on Kinetic Engines.

Let's keep it that way... on the original topic.

thanks
ron
ClubCobra Moderator

[Cobra #3170]

Originally Posted by Shoo

I'm planning to get a Cobra and I've been reading this forum and some others for a while. I'll probably get a Kirkham because it seems like good mix of modern performance engineering options and accurate classic good looks. I talked to them on the phone too and I liked their style. I had my mind set on big hp Roush engine probably because of their name and racing reputation. Now I've changed my mind and Roush is out.

I've seen numerous positive comments about Keith Craft and he seems to be recommended by Kirkham or at least there is a link from their site. They also have a link to Kinetic but I cannot really find any comments or user experiences of their engines. I'm thinking something like the Kinetic Cobra 495 engine.

http://www.kineticracingengines.com/...s/cobra495.htm

I'm looking to have 600 hp or maybe more. Just because.

I also like the idea of an engine with a modern fuel injection instead of carbs. But only if it is not a gamble. I've yet to talk to the Kinetic folks so I don't know if FI is even an option. Regardless, any feedback on their engines and work in general is greatly appreciated.

TIA

I have had Kinetic build 4 different engines for me over the past 15 years, two with carbs and 2 with Fuel injection, all these engines were absolutely excellent. These guys really know their stuff, they do not do high volume low cost engines, they do build high quality engines that live and make great horsepower. I regularly rev my 498 CID FE to 7500 rpm and occasionally to 7800 and have had absolutely no issues. I know you will see some big HP numbers posted here and other places but having seen some of these engines with big numbers run I have good reason to doubt the numbers. The biggest problem I have had with my Kinetic engines over the years was hooking them up! I would not go to any other builder for my next engine.

[ERA Chas]

Originally Posted by Cobra #3170

I have had Kinetic build 4 different engines for me over the past 15 years, two with carbs and 2 with Fuel injection, all these engines were absolutely excellent. These guys really know their stuff, they do not do high volume low cost engines, they do build high quality engines that live and make great horsepower. I regularly rev my 498 CID FE to 7500 rpm and occasionally to 7800 and have had absolutely no issues. I know you will see some big HP numbers posted here and other places but having seen some of these engines with big numbers run I have good reason to doubt the numbers. The biggest problem I have had with my Kinetic engines over the years was hooking them up! I would not go to any other builder for my next engine.

An excellent, first-hand recommendation, very valuable insight.

Shoo, if you do speak with them, be very honest about your intended usage. 3170 uses big RPM, and makes power high up in the band. You may not need to pay for HD parts you may not need. 600HP is not a highly stressed engine at this displacement.

[Shoo]

Originally Posted by Cobra #3170

I have had Kinetic build 4 different engines for me over the past 15 years, two with carbs and 2 with Fuel injection, all these engines were absolutely excellent. These guys really know their stuff, they do not do high volume low cost engines, they do build high quality engines that live and make great horsepower. I regularly rev my 498 CID FE to 7500 rpm and occasionally to 7800 and have had absolutely no issues.

Thank you for sharing your experience. Based on the above I can only conclude that there is nothing inherently wrong with fuel injected FE's. The key seems to be that "guys really know their stuff".

Originally Posted by Cobra #3170

I know you will see some big HP numbers posted here and other places but having seen some of these engines with big numbers run I have good reason to doubt the numbers. The biggest problem I have had with my Kinetic engines over the years was hooking them up! I would not go to any other builder for my next engine.

May I ask what kind hp and torque are you getting? Are you running pump or race gas?

I saw a couple of videos on Youtube of what I think is your car. All I can say is respect to both the car and the driver.

[Cobra #3170]

Originally Posted by Shoo

Thank you for sharing your experience. Based on the above I can only conclude that there is nothing inherently wrong with fuel injected FE's. The key seems to be that "guys really know their stuff".



May I ask what kind hp and torque are you getting? Are you running pump or race gas?

I saw a couple of videos on Youtube of what I think is your car. All I can say is respect to both the car and the driver.

Horse power @ Flywheel 806@ 7600 torque 652 @5500 this was on a Superflow dyno that was calibrated before running and with a new load cell. It also repeated on a number of different pulls so I am very confident in the numbers. We got these numbers with the car exhaust system, we also tried an 1150 Dominator and it made 819@7600. I can't deal with the stumbles that inevitably come with carbs at high g loading. This thing makes just short of 600 lb/ft and 450 hp @ 4000 rpm so it has a broad power band given the fairly radical cam.

EFI The car uses a F.A.S.T. system with a Wilson 1600 CFM throttle body and Alpha N program. I actually program it for what ever my MAP sensor reads when I run it at different altitudes and barometric pressures but the new XFI system does that automatically. I can log air fuel ratios because it has a wide band sensor but cannot use a closed loop approach because of cam overlap. If you will notice from the video the engine pulls cleanly from 2500 RPM in the slow autox corner and it never stumbles even though it is cornering at 1.6 g's in the video. When I ran a carb (a highly modified Dominator) it used to die under hard stops and run unevenly under high cornering loads so I really like the fuel injection. It always starts when hot or cold because you can program everything from a lap top including acceleration enrichment and temperature compensation. I have run many different combinations of carbs over the years including duel 4 short bowls, duel 4 center pivots mounted side ways, duel 500 cfm center pivot 2 barrels and single 4's of 750, 850, 900 and 1150 cfm.
I would never go back from fuel injection unless it was on a street or drag race car that would never be asked to handle high g cornering or stops.

The engine is on race gas and is 14.7 to 1 and has about 29 d. advance at 6500 which says a lot about the cylinder heads.

[Shoo]

Thank you #3170. You have cleared up many key issues in my mind.

[gsharapa]

Cobra #3170

Awesome Cobra and your driving ain't bad either. Are you running a solid roller cam and what heads?

[Rare Iron]

Well, for what it's worth, both owners of Kinetic (Chris Gesek & I can't remember the other guy) used to work for Roush years ago. They use my mufflers whenever they do a Cobra, & even other vehicles, so I've been to their facility on numerous occasions. As far as I know, they have a very good reputation & the shop is pretty extensive & clean. I can't say firsthand though as I've never had a motor built by them. They used to do a lot of prototype work for GM & Ford.

-Eric