Cobra Make, Engine: Unique 427 S/C, FE 440, top-loader, 3.31
Posts: 130
Not Ranked
Don't put the whammy on me please. My Cobra purchase 3 months ago was the result of a pelvis shattering MC accident. No more Harley. Been working on her slowly and painfully through rehab. I did change out her 9 qts. Man I hope Dr approves me to go back to work next month. 6 months off is enough. Thankful to be alive in FL. Naproxin is my drug of necessity now.
That makes no sense. If anything, you should change the oil before you start driving. Why have new oil sitting in the pan collecting moisture and becoming contaminated?
I like using fresh oil as the old oil may,.... have containments that sit on the bearings all winter. I use a new filter too, then it's ready to fire back up in spring. Oil is relatively low in cost, versus the cost of our engines we put in our cobras.
So,... oil being the blood of the engine, why not be assured that we are doing everything we can to help save our expensive performance engines, for the cost of a oil & filter change. No brainier for me folks.
(I also take my old oil & filter in to be recycled)
I don't think it matters if the temp is 180 or 240. We're all just going to throw a clot and die long before our engines see any wear from any of this.
Your exactly right patrick, there is a whole lot fretting over this. A lot of people forget that the temp is being measured after the oil has gone through the cooler. Mine reads 80 C and have never had a problem with condensation in the 7 years I have owned it.
Less than 3k miles, irregardless Of time you have no contaminant concentration even remotely close to doing damage. Patrickt is right one morning you wake up not feeling well and your priorities change real quick.
Don't feel bad for people who smoke and get sick or motorcycle riders, they are a drain on our medical services, along with the obese.
Quote:
Originally Posted by FUNFER2
I like using fresh oil as the old oil may,.... have containments that sit on the bearings all winter. I use a new filter too, then it's ready to fire back up in spring. Oil is relatively low in cost, versus the cost of our engines we put in our cobras.
So,... oil being the blood of the engine, why not be assured that we are doing everything we can to help save our expensive performance engines, for the cost of a oil & filter change. No brainier for me folks.
(I also take my old oil & filter in to be recycled)
Location: No city...only 118 residents in Manter,
KS
Cobra Make, Engine: Cobra Auto Works body, Ron Godell Racecars chassis, 1989 Mustang GT 5.0 HO (converted to carb), W/C T-5, 3.73's in a Ford 9" Traction-Loc.
Posts: 812
Not Ranked
Quote:
Originally Posted by FUNFER2
I like using fresh oil as the old oil may,.... have containments that sit on the bearings all winter. I use a new filter too, then it's ready to fire back up in spring. Oil is relatively low in cost, versus the cost of our engines we put in our cobras.
So,... oil being the blood of the engine, why not be assured that we are doing everything we can to help save our expensive performance engines, for the cost of a oil & filter change. No brainier for me folks.
(I also take my old oil & filter in to be recycled)
Looks like great minds think alike, eh, Kev? Good to hear from ya! My issue is I don't want those acids etching away at the bearing surfaces, much less the crank journals....ergo, I flush the system with clean oil as I warm up the motor after the oil change and drive it into the garage, hopefully leaving nothing but clean oil on the bearings over the winter/summer storage periods.
I always recycle my used oil, but the auto supply stores here don't seem to know what to do with the used filters. I drain mine for 48 hourse into the oil drain pan, then discard it in the regular trash. I don't think that is the best solution, but unless I can find a recycler who knows what to do with the filters I am at a loss for a better solution.
If anyone has any ideas of a better way to dispose of the used oil filters, I would be happy to hear about them...thanks!
Quote:
Originally Posted by mpanten
Your exactly right patrick, there is a whole lot fretting over this. A lot of people forget that the temp is being measured after the oil has gone through the cooler. Mine reads 80 C and have never had a problem with condensation in the 7 years I have owned it.
My replica has a "double hump" pan...the engine is from a "Fox body" Mustang GT. It has a bung (for lack of a better term) on the driver's side of the rear pan, probably for one of those sensors that lets a careless driver know that their oil level needs to be checked before it gets dangerously low. I have thought about tapping into that bung for a place to locate an oil temperature sensor...but think it may well be above the level of the oil in the pan and therefore might not work. Does anyone have any ideas regarding this?
"Looks like great minds think alike, eh, Kev? Good to hear from ya! "
I agree ! And it's good to hear from you as well !.
Daily driver, yes, 3.000 miles, But no high performance motor of mine is going to wait for 3,000 or 3 years, for it's blood & liver will be changed !!!
"To each it's own",... I say. (most of the time anyway) lol
Good conversation with Lake Speed, Jr. about oil on the Adam Carolla's CarCast.
"Lake Speed, Jr. discusses the applications for synthetic oil and other matters of engine lubrication. Speed is a certified lubrication specialist and oil monitoring analyst. He is also the general manager and head of technical support at Joe Gibbs Driven Racing Oil."
The US Army doesn't change the oil unless Oil Analysis says "Do It," and there's not much industry worry about etched bearings from motors sitting around. Most of what is in oil is - drum roll - oil. The additive package is what wears out, there are sacrificial chemicals and detergents that are consumed.
If the filters were actually good enough, about all you would really need to do is refresh the additive package at the appropriate time, top off what went missing in action, and drive on, leaving the oil in the motor for hundreds of thousands of miles. It is largely what happens to transmissions - 50K changes.
As for reading oil temps from a gauge, it doesn't read the hottest points oil is exposed to, just the overall result of mixing it up and being cooled. Since most cranks and rods have oil ports directed at the piston to cool it, the oil is being exposed to some fairly warm temps to carry off heat and preserve the aluminum from overheating. Therefore, the oil will see more than 212 F if it's operated for longer than 1/2 hour at moderate speeds.
However - the topic of fuel spoiling in the tank after sitting a few weeks is becoming much more notorious. Cars that sit longer than three months get to the point of simply not being able to start at all. The fuel undergoes severe degradation and there are no long term preservatives on the market that can keep it fresh over months at a time. The small engine industry is under stress from the large number of complaints over it, and the cause of it all is alcohol in gas.
It's going to get worse, E15 was approved, and that means paying the same and getting even less BTU's of power for a gallon. Alcohol is pound for pound less powerful, but much more aggressive in deteriorating fuel lines. If there is any pre - alcohol based fuel hose in a build car, it will deteriorate, shed rubber particles, and eventually leak much faster today than on the gas we grew up with.
Oils have improved to the point that BMW has 15,000 mile changes, most cars used today are factory recommended to change at a 7,500 or more, since 1990. The upshot is changing oil sooner than necessary is a waste of money, but ignoring the current issues with gasoline as it continues to deteriorate in power and longevity is denial in the extreme. It won't be very important if someone changed the oil in 300 or 3,000 or every three years if it catches fire and burns to the ground. Fuel containment is far more important than wringing one's hands over condensation in a garage queen while the family car endures worse treatment but motors on regardless. The fact they can is entirely based on they're ability to withstand alcohol contaminated fuels better, not what oil is in the motor from the last $45 quicky changer someone visited at lunch.
It's beginning to sound like middle aged women in the lunch room clucking over bone density loss while gulping down Big Macs and slurping apartame laced diet soda. Really? You must be kidding.
As a former Army Reservist with a degree in Auto Tech, I know very well exactly what causes most of the problems with vehicles in storage - they don't get driven enough. It's not the oil that's a problem, it's batteries not getting charged, belts oxidizing from sitting in place, tires getting weather checked from lack of exercise, bulbs suddenly shocked out of disuse. Those are exactly what top the list every summer when we gathered for training, and seeing it happen to hundreds of vehicles at a time in just the first few days drives the point home. If you want to see things fall apart - leave them parked. They will, much faster than driving them.
In America, how often you change your oil is your business. Please don't try to justify it with excuses about acid, condensation, or engine damage when there is another petroleum distillate of far more importance getting worse yearly, rather than better like oil.
Last edited by tirod; 07-14-2012 at 07:42 PM..
Reason: Gotta love the Amsoil virus, it attacks all my posts.
Less than 3k miles, irregardless Of time you have no contaminant concentration even remotely close to doing damage. Patrickt is right one morning you wake up not feeling well and your priorities change real quick.
Don't feel bad for people who smoke and get sick or motorcycle riders, they are a drain on our medical services, along with the obese.
My guess would be that unless you change your oil, then start the car and run it for a while to flush out the old oil, the oil sitting on your bearings isn't going to drain into the pan anyhow. Now, if you do start the car after you change the oil, then you just took those contaminants you spoke of and put them right back into the new oil.
Add to that the fact that where I live in Ohio, the temperature all Winter fluctuates greatly. I do not have a climate controlled garage, so there is a lot of moisture generated on the block and in the block. As soon as you start cranking the engine, all that moisture is pumped through and mixed with the oil. Probably a lot worse than the contaminants you are talking about.
Talking about creating problems while doing feel good maintenance I repacked the bearings on my boat trailer and did not realize the out seal of the double lip seal rolled onto itself 1/2 way round during install. Well filled with water and took out bearings and races. It was bone dry prior to my genius move. Devils in the details.
Quote:
Originally Posted by mdross1
A debate with no winners,especially with strong minded opinions seems we have a few on this site. Motorcycle Riders!
Read one time a trucker went 409,000 miles on oil change using synthetic oil with added double or triple prefilters.Had oil tested periodically,this same E7-400 engine had over 600,000 miles on the clock.
Cobra Make, Engine: VSE alum. frame, FFR carbonfiber body (under construction)
Posts: 293
Not Ranked
I read a study once where it was concluded that there is an unexplained (at least at the time of the study) spike (INCREASE) in wear on the engine immediately following EVERY oil change. Then the "wear rate" would return to the pre-oil change rate very quickly. This was true even though the new filter(s) were filled with new oil etc. (i.e., not a result of a "dry" start). Sorry I can't find the study now.
Appreciate all the input and opinions.
Patrick...total agreement with every one of your posts on this thread...asspecially the point about us falling apart before these overbuilt basturds will.
I drive it periodically throughout the year...lucky enough to turn left off our street onto a big straight two lane for about 10 miles that takes me into the lower Kings Canyon to warm up the Avons as the road follows the river for another 7 miles...turn around before the dam and come back...30-40 minutes. If it's a bit cold and misty...so much the better. The Fresno heat drops below triple digits most evenings when I get home and run it...better than a stiff drink for clearing out one's head and warming the oil (also rarely above 95C).
I wash/Windex the car and change the oil once a year...only the green stuff (Brad Penn) for the flat tappets (as God intended) and Moroso filters. Every two years, I drain the water and put some back in with a bottle of Water Wetter.
KISS. Folks tend to fiddle with these things too much IMHO...I'd rather drive the hell out of it.
Location: No city...only 118 residents in Manter,
KS
Cobra Make, Engine: Cobra Auto Works body, Ron Godell Racecars chassis, 1989 Mustang GT 5.0 HO (converted to carb), W/C T-5, 3.73's in a Ford 9" Traction-Loc.
Posts: 812
Not Ranked
I had a friend who almost never changed his oil, just changed the filter and added enough oil to make sure that the oil level was right. His Ford engine lasted for a long time!
I am not advocating that, since I feel the oil gets contaminated with corrosive combustion byproducts and even the oil industry says the additives are the first to go. Every second or third oil change my friend would add a container of Rislone...did it make any difference? We'll never know...he's gone on to that great boneyard in the sky!
I had a friend who almost never changed his oil, just changed the filter and added enough oil to make sure that the oil level was right. His Ford engine lasted for a long time!
I am not advocating that, since I feel the oil gets contaminated with corrosive combustion byproducts and even the oil industry says the additives are the first to go. Every second or third oil change my friend would add a container of Rislone...did it make any difference? We'll never know...he's gone on to that great boneyard in the sky!
Cheers!
Dugly
A mechanic at the local Ford dealership told me they had a good customer that did the same thing....at about 5,000 miles,he would change the oil filter and add a quart of oil on all his vehicles....the oil drain plug had never been unscrewed......he drove his vehicles for about 100,000 miles before trading them in on a new one, said he never had any engine problems!!!!!!
I put about 400mi for the season, regardless of the mileage, I changed to a fresh new oil and flitter early spring and my mind is clear. Leaving old oil tends to create acids that would damage you engine in the long run. But that's just the anal part of me. I also like to go to the snake pit aka man cave and play with the car.
My 2 cents on the oily matter.
Lou
And it's good to hear from you as well !. 
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