Click It or Ticket Insanity

[RedEsprit]

This, of course, was inevitable as city, county, and state tax revenue dries up in this economy. More of our constables are now being demoted to the job of tax collector. This is a link that includes a recent Car & Driver article. This will only get worse as sheriff's departments look for revenue sources to support their jobs. Unfortunately, the source of revenue is now YOU! Make sure you remember this the next time some "Benevolent Society" calls you on the phone for a donation to the troopers or whatever. There is no defense for this in today's economy. Copy and paste: http://globaleconomicanalysis.blogsp...ity-10-of.html

[Great Asp]

The Click-it or Ticket "drive" runs from the end of May to the beginning of June, but I am sick of it year round.

1. The state of Missouri posts crap like "You drink, you drive, you loose", "Click-it ot Ticket" on the Amber Alert signs.
2. The states of Missouri and Illinios have purchased radio spots with further threats about how "Troopers are waiting to catch you, and you will pay a fine". Then a guy that sounds like Darth Vader talks like he is a Trooper "I am out there at night, and you will pay a fine for no seat belt"...WTF?
3. The state of Illinios has so many Troopers on the highways "on traffic" (on traffic means they are out to write tickets) it boarders on ridiculous.

And the entire time we pay the taxes to support big brother threatening us.

I for one "get it". I do not need repeated intimidation for compliance, and I fear further bombardment of safety laws like no smoking (I do not smoke). Do you pay a fine for smoking in the wrong place?

E

[Commodore]

Often wondered what happens to a Cobra in a seat belt spot check? Are Cobra's OK with just lap belts or can a fine be levied if the entire harness is not being worn? My car is registered as a '65 so lap belts should be legal but even if it wasn't registered as a '65, what's the law? I've been through one spot check. The officer just admired the car and checked if I was wearing a lap belt (I was) then waved me through. Would an officer not so car appreciative had any grounds to fine me for not wearing the entire race belt package?

[Blas]

Technically, I don't believe the 3" belts and harness are DOT approved...Lap belts are always required but shoulder harnesses are not unless they came as OEM equipment on the original car. On a new SPF, shoulder harnesses are options.

[ERA Chas]

Originally Posted by Blas

Technically, I don't believe the 3" belts and harness are DOT approved...Lap belts are always required but shoulder harnesses are not unless they came as OEM equipment on the original car. On a new SPF, shoulder harnesses are options.

That's correct, SFI approved race belts are not DOT approved.
Nuts huh?

[427sharpe]

Tx legislature finally has some voices trying to eradicate the red light cameras, as a 'state wide tax not approved by the populace', which is a violation of the state constitution. As for the seat belts; I have never understood why it is ok to ride my motorcycle without a helmet, wearing flip flops, no shirt and shorts but riding in an Explorer without a seat belt on is deemed too risky!?!
All boils down to $. Insurance lobby here is huge, and they love the revenue of rising premiums, and we all know how the state loves cash!

[patrickt]

Originally Posted by ERA Chas

That's correct, SFI approved race belts are not DOT approved.

But has anyone on this forum ever been hassled on the road by a trooper for not having a DOT anything? Maybe, just maybe, tires... but something like seat belts, or the lenses on your brake/turn lights? Naaaahhh never.

[joyridin']

We are being invaded by Photo cameras. They are placing them everywhere anymore. The ticket is a civilian offense, so no points on your license, but oyu basically have no defense.

I've gotten 3 tickets so far. The fines were $100 each. I haven't paid a singel one. They can't do anything if you don't pay.

Some guy hit me last year on a city street. He was doing 80 mph, had no license (under suspension), plates were ficticious, no insurance, and he admitted he was "wasted". He took out my car and 4 others. The ambulance took him away, and the police wouldn't go to the hospital to give him a breathalyzer test. He got off scot-free. Cost me $500 and my insurance company a lot more. They went to suspend his license for driving without insurance, but found it was already suspended.

I see the guy driving all the time. I am deducting the $500 from the tickets I get. All are in the same city.

[Tim Brewer]

The cops in my town now will stand (three of them usually) at a light of a busy intersection and walk around checking for seat belts, registration and inspection stickers. They'll give out tickets all day. Something doesn't seem quite right about that.

[Ron61]

The only time I was ever questioned abut the seat belts in my Cobra was when I just had the lap belt fastened and explained that the originals never came with them until they were put in for racing as they weren't meant to be a production car. The cop was nice and told me that if I would just put the shoulder and Crotch belts out of sight when I was driving around and use the lap belt that would be ok. I never had another question about them.

Ron

[4RE KLR]

Originally Posted by Tim Brewer

The cops in my town now will stand (three of them usually) at a light of a busy intersection and walk around checking for seat belts, registration and inspection stickers. They'll give out tickets all day. Something doesn't seem quite right about that.

Yep, I got one for no inspection sticker in Dallas. Here is the kicker, it was with-in the grace period.

When I asked the cop "wasn't there a grace period of ten days?"
He replied, "Tell it to the judge"

I got it dismissed, but it took me two trips to the court house to get it done. The lady said the cop had written over thirty tickets THAT DAY for expired inspection sticker that was with-in the grace period.

It is all about income generation.

[RedEsprit]

A few years back I was in Houston and was a passenger in a car. We just pulled out of a strip mall immediately to a red light. As we stopped at the lights 8-10 cops jumped out from behind bushes and ran down between the cars checking for seat belts. I was ticketed for not having mine on and was fined $125. In normal economic times, such actions show the lows that law enforcement has sunk to. In today's economic times, a $100-$300 ticket can be distastrous to some families struggling to make ends meet. There is no defense for such actions. Police that stoop this low deserve to lose their jobs in the next round of layoffs. If this is what it has come to, we clearly have way too many police officers. I don't see how they can hold their heads up in the community.

[4RE KLR]

I have actually asked the question about seat belts to a cop before. He told me that they can and sometimes do issue tickets to people in "old cars" for not having the seat belts (shoulder belts) on.

If the car has the shoulder harness in the car then it is required to be worn. NOT just the lap belt, but the lap belt AND the shoulder harness.

He did say it was at the discretion of the officer, but if they are income generation mode I believe they would write you up. The argument is that the car did not have shoulder belts when they were new. Their response argument is "it is a replica, the car did not exist, in 1965". If you raise too much hell about that they will harass you about the registration of the car.

We all know what happen to Paul Cass, and the harassment he had with his car about the registration.

[Powershift1038]

The simple solution seems to be... wear your seat belts.

If you have a shoulder harness set up... wear it. The intent of the seat belt tickets is to make people wear them, and save some lives.

[Dangerous Doug]

Let me get this straight... You guys are complaining because the law is being enforced?

If you can't pay the fine, don't do the crime.

I actually appreciate highway patrol and troopers and what they do. I've nearly been nailed by soccer Mom's running red lights while talking on their cell phones, and nearly rear-ended by twenty-somethings texting while driving (or, more recently, by a little grey-haired lady in a Subaru on Hwy 17...) These people, I hope, will get caught and their behavior (hopefully) will be modified.

A stroll through a junk yard, observing the spider-web shaped cracks in windshield glass should be enough to convince someone to put their friggin' seat belt on. Read here on ClubCobra about a guy that wrecked his Cobra (and I think, killed) because his seat-belt was bolted into the fiberglass floorpan instead of into the frame, and the fiberglass ripped out with him flying (to his death) in his seat.

I don't know. Put the seatbelt on, hang up the cell phone, stop texting, and don't drink and drive. Speed at your own risk (financial or otherwise), and don't put anybody ELSE at risk.

Just a few thoughts...
DD

[Great Asp]

Originally Posted by Dangerous Doug

Let me get this straight... You guys are complaining because the law is being enforced?
DD

I think your missing the point. The laws are being written to appease lobbyists (MADD, Insurance companies, etc...) and we are paying for "over enforcement" of these stupid laws. Have you heard "don't murder, or your freedom won't go further"? Of course not, because murder does not generate money.

There must be something to this click-it or ticket program generating dollars for the states.

I always put my seatbelt on, I am sick of being threatened if I do not have it on.

E

[427sharpe]

And again, if it's all about 'saving lives'..why the dichotomy with motorcycles?
I can ride without a shirt or helmet, wearing shorts and flip flops and that is ok? Where the rush to protect me from myself?
The government which governs least governs best.

[Powershift1038]

Originally Posted by 427sharpe

And again, if it's all about 'saving lives'..why the dichotomy with motorcycles?
I can ride without a shirt or helmet, wearing shorts and flip flops and that is ok? Where the rush to protect me from myself?
The government which governs least governs best.

Yes, but should you crash your bike without wearing a shirt or helmet, while wearing shorts and flip flops, you would have to accept the responsibility for your major injuries which could have been prevented. Just as those who choose to ignore a simple seat belt law have to accept their fines.

I'm sure this issue could be debated for 10 more pages. But again.. wear you seat belt to help protect your own life, and prevent getting a ticket. Simple as that.

[427sharpe]

Originally Posted by Powershift1038

Yes, but should you crash your bike without wearing a shirt or helmet, while wearing shorts and flip flops, you would have to accept the responsibility for your major injuries which could have been prevented. Just as those who choose to ignore a simple seat belt law have to accept their fines.

I'm sure this issue could be debated for 10 more pages. But again.. wear you seat belt to help protect your own life, and prevent getting a ticket. Simple as that.

I guess I did not state my point clearly enough. IF the seat belt laws are all about saving lives (as opposed to revenue generation/powerful lobby manipulation) why are the laws on motorcycles so lax? Clearly a motorcycle presents a greater danger (to operator) in case of accident, yes? And if so the laws for safety should be tighter, should they not?
And if a collision occurs (regardless of vehicle) I accept what happens so how does the state get to mandate what is good for me? This to me (a religious seat belt user, btw) is another example of nitwit legislatures being manipulated into performing work for a powerful lobby (insurance). It is no more about 'saving lives' than the 55 mph speed limit was/is. In my view, what I do (and the risks I accept) are my responsibility, not the states. And finally, I believe the red light cameras showcase this clearly! Here in Texas, the cities are raising he// because revenue from the cameras has been dropping drastically, and some of the contracts prohibit moving them w/o substantial fees. If it were all about safety, the municipalities should be overjoyed that the cameras did their stated purpose...and people became safer drivers. Instead...the mantra goes lets move them to make more money.

[RedEsprit]

I support most law-enforcement activities. I live in a nice house filled with lots of stuff, and the various police forces serve as an instrument that helps maintain this happy status quo. And the police are routinely occupied with much less pleasant tasks than nabbing the occasional burglar. Law enforcement often intersects with tragic and dangerous circumstances, and I have nothing but respect and appreciation for those who perform it.

Then I hear a story such as the one coming out of Redford Township, a suburb on Detroit’s northwest side. In a transparently obvious scheme to raise cash, the township has instituted a policy in which Redford police officers will receive an hour of overtime pay for every two tickets they write. For example, if an officer is working overtime and writes eight tickets in two hours, he or she gets paid for four hours of overtime at $41 per hour. Apparently, Redford Township never got the secret nationwide memo urging all governmental agencies to categorically deny any policy even hinting at ticket quotas.

Given such financial encouragement, what incentive is there for Redford police to enforce any laws other than traffic offenses? Furthermore, they are now motivated to write the easiest, most expedient tickets to maximize their personal incomes.

You can imagine this conversation in a Redford patrol car. “Say, Joe, that blue sedan has crossed the center line and nearly sideswiped a car in the last quarter-mile. He’s gotta be drunk. Let’s check it out.”

“Are you nuts!” says his partner. “The sobriety test will take forever, and if we have to haul him in for a blood test, the rest of our shift is shot. Let’s go set up a radar trap near that reduced-speed zone that starts three miles before the road construction, and we’ll write six tickets in the next hour.”

This notion of making profit centers out of law-enforcement activities is making its way across the nation. Here in Ann Arbor, we’ve watched the city council discuss the hiring of new officers based on adding revenue to the city’s coffers rather than on any increases in crime or accident rates. The only factor considered was whether the net ticket profits generated by the extra cops would exceed their cost in salary, benefits, and overhead.

Revenue enhncement...plain and simple. Its indefensible in today's economic climate.