KC selling BDRs

Rwillia4 · #1 (**permalink**) 05-07-2009, 04:40 PM

Insteresting web special: http://www.keithcraft.com/ourspecials.html

lovehamr · #2 (**permalink**) 05-20-2009, 06:54 PM

Hmmmmmmmm, one of their stroker FEs is going in BDR687.

uncltodd · #3 (**permalink**) 06-26-2009, 01:02 PM

Hmmmmmmmmmmm, KeithCraft Motorsports in Plano, TX built/installed BDR#139's powertrain in 2004.

They won't talk to me, I guess I am just dirt under their heels.

I can't even get my dyno results after almost 5 years.

Just the facts, M'am.

UT

madmaxx · #4 (**permalink**) 06-26-2009, 03:33 PM

We are cut from the same cloth. I dont ever forget either!!! Good or Bad. Keep the faith.

Quote:

Originally Posted by uncltodd

Hmmmmmmmmmmm, KeithCraft Motorsports in Plano, TX built/installed BDR#139's powertrain in 2004.

They won't talk to me, I guess I am just dirt under their heels.

I can't even get my dyno results after almost 5 years.

Just the facts, M'am.

UT

Got the Bug · #5 (**permalink**) 06-26-2009, 04:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by uncltodd

Hmmmmmmmmmmm, KeithCraft Motorsports in Plano, TX built/installed BDR#139's powertrain in 2004.

They won't talk to me, I guess I am just dirt under their heels.

I can't even get my dyno results after almost 5 years.

Just the facts, M'am.

UT

Other than wanting the dyno info, what other problems or issues did you want to discuss with Keith? Did you purchase the car from Keith or were there multiple owners?

uncltodd · #6 (**permalink**) 07-05-2009, 11:55 AM

Since piss-ant "Bug Boy's" personal info is deleted, I will post a little for the rest of us who are not ashamed of our personal profiles.

Keep in mind, this was summer, 2004, just my side, (THE BUYER!!!)

BDR #139 was delivered to KeithCraft Motorsports for installation of a drivetrain, a 351W with a Tremec TKO 500 and a billet shifter.

Built by KeithCraft MotorSports in Plano, TX, north of Dallas.

A magnificent engine, tranny combo, IMHO, BUT!!! my BackDraft dealer went tits-up (bankrupt) shortly after that.

I had powertrain issues, KCMS had issues with Victory Motorsports, I got caught in the middle.

I have been "persona non gratis" for damned near five years with KCMS and BDR.

They had their catfight, I was on the sidelines, but I got impregnated.

Waranty? WHAT warranty???

There is a certain bitterness in my brew.

With the entire BDR organization.

I can't even locate a part number for a new cap for my brake fluid reservoir.

Do I sound happy? Not.

Will anyone from BDR contact me?

Not.

Welcome to my world.

UT

427Aggie · #7 (**permalink**) 07-16-2009, 04:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by uncltodd

Since piss-ant "Bug Boy's" personal info is deleted, I will post a little for the rest of us who are not ashamed of our personal profiles.

Keep in mind, this was summer, 2004, just my side, (THE BUYER!!!)

BDR #139 was delivered to KeithCraft Motorsports for installation of a drivetrain, a 351W with a Tremec TKO 500 and a billet shifter.

Built by KeithCraft MotorSports in Plano, TX, north of Dallas.

A magnificent engine, tranny combo, IMHO, BUT!!! my BackDraft dealer went tits-up (bankrupt) shortly after that.

I had powertrain issues, KCMS had issues with Victory Motorsports, I got caught in the middle.

I have been "persona non gratis" for damned near five years with KCMS and BDR.

They had their catfight, I was on the sidelines, but I got impregnated.

Waranty? WHAT warranty???

There is a certain bitterness in my brew.

With the entire BDR organization.

I can't even locate a part number for a new cap for my brake fluid reservoir.

Do I sound happy? Not.

Will anyone from BDR contact me?

Not.

Welcome to my world.

UT

Todd,

I watched all this unfold and your beef should be with Victory..Just so you understand.

You were sold what he called a KCM motor...not true. He bought the short block from keith's shop in Dallas and installed his own heads and the cheapest alternators other items he could get his hands on. It was crap but what did you want Rob and Keith to do?? No parts were supplied by the shop they were all supplied by Boudy and he said put them on..now on your car I don't remember if they even did that part of the install.

He wasn't going to fix it for free as he didn't supply the parts or other items and Boudy didn't want to pay him. I also remember when you had it aligned and then there was an incident with the lug nuts coming off...I have to stick up for North Central on this one. You don't remove tires to align a car....Boudy LIED to alot of people...you got upset and rightfully so but what do you expect a shop that Didn't sell you the car? Didn't sell you the parts and didn't have you as the customer to do?

Victory was your problem.

Did you ever pay Keith Craft Motorsports for work directly or did it all go though Boudy and you were just told what they were doing?

Not trying to bash you but I think you need to hear the whole story that was behind alot of this and the crap that Boudy was feeding you.

DAVID GAGNARD · #8 (**permalink**) 07-16-2009, 08:34 PM

Todd:

I tried a search for the old thread regarding this and couldn't find it, but as I remember, your car had a bunch of el-cheapo parts (alternator,starter and such) supplied by your dealer (Boudy/Victory) and they failed on your car and by then Boudy/Victory was gone and you wanted KCMS to make it all good, they refused as it wasn't their parts or their motor(was a shortblock and heads Boudy brought to KCMS and had KCMS put it all togther and called it a KC engine).... I don't blame you for trying, but KCMS should never have been brought into this as it was all on your dealer.... Yes, you got screwed, but, by Boudy/Victory, not KCMS..........

I feel for you and sorry it ever happend, but you put the blame or tried to put the blame on the wrong people, plain and simple.....hindsight is always 20/20 and as time goes on, we hear more and more about Boudy/Victory and soo far, nothing good!!!!!!!!!!!

I can see KCMS not wanting to talk to you as they received some bad publicity over this that they never should have and I guess the relationship with Boudy/Victory and BDR went south in a hurry and they not knowing all what went on are hesitant to do anything either.....

All in all, you got the short end of the stick and I'm sorry it happened that way, but sometimes those things do happen...........

David

Got the Bug · #9 (**permalink**) 07-19-2009, 10:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by uncltodd

Since piss-ant "Bug Boy's" personal info is deleted, I will post a little for the rest of us who are not ashamed of our personal profiles.
UT

Just getting caught up on this thread. Not sure what UT means by this and how it relates to his dissatisfaction with his interactions with Backdraft and KC.

Sounds like a series of unfortunate events....that other CC members seem to recall in detail.

JUS BIT · #10 (**permalink**) 07-16-2009, 02:38 PM

UT, sorry for the troubles you had with your car when it was built by the previous BDR dealer in the area. His business unfortunately did not even last a year. I'm not sure of the circumstances, but they did not sell many cars. You know you can call me with your needs. The information on the Brake Master Cylinder:

Brake Master Cylinder .... made by ATE, part number 0320-1501.3.
If you have trouble finding that part number you can also try 0122-9021.3. It can also work in the car.

You will also need to note that Keith Craft Motorsports was not run by Keith Craft. He only had a very small part in the ownership. He actually does not have a vested interest in their shop anymore and they are now working under a different name. If you had an issue with the motor, they would have helped. They have always helped me with any issues that customers have had.

As for them selling Backdrafts, they are actually working with me to offer a complete package to customers. Radical Roadsters of Texas is the dealer and Keith Craft is an installer and motor builder.

If you need anything, give me a hollar. Sorry about what happened 5 years ago when you bought your car.

James

ng8264723 · #11 (**permalink**) 07-16-2009, 10:14 PM

David,
If KCMS assembled the parts as you mentioned it becomes their RESPONSIBILTY. If they just supplied the shortblock it doesn't. Which is it?

427Aggie · #12 (**permalink**) 07-17-2009, 03:47 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ng8264723

David,
If KCMS assembled the parts as you mentioned it becomes their RESPONSIBILTY. If they just supplied the shortblock it doesn't. Which is it?

I disagree. If you bring a part into a shop and give it to them they will install it but they won't warranty anything about it.

As stated above Victory supplied parts to a shop, in this case it was KCM, and had them assembled. The client dealt with Victory and Boudy and that was where the warranty came from. I remember many a conversation about the crap Boudy was doing and it was going to bite him in the ass but if your customer wants something installed, if you think it will only last 3 months or not, you can't force them to spend more and put in the parts you know will last.

Many of the cars Boudy sold were actually taken back to his shop..motors assembled from the short blocks, and then brought back to Rob when he "didn't have time to finish them" so you get cars in some sort of half ass state of build. KCM's problem was Boudy was their customer and they did what the customer asked with ample warning to him about the results...and that they didn't warranty parts they didn't supply.

Oh and I remember at least one car that left with parts on it and came back for something and amazingly they had changed to something from his part bin of cheap parts..then you really get into a problem.

DAVID GAGNARD · #13 (**permalink**) 07-17-2009, 10:08 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ng8264723

David,
If KCMS assembled the parts as you mentioned it becomes their RESPONSIBILTY. If they just supplied the shortblock it doesn't. Which is it?

As I stated, I looked for the original thread but can't find it and it had very,very pertinet (sp) info regarding Todd's/Boudy's whole cluster.........from KCMS

I'm going off my memory and this was about 5 years ago,so I could be wrong, but I seem to remember that Boudy took a short block 351-W, a pair of cylinder heads,intake,carb,starter (el-cheapo Auto Zone model), alternator (another el-cheapo Auto Zone part),and varouis other parts to KCMS and asked them to assemble the engine and then install it in the BDR he was selling to Todd. They did as instructed....with Boudy/Victory's parts....
Then he sells the car to Todd with a "Keith Craft" engine!!!!!!!!!!!!! The guys at KCMS assembled an engine from Boudy's parts and if I remember right, it may have been a remanufactered short block you can get from any auto parts store that Boudy bought and changed the camshaft in it. KCMS stated that and that the heads were nothing more than run-of-the-mill heads and the other parts supplied by Boudy were of the el-cheapo,cut rate discount variety.....

Then the starter goes out and Todd wants KCMS to make it good, it was never KCMS's starter to begin with, it was Boudy's starter, same for the alternator. By then, Boudy was long gone, leaving customers holding a empty bag, no warranty, no service, no NOTHING!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I feel for Todd, but dragging KCMS into this was wrong from the begining (IMHO)...........

About the time of the deal with Todd's car is about the time KCMS cut all ties with Boudy/Victory Motorsports......He was selling people junk and saying all along it was KCMS motors and components and when they had a problem, he told them to go see KCMS.....

It was kinda like the classic "little guy against the big corporation" thing, Boudy was hoping KCMS would fix HIS problems to avoid any bad PR and I guess KCMS got enough crap from Boudy and just said NO......

What amazed me at the time this was all being played out here, was NO ONE called out Boudy, they were saying KCMS should man up and do the right thing and fix Todd's car,free of course, long after Boudy had his money and ran!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Like I said, I'm sorry Todd got screwed over, but his anger should be directed at Boudy/Victory, not KCMS, and as we know, Boudy is no where to be found and went under with his business..............And guess what??????? BDR and KCMS are STILL in business, that alone should tell you something!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

David

Clois Harlan · #14 (**permalink**) 07-17-2009, 08:34 AM

I will say this about the parties mentioned on this thread and that is that Keith Craft and Backdraft have an extreme high degree of integrity. Keith Craft has provided guidance to me long after his work was done. He even agreed to allow me to return a part that I suggested not him and was allowed full credit toward the part he initially suggested. The same sense of integrity is true with Backdraft's Tony Martin, Reg Dodd, and James Yale. Each of these individuals have gone far beyond their required responsibility to help me and others on several occassions.

As was implied in a earlier thread , some responsibilities are not shared through association.

Clois

madmaxx · #15 (**permalink**) 07-17-2009, 03:07 PM

My BDR was close in number to uncltodd and original sold by victory out of Dallas. I was told KCM of Plano installed the engine and trans into the chassis and heard the same story about some parts being supplied by KCM and some by Victory but supposedly KCM built the entire engine, who knows. Whatever, it was a pathetic install with butt connectors used throughout and the wire harness in addition to the wire harness laying against the header melting the whole thing. Dont even get started on the half a$$ slip fit welded rigged side pipes to headers that was all BDR. Slave cylinder was anything but perpindicular to the bell housing. I had over 25 problems in 200 miles. In my opionion the whole Victory dealership /KCM of Plano was one of the biggest cluster fuks of idiots to ever hit any car market no less the replica market.

Actions speaks louder than words, now I own Superformance with a Roush purchased from a repetuble dealership Dynamic Motorsports.

JUS BIT · #16 (**permalink**) 07-19-2009, 06:59 PM

I'd like to say how sorry I am that many of you have had problems in the past with Boudy and his organization. It seems that they were not forth right on their promises and left people high and dry often.

I can tell you that Radical Roadsters of Texas, the BDR dealer in Texas, does not operate that way. Most of you here know me and we have built a great relationship together with the same passion for cars. I have tried my best to build the best BDRs and other replicas for my customers. And if they are not happy, I am more than willing to work to resolve any issues.

Also, Keith Craft has been wonderful to work with. He has come through 100% with any issues that have come up with motors or parts. Which has been at a minimum at best. They are a top notch company who works harder than most people I have seen in this industry to satisfy customers.

Let's get over this old issue and move forward sharing the fun of these great automobiles. If I can help in any way, please feel free to contact me anytime...

James

uncltodd · #17 (**permalink**) 07-20-2009, 12:14 PM

Let's settle the BDR#139 thing once and for all.

Recent posts have fed me information I did NOT have FIVE!!! F_ING YEARS ago.

Yes. profanity, censored, is in order.

I was screwed, blued, and tattooed by Victory Classic Motors via Boudy back in the summer of '04'

I did not know that then.

#139 was delivered with an engine/tranny combo from KeithCraft Motorsports in Plano, TX in August, 2004.

A magnificent combo, even though we had to bolt on a larger carburettor and rejet it.

After VCM went tits up and I had no dealer backup, you Miami guys totally ignored my requests for dealer backup, F-you.

You POS's.

This goes back YEARS.

F-you very much.

Right now, #139 sits in the garage, I am so crippled up that it hurts me just to drop in, fire her up, and romp on her a few times.

I am the Good Guy in this.

Go F-yourselves.

UT

madmaxx · #18 (**permalink**) 07-20-2009, 01:29 PM

Dont hold back on how your feel!!!! I am laughing my A$$$$ off right now.

Quote:

Originally Posted by uncltodd

Let's settle the BDR#139 thing once and for all.

Recent posts have fed me information I did NOT have FIVE!!! F_ING YEARS ago.

Yes. profanity, censored, is in order.

I was screwed, blued, and tattooed by Victory Classic Motors via Boudy back in the summer of '04'

I did not know that then.

#139 was delivered with an engine/tranny combo from KeithCraft Motorsports in Plano, TX in August, 2004.

A magnificent combo, even though we had to bolt on a larger carburettor and rejet it.

After VCM went tits up and I had no dealer backup, you Miami guys totally ignored my requests for dealer backup, F-you.

You POS's.

This goes back YEARS.

F-you very much.

Right now, #139 sits in the garage, I am so crippled up that it hurts me just to drop in, fire her up, and romp on her a few times.

I am the Good Guy in this.

Go F-yourselves.

UT

uncltodd · #19 (**permalink**) 07-21-2009, 12:20 PM

Many of my CC friends have responded to this thread, I thank you for your thoughts and compassion, but I still have a rough-edged spear-point lodged in my posterior.

Somebody buy #139, I cannot drive it anymore.

Medical.

Yeah, it is that bad.

Keithc8 · #20 (**permalink**) 07-22-2009, 11:08 PM

The way this all went down from what Rob has told me is that Keith Craft Motorsports was paid by this Boudy guy to do these cars which were pretty bad from what I remember. He paid Rob to do things the way that he wanted them done. He was a cheap as and Rob probably should have told him he did not want to do the stuff but then you get a bad name from him. You are damned if you do and damned if you don't in this business. I welcome any one that would like to get into this stuff and see how little money and how much work goes into it for the pay to jump in.
I have warned more than one person setting on the outside looking in and thinking that it is all fun to think again. You get caught up in other peoples crap and talked about when you are doing what you were paid to do by someone. Bouty just used my name to promote his product and we have all learned you better watch who you do work for.
These cars are being sold by James Yale and Keith Craft. Not any other dealer or person is touching them. James and I do it all from top to bottom and sometimes I wonder why we do this stuff because most people have no ideal how much work goes into this.
I am so sick of this kind of stuff and having my name tarnished by people that do not have all of the facts. I am ready to sell my business to any of the know it alls so that they can do it all right for everyone.
If you want to deal with honest people that make less money doing this than most all of the guys on this sight because they have a love of the cars and hobby call us. I guess I am just stupid because I do not know why I go through this stuff.
Just so everyone is clear there is no Keith Craft Motorsports anymore because I sold my share out. It is now C&S Performance and I still believe Rob will do you a good job. He is stupid as well because he works about 70 hours a week like I do.
Sorry for anyone having problems but we did not bring them on the idiot dealer you dealt with did. Sometimes when things seem to cheap they are.

Keith Craft