Another SB100 Question

[Andreas]

I checked previous threads and did my homework but still couldn't find a clear answer. I apologize for yet another SB100 question. From what I understand you go to dmv and pay your taxes and get the car in the system. Then you are required to go to the CHP, then smog and then the BAR. If I have already paid the taxes and entered the cobra into the system but have not gone to CHP, BAR or smog. Can I still get an SB100 or do I have to complete those inspections first? Once again thanks for helping the rookie out.

-thumper

[PatBuckley]

At this point you should already have been issued your SB100 number....assuming you asked for it.

[jdog]

Thumper,
What do you mean by: "Entered into the system"? Pat is right, at the point that you entered into the system you should have gotten an sb100 #.
Unless?..........................
You don't go sb100, you can go by the year of the block! Do you have an 'old' motor?

jdog

[RedBarchetta]

Thumper could have gone the "AAA" route and registered the car that way, especially if he bought a used car from out-of-state with a registration that stated a build year prior to 1974. More than likely he will end up getting a "VIN verification" notice from the DMV and he'll have to take the car to the CHP for review.

If the car is brand new, you got me on this one...not sure how he did it!

I did mine all bass-ackwards....registered (and paid full taxes) through AAA first, got the VIN verification notice, then went to CHP and they gave me a new VIN ID, then went to DMV and got my certificate before heading to BAR for the smog check.

Just follow the Kalifornia rules and it goes fairly painlessly. Just eats up time and nerves, that's all.

[pgermond]

If you built the car and it has never been registered then this site goes threw the drill, step-by-step. It is painless and it works. http://www.cobratrader.com/registrationCA.html

I could be wrong, but I believe taxes and fees paid in one year can not carried over to the next year.

[Andreas]

I went through the local dmv and entered the car into the system in June. (Built it myself and never registered) They gave me a temporary to run so that I could get to CHP and BAR and such, but to my knowledge I was not given an SB100 #. Correct me if I am wrong but isn't that what we are all going to be waiting for at the DMV in January. I have never done anything like this before but pgermond's referal website was perfect. I guess the question now is should I have an SB100 or am I waiting until January with everybody. Thank you guys for all of the responses and concern on this matter.

[Turk]

Andreas,
By June there would not have been any SB-100 numbers to give.

Your SB-100 number would be issued to you during your initial visit. As a matter of fact, you don't even have to have a car. All you need is your MSO, invoices for major components, like engine transmission etc. Then you fill out an application for the coveted SB-100 number.

You pay your taxes, fees and walk away with a SB-100 number. Then you have the rest of the year get the car finished, to make the trip to CHP for VIN assignement, and the trips to BAR for SMOG check as well as the Brake and Light Inspection.

I am afraid, since you already have a pending application for rgistration in their system, you may run into a bit of a problem. best to get that resolved before the January 2nd. and find out if you need to get in line for an SB-100 registration for your car or finish up what you already started.

Did you say your car already has a VIN number?

TURK

[Andreas]

Turk,
My cobra does not yet have a vin #. So if I had done this process correctly I would have an SB100 for 2005? If they issue SB100 #'s during the year for 2005 then why is everybody waiting in line at DMV at the begining of the year? I apologize this is probably one of those simple concepts that I just am not getting but I promise I am doing my best to figure it out. Thank you again for all of the help and info.

-thumper

[Ron61]

Andres,

Everyone is waiting in line because there are only 500 SB-100 numbers for the wole state and they will most likely be gone very quickly. When you first visit the DMV they should Reserve a number for you, then ony the CHP can issue a VIN number. After this and a visit to the smog referee to get your smog exempt sticker and if they require there, a safety check, you return to the DMV with all of this paper work and a bigger check at shich time they will issue you your permenent registration which you should receive in the mail in a few days/weeks. The CHP is the only ones that can issue or verify a VIN number for you under SB-100.

Ron

[Turk]

Ron pretty much explained the magic of why people wait in line in January. Every year, the numbers get depleted earlier than the year before.
Conventianal wisdom says, this year the 500 numbers won't make it past the month of January.

The key in your registration is the possible conflict in DMV thinking you are trying to Re-Register an existing car under SB-100.

By the time they sort that out, and tell you to register under SB-100, all the numbers for year 2005 will be gone. That would put you waiting in line in January 2006.

That is why I am suggesting you get it resolved in the next few days, so you may have a clean slate when January 2nd. rolls around.

Not much time.

TURK

[SCOBRAC]

Yes, you are correct. SB-100 is only a means by which you become exempt from bi-annual smog tests. It is not the registration process. No fees are collected, no titles are issued no VINS are processed. There are 500 allocated each year and when they are gone they are gone. Last year they lasted 40 days.

It can (now) be done at any time spcns numbers are available. The first 2 years of the program the process applied only to new registrations. In 2003 that changed to include all specially constructed vehicles whether they had been registered or not.

It is not the only process by which to be legal here. It seems to be the best. I will admit I was relectant to be put on a list of what are essentially considered gross polluters in this state. I take some comfort in knowing the present govenor is perhaps the biggest gross polluter we have ever had with a 58 ring Cohiba in one hand and the Hummers steering wheel in the other.

The other process involves using the year of the engine and or the year of the chassis. In our cases, with modern chassis it would be the year of the engine. In that scenario you use the year of the engine block to determine the smog devices required.

As a result early replicas focused on using 1960's engines. If you were able to use a 1966 engine you were only required to have 1966 smog controls and so on... A 1978 engine needed 1978 smog controls, etc.

The drawback under the old system was regardless what year engine you chose you were required to have smog checks every 2 years for at least 30 years. I believe that has changed or may change in the future. Presently cars before 1974 are smog exempt, cars after 1974 are not and may never be. Someone correct me if that is now different. It was a 30 year sliding scale.

In my case (pre SB-100) my Contemporary would have become exempt in 2018. But until then I would need smog checks on a dyno ever two years. (again that may have changed)

Relax. Have fun bring a book. The good news is the DMV's are now use to the system and the law. In 2003 it was a new system. I got the 7th spcns number issued under the new law. You can only imagine how much fun I had.

[Andreas]

Okay I think I got it now. I did not ask for the SB100 number and I don't think that I recieved one from the DMV. Turk I'm taking your advice and I made an appointment for tomorrow for the
DMV to obtain the SB100 #. Also weather permiting I made an appointment with CHP for the Vin assignment for tomorrow also. Hopefully i can use all of this info and get the cobra registered properly this year. Thanks again guys and I let you know how it goes.

[Turk]

Michael,
However it DOES start the registration process for a car that has no VIN mumber. A car just recently completed.

As a matter of fact, you DO pay your sales taxes as you are given the piece of paper to take it to the CHP to have the VIN number installed. You then go to the BAR for the smog exempt portion of the registration, only to end up back at the DMV with all items checked to get your registration and plates, and the title.
Up to that point you have nothing more than an MSO.

Wht exactly do you mean, SB-100 is not a registration process?
It is indeed The registration process to have a car that does not have to comply with smog requirements...

Can you take a previously registered car to DMV and ask to have it re-registered so you won't have to worry about the smog?

TURK

[SCOBRAC]

Thanks Turk. That's good to know. I'm sure you are speaking from (vast) personal experience. It seems like it should, but you know our state. It seems firing the DMV drector has made a diference.

When I say the SB-100 is not the registration process it can be done before or after the car is initially registered. It isn't required as a part of the process to register the car. The process requires no fees be collected and there is no cost to do the smog inspection at the BAR. It simply ammends the law to exempt cars from the smog inspection process. You may still register a specially constructed vehicle with or without an spcns number.

[Ron61]

Turk & Michael,

One thing we didn't address is SB-1578 which also uses the same 500 numbers. That is to allow previously registered cars from out of state or for an owner to apply for a different model year determination in a subsequent calendar year subject to the 500-vehicle annual limit. This is what they used when they reserved the 100 numbers last year for people whose titles had been pulled. The rest of the process is the same as for a new vehicle, but with so many trying to get their titles back, the 500 numbers becomes a very small amount.

Michael,

The bill to repeal the 30 year roll back from extending each year was repealed last year. Now we are stuck with 1974 and earlier period. A question. If you have a 1964 engine in your car and registered it by that, what kind of emissions testing could they do as there were none then? What happenes every 2 years when you had to have a smog check, as they would have no smog limits for a pre 1966 engine, and if it is registered by the engine year that is what they should have to test for, not the year of the frame if I understood you correctly. If you had a 1964 block for example, just what did they do when you had to have the smog test as there were no 1964 smog regulations.

Ron

[SCOBRAC]

Ron,

Yes. 1578 was actually an ammendment to the ammendment, the original SB-100. It allowed previously registered cars to be exempted in the same way new cars were. But still using the same 500 slots originally created under SB-100.

I really have no information about the cars who's titles were pulled. It seems like they should be allowed to proceed with their original number, but that would be too logical.

The specially constructed vehicles registered before 2001-2002 were and are still under the old rules are required to get a smog check regardless of equipment allowed.

That process requires the owner to present the car to the BAR and verify the year of the engine or chassis, and verify that the smog controls for that year of manfacture are present. The owner may select which year to use as a basis for future inspections. An example being a 1940 ford built on a 1940 frame would be completely exempt even if every other component was new.

You are right. A 1964 anything had no emissions equipment. My Contemporary for instance had a 1966 428 in it when I bought it. I was required to do an initial smog upon purchase as all used cars are in California and I was required to do a bi-annual test at the point the registration was due and would have continued that way, forever it seems as my car was built in 1988.

In 1966 the only smog for a pasenger car was a PCV valve, light trucks had no smog. A 1966 427 similarly had no smog devices. When my car was first inspected in 1988 it was determined a PCV valve was required. When I smogged it the PCV valve had to be there. If the engine had been a 1970 it would have required a termoactor injection (into the heads) and a EGR valve. I think catalytic converters became a standard in 1973 or 1974. In any case if you opted for that year's equipment that equipment must have been present at the bi-annual inspection. Now obviously the system was rife with fraud.

There are emissions specifications from as early as 1966 here in California but they are so broad any car running on most of it's cylinders can pass. The requirements got much more strict as the years went on.

[Ron61]

Michael,

I knew that they had some smog requirements in 1966 but as you said, any car running on all cylinders would pass. As for the SB-1578, they did reserve 100 of the 500 numbers last year just for people with pulled titles. We had a guy here with a Factory 5 that got caught in that. He went in, got one of the reserved 100 numbers and then proceded much the same as if it had been a new car except he had to pay more as he had to pay taxes on the value of the car and not what it had been declared being worth. His fault there. He had originally registered it as a 1966 but changed that to a 1964 to make sure he got rid of any smog. Most around here use 1965 and go by the body style. That was why I was asking you just what your car had to meet as I thought you had an older engine in it. But you had to meet the 1966 standard which as you said wasn't really difficult. Also SB-1578 was to allow people that purchased cars from out of state that were titled in other states to become legal in this republic as they won't recognize a lot of then other states titles.

Ron

[SCOBRAC]

Yes my side oiler is a 1966. Under SB-100 the BAR is suppose to establsh a year of reference. Either the year the specially constructed vehicle represents, or the year of the engine... Example a 1966 Cobra could have 1966 on the BAR decal because it looks like a 1966 Cobra, or a 1940 Ford, etc. or the year the engine was made. The exception to that is that if you have a car that is completely unique, one-off, there is a default year of 1960. Cars that look like they are a 1964 car (or whatever) can have any mechanical equipment they like. I brought my 1966 side oiler in with a PCV valve (just to be safe) and my BAR decal indicates it is suppose to have a PCV valve.

I'm not sure what happes if you bring in a 1980 Chrysler Cordova Replica. (it could happen) I guess you'd need 1980 smog parts. (but then a good replica would have those wouldn't it).

This is not the year the car is titled as, merely a reference for future changes to the law and what if anything the car must have for emissions equipment. What can I say, big daddy can giveth big daddy can taketh away.

I say the BAR is suppose to establish the year of the cars equipment. It doesn't always work that way. In my case I waited until the dust settled in 2003 to take my car to the BAR. After being #7 registered under the new system in 2003 (spcns #2003-007) I wanted to be sure the BAR had it's $hit together so I went for my "initial" inspection in October.

It went pretty smoothly the guys were polite well informed (it seemed). They took the car in to be tested (sniffer test) and came back 20 min. later with a sticker. I was instructed to affix it to the car in a permanent location. I did as I was told.

It was only when I got home I noticed the sticker read:

Spcns #2003-007
Displacement 7 liters
Make Ferrari
Year 1960

I'm not kidding.

The part that troubles me isn't that we have a bureacratic nightmare to conform to. The part that troubles me is our laws have become so complex the people who are suppose to keep us informed are completely unprepared to do so.

The thing that happened with 1578 is it allows cars that were previously registered (california as well as other states) to be registered. SB-100 originally applied to new, first time registrations. The irony in that is the guy who wrote the law, Maurice Johannesen was a Lone Star owner and his car didn't qualify under SB-100 the way it was originally interpreted by the State Legislative Analyist. 1578 corrected this to allow all specially constructed vehicles to be registered, or in his case (and my case) re-registered under the new program.

I went into the DMV on Jan 2, 2003 knowing I was one of the first and fortunately I brought about 50 pages of printed material from the state legislative summary including the law, to the page from the DMV website to the leglislators contact information that sponsored the bill (that kind of shook them up, I never said I was going to call his office, but the cell phone in my hand and his phone number seemed to imply that was step #2)

But that was two years ago. I'm sure it will be a smooth ride.

[Ron61]

Our DMV is getting better as they learn. Being a small place it took a couple of years to get them to even look at the Memo that were issued. I looked at one of the guy's registration slips last year and it said 2004 1965 Cobra Replica on it. The BAR guy spent several minutes telling him what a nice car it was and then did the snifer test. He said the BAR man then put the sticker on it and that has his 2004-SPCN number on it plus smog exempt. And you are right that the BAR does establish what if any smog equipment is required. As for the 1980 example, then you would go by the engine year and get an old engine. As the bill states, the choice of which to go by is the owners and not the DMV or BAR. Default for both body and engine is 1960 which is even better. And Maurice lives not to far from me and I have talked to hom many times about the laws, even back before he could get SB-100 passed with the 500 limit. He got around this mess with his Lone Star by pretending to be a dealer and he drove it for a long time with dealer plates.
By the way, that is a cheap way of getting a Ferrari. I would never have guessed from looking at your pictures.

Ron

[Andreas]

I went to the DMV today and they told me that we would all waiting in line on the third of January for an SB100 #. I was also told that I would not have had a number assigned or reserved when I first entered the car into the system as they are only assigned starting from the 1st of January until they run out. The car at this point has not been to CHP or BAR or smog, but Turk you are correct in saying that this is not even required. I double checked everything and from what I understand everything should go fairly well on Monday.

For what it's worth the gentleman also told me that he was going to process a couple of us at a time. Getting through to Sacramento can be fairly difficult with 16_? DMV's in california calling the same place at the same time. By blocking us together he can process more applications faster. Last year he explained it as being a 1 to 2 hour process so good luck and maybe I'll see a couple of you down there.