Bent balancer?

cobragene · #1 (**permalink**) 06-18-2022, 09:27 AM

My 428 OEM 7” balancer has a wobble at first I just assumed it was the pulley then I thought we’ll I have to make sure, pulled the pulley to check balancer and it is .010 out laterally and about.05 Out radially, put the pulley back on and it’s out about.060 laterally so I know to change pulley but is the balancer too far out? I am thinking I shouldn’t take the chance. What is a good balancer the the street?

incoming · #2 (**permalink**) 06-19-2022, 07:41 AM

Dorman.

CHANMADD · #3 (**permalink**) 06-19-2022, 04:10 PM

Get a new balancer right away.

undy · #4 (**permalink**) 06-20-2022, 07:08 AM

You balancer is not "bent". The center rubber vibration isolator has separated. As Chanmadd said, replace it RTFN.

patrickt · #5 (**permalink**) 06-20-2022, 07:26 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by undy

...As Chanmadd said, replace it RTFN.

Or you can wait for this to happen. I replaced mine with a beautiful ROMAC balancer. You can't miss it when it goes though. It sounds like someone is ringing a loud bell under your hood.

cobragene · #6 (**permalink**) 06-20-2022, 08:49 AM

Wow guys I’ll get right on it. The Dorman is rather inexpensive will it hold up and do it’s job? I don’t want to be penny wise and dollar foolish. Thank you all

patrickt · #7 (**permalink**) 06-20-2022, 09:02 AM

I would think that any decent new balancer will last a lifetime if you're not revving it all that hard. If you are, then I'd spend the money on something that is a little more towards the performance end of the spectrum. I think I spent about $300 on my ROMAC. Aluminum hub, steel outer ring.

blykins · #8 (**permalink**) 06-20-2022, 10:19 AM

Powerbond PB1111N or Powerbond PB1111ST. Either one will be fine for you.

cobragene · #9 (**permalink**) 06-20-2022, 10:25 AM

I didn’t realize when I ordered the pump that it is a supercool which flows 30% more. I want to get the CVF aluminum pulleys but there V belt system has a 5.4 crank and 6.2 pump pulleys, there beast serpentine belt system which looks really beefy is a 1-1 but it is pricey. Also have an OEM alternator 40 or 50 amp, which it would slow down also? My loads are puller fan, headlights, heater, fuel pump.

cobragene · #10 (**permalink**) 06-20-2022, 10:32 AM

I have heard to stay away from fluid dampers, is this correct? About 6 months age eBay had a powerbond PB111 either n or st it was the better of the two for $130 new. Now they are over $250. Wow

davids2toys · #11 (**permalink**) 10-28-2022, 09:35 AM

I am in the same boat. I am putting my car back on the road after 2 years due to health issues. Years ago I put a "whiteout" stripe along the back of the dampener as an indicator of movement. I pretty much checked it every time I went under the car. Well I just checked it and my inner ring is not matching the outer ring and rubber by about 3/16". I am thinking I definitely need a new one!I have a 428. I am reading things about internal and external balancing, 428 dampeners needing modifications to make the fit. I want a bolt on and something a little high performance. I already have an aluminum flywheel and I am assuming my present dampener is all steel. I am returning home in 2 days and I will check it with a magnet.I think I read the Romac, ATI, and FluidDamper need mods for a 428. Also heard to stay away from the FluidDamper.
I was just researching the Powerbond as Brent suggested. On Summit they seen to be reasonably priced, even the race model, PB1111SS is only 246.00. Summit wont filter to a 428, just 360 and 390. I have heard those 2 motors have a different requirement than a 428? If they will work on the 428 I think I would get the ST street high performance for 169.00 or the SS Race for 246.00. Brent did not mention this one however. Looking for some solid bolt on recommendations and why. Thanks...Dave

patrickt · #12 (**permalink**) 10-28-2022, 09:50 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by davids2toys

I have heard those 2 motors have a different requirement than a 428? If they will work on the 428 I think I would get the ST street high performance for 169.00 or the SS Race for 246.00. Brent did not mention this one however. Looking for some solid bolt on recommendations and why. Thanks...Dave

Brent L. can answer definitively, but it was always my understanding that all FE balancers will swap out with one another. Early balancers are smaller and lighter than the later ones but they will all fit if you use the right pulley. Balancing is not an issue so don't think about that. Now, when I swapped my ROMAC in for the POS balancer that fell apart my timing marks were about 7 degrees different. I've read that this is a common problem known throughout the industry but that no one really gives a crap about it so it never gets fixed.

davids2toys · #13 (**permalink**) 10-28-2022, 02:11 PM

Wow Patrick, 7 degrees seems like quite a lot. I was reading that some are externally balanced and some internally or no weights depending on what engine it is being used in. Also some pulley and crankshaft sleeve fitment issues.I guess a lot of these dampeners are for BBC and need to be modified in different ways to be used on a FE 428
Not really sure about any of this.
My pulley is 3 bolt, single groove and about 7" dia. My dampener is about 7" in dia and 1" thick.
Look forward to Brent chiming in here

patrickt · #14 (**permalink**) 10-28-2022, 02:38 PM

Yes, it does seem like a lot. See this thread:
https://www.fordfe.com/ati-question-...ti-t90865.html

blykins · #15 (**permalink**) 10-28-2022, 02:42 PM

All FE balancers are 0 balance.

The only aftermarket FE balancer I've seen out 7° is an ATI. All others are usually right in there within .5-1 degrees.

davids2toys · #16 (**permalink**) 10-29-2022, 05:33 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by blykins

Powerbond PB1111N or Powerbond PB1111ST. Either one will be fine for you.

Brent, I like the sound of the PB1111ST. Summit says applicable for FE 360 and 390 for both numbers you suggested. I found them on another site and it said the PB1111N was good for all FE sizes and I would assume the PB1111ST would follow the pb1111N for application. Will my pulley bolt right up? Will I have to do any modification to the spacer?
Also, what is your opinion of the PB1111SS all steel race model?Sounds really good.

davids2toys · #17 (**permalink**) 10-29-2022, 05:36 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by patrickt

Brent L. can answer definitively, but it was always my understanding that all FE balancers will swap out with one another. Early balancers are smaller and lighter than the later ones but they will all fit if you use the right pulley. Balancing is not an issue so don't think about that. Now, when I swapped my ROMAC in for the POS balancer that fell apart my timing marks were about 7 degrees different. I've read that this is a common problem known throughout the industry but that no one really gives a crap about it so it never gets fixed.

LOL, I thought your timing marks were 7 deg out on your old one(as a measurement of movement) when I replied. I did not understand you were talking about the replacement, That is crazy!!!

patrickt · #18 (**permalink**) 10-29-2022, 05:52 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by davids2toys

LOL, I thought your timing marks were 7 deg out on your old one(as a measurement of movement) when I replied. I did not understand you were talking about the replacement, That is crazy!!!

I didn't write as clearly as I should have. The difference between that POS brand that broke, and my shiny new ROMAC, was seven degrees. But I think any time you put a new balancer on you have to check the timing marks. That's just basic shade-tree mechanics. What I ended up doing with the ROMAC, that comes without degree marks, is to put white paint lines at 0, 10, 20, and 30 degrees BTDC and a nice pretty easy-to-see red line at 35 degrees BTDC. I also put an identical red line on the timing pointer. So when I check my timing I look to see if the two red lines align when I'm at 3500 RPM, as that's my all in timing. My timing actually comes in before 3000 RPM, but one of the smart FE engine experts (maybe Barry, or Brent, or Joe L., or Keith C., I can't remember) told me that MSD distributors can actually "bounce" a degree or two between 3000 and 3500 so it's important to check it at 3500 RPM even if you're all in earlier than that. So, that's what I do. Remember, I don't do this for a livin', it's just my hobby, so I have to listen to the guys that really know what they're doing.

blykins · #19 (**permalink**) 10-29-2022, 07:12 AM

David,

The N or the ST is more than ample for your application. I've had the ST version at 650 hp and 7500 rpm. Everything will bolt up.

davids2toys · #20 (**permalink**) 10-30-2022, 09:38 PM

OK Brent, then the ST will be what I go with. I am online looking for the dimensions and I found this at https://www.finditparts.com/products...dayco-pb1111st
I am concerned about the width (thickness). Mine is about 1' thick. I am reading this one is at least 1.578" art its smallest point and 1.780" at its largest. Is this possible? Won't the extra thickness affect my fan belt alignment and crank bolt length needs?
Overall Outside Diameter 6.977 in
Overall Outside Diameter 177.20 mm
Overall Width 1.780 in
Overall Width 45.20 mm
Ring Width 1.578 in
Ring Width 40.08 mm



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