427 side oiler ?

[FUNFER2]

Hey guys, need some advise on 427 side oilers. I have a 428 in my cobra now, very happy with it but.......I have a chance to buy a a side oiler. It is only the block & bottom end, stock crank, 7 pistons & rods. A guy put it together, waited a year to fire it up & I don't know the details but, it must have broke a rod & or, a piston ? That cylinder needs to be re-sleaved. I dont have any details on the motor yet, but will soon. I need advise on price "as is" if the block & ect. are in good shape, the apx. price of a build-up & parts, for around 500-600 H.P & torque, on pump gas. I'm running 10-1 compression in my 428 on pump gas. I drive on the highway a lot so I do want "respectble"......gas milage. I built the 428 to be the best of both worlds, good performance & driveability. I do like the RADICAL....sound of a cam & compression. I help on a sprint car & if is was do-able, I'de put one in. hehe! I will either keep my 428 for parts for the 427 or sell it for money for the build- up ?????? BIG question.....please explain the "side oiler" for me ! Pro's & con's of it, have to run a dry sump & how the system works, what heads, intake, carb/carbs, ect...ect... I don't have thousands of $$$ left after building the car so, moneys tight. Please give me your ideas ! ( I'll try to get more details & numbers on the block soon )
Thanks,
Kev

[FUNFER2]

Forgot to tell you the price !.....$ 300.00
Kev

[rritchey]

Kevin,
If you can buy ANY part of a sideoiler shortblock for $300 you better not let it get away. Even if all you get out of it is 7 good rods you still got your money's worth. The block could have any number of problems, it could have spit out that one rod and knocked a hole in the side. That's not good, but usually can be fixed. If it just needs one sleeve, you actually found a pretty good block, the vast majority of side-oilers running around have at least one sleeve. If the crank is not hurt it is worth way more than $300. Find out more about it and let us know so we can all be jealous of you if you found such a good deal.

[bmalone]

Side-olier oils all the mains first. Unlike the top-oiler, which gets the first main and then up to the top-end and then back down to the rest of the mains.

Does it make any difference?--no real proof to indicate one system is better than the other. Is the SO worth more--yes.

Oh yeah, I'd buy it.

[427 S/O]

$300.00 side oiler!!!!, I would investigate this in great detail. Hard to imagine this guy doesn't know what he has unless, it's totally trashed.

[FUNFER2]

Is there anything on the outside of the block that's different than the 428 ? Will my 428 bellhousing & tremeck tranny work ? I think that the 390, 428 & 427 are the same but, I want to find out for sure. I red somewhere that there are ribs of some sort on the outside of the block ? Are the heads different ? Do you have to run a dry sump ?(guessing not) Other than the oiling part of the side oiler, is that all that makes them special, ect......? Sorry so many questions but, untill I can read a book on them, I need to learn fast before he sells it to someone else. Please give all you know my friends !
Thanks guys,
Kev

[Mark IV]

...all of the 428 exterior stuff will bolt right up to the 427. It is very difficult to identify a 427 from a 428 or a 352 by exterior only. In fact 390s have "352" cast on the left front of the block.

For $300.00 it would make a good boat anchor if there is nothing usable in the engine! Paint it up and put it on an engine stand and brag "yeah, I've got htis 427 ready to go into my car but I just don't have the time..." and P.O. all the wannabees..

Rick

[FUNFER2]

hehehe! that's funny Rick...... P.O the wanna bees. For bragging rights ! A lot of people want these motors just for that reason alone. Hopefully, it's a great find. Question, how much on average would this blk. , rods & pistons go for ?
Kev

[A Snake]

It's no trick to identify a side oiler block. Just look for the "hump" in the driver's side of the block. That's the oiling passage that makes it a side oiler. Also all 427 blocks S/O or not, have crossbolt main bearing caps with the "crossbolts" (center 3 caps only) going through the block just above the oil pan rails.

Now, that said, there have been some 390-406-428 engines "converted" to crossbolt mains by owners, not by Ford. There have even been some fakes made, though for what reason I can't fathom.

If the engine is sans heads, measure the bore. Stock 427 is 4.23".

If I were you FUNFER, I'd do some quick inspection. If the block is not obviously broken, I'd pay the man his $300, load the parts and run like hell before he changes his mind!

Al

[Nantucket427]

If it is to good to be true???? you know what they say---

[Daniel Jones]

> If it is to good to be true???? you know what they say---

Usually but not Always. About a year and half ago, I came up with two 427
side-oiler strokers for $1200. The engines were built by a local Ford
engine guru for his personal puller truck. The big one was the primary
engine and had a custom 4.25" stroke crank (for 486 cubes) with LeMans
rods and the small one (a 454 FE using a 428 SCJ crank and rods) was the
backup motor. The builder/owner was only 32 years old and unmarried when
he died suddenly. His mother inherited his possesions and gave the engines
to a friend of my dad's who told me about them. I took my books up so we
could identify them and found that he had them sitting outside by the side
of his shop with a tarp over top. He had pulled the heads and intake off
one and filled it with ATF but the other actually had water in it. Since
it was forecast to drop below freezing that night, I told Dean we had to
get them inside. He replied to me that he wasn't going to do anything with
them and that I should make him an offer and take them home. I told him
they were worth a fair bit of money and pointed out that each of the intakes
was worth $300 and the Dove rockershaft system was worth $600. His response
was "Sold!". I had them in my dad's garage that night. One actually had
ice in its 10 quart flat bottom oil pan but both turned out to look like
new inside. I haven't had either magnafluxed yet but the bores (0.030"
over but no sleeves or damage) were perfect and the roller timing chains
looked new. Plus, not a bit of oil sludge, carbon, or fuel deposits were
anywhere to be found. It appears the engines were recently rebuilt. Both
have domed pistons, so I'll need to buy custom pistons to get the compression
down to something that will run on pump gas but I think there's room in the
budget for that.

Dan Jones

[FUNFER2]

Wow Dan, quite the story, sounds like the FE gods were looking after you ! Hopefully, I'll get a good deal also ? I called him yesterday, (he's a trucker) he had just left to California, so I was not able to see the block......bummer ! Hopefully this weekend. When I'm able to get the numbers off the block, can you, or anyone else here, check them out in your book to make sure it's a good one, what year it is & what it was probably in ?
I'de sure appreciate it guys !
Thanks,
Kev

[mr0077]

Kevin, check out this site for the casting numbers and how to read them...let us know what you find!
http://www.pacificnet.net/~fastoso/castingcode.html

[FUNFER2]

That makes life a lot eaiser ! As soon as I get them I'll let you all know.
Thanks Ken

[FUNFER2]

Hey guys, bad news for me. The man doesent have the engine....just blowing smoke ! I can't believe people like this ? I called him Sat. after we were done at the sprint car races, he said it was a mis-understanding that I could buy it because he wants to build a cobra for himself. This morning, his son said he does not have the engine at all ! My friend said the father can't be trusted at all, his son is a good guy though. Oh well...... maybe someday I'll find a good deal on a block ?
Thanks,
Kev

[Great Asp]

Dan,

I did not know you still read this forum!

How's the Pantera doing?

Eric

[Daniel Jones]

I still browse the forum on occasion. With work and travel, I've
not had the Pantera out yet this year. It needs a water pump and
the valves adjusted to get it back on the road. It's needed a water
pump for quite a while but I had been trying to nurse it along until
the new engine goes together but I've been dragging my feet on that.
I did get a good deal on a slightly used Fontana aluminum block to
go along with the aluminum high port heads. Cubes should be simiar
to what you have, though with a slightly shorter stroke and bigger
bore. The engine should come in at 405 lbs or so (aluminum block,
heads, intake, water pump and flywheel, mini-starter). Not too bad
for 410 to 420 cubes.

I'm calling tomorrow to see if I can get the heads on a flow bench.
With that info, I'll be able to spec out a cam. I have to go out
of town next week but as soon as I'm back, I plan to haul the parts
down to Dave for the build. I still have to order the crank and
pistons but I want Dave to do that once he's checked everything.

Did your email change? I tried to contact you a few weeks back.
Kris, the guy with the 428CJ Mid States replica is interested in
seeing you Cobra. In other news, one of the latest hail storms
got the daily driver Mustang.

Dan Jones