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should I sleeve it?
In my quest for the ever elusive side oiler block I found one, a '65 that has passed all the tests, a except for one thing, it's bored out to .060. I have heard a ton of opinions on bore size, varying from no problem they used to go sixty over and race 'em all day with that bore, to going over thirty puts you into the waterjackets.
I need the voice of expereince on this one, would love to hear from any and all. Thanks, Mark :confused: |
Mark,
I know the 428 and 427 blocks are totally different animals but her is my experience from two years ago. I had a 428 bored .060 that I bought as a completed running engine. I paid $4400.00 for it and I assumed it was built the way it was described to me. First mistake. But the engine always ran hot even in 70 degree weather. If I sat at a stop light more than a minute my temp gauge was pushing 220 and sometime 230 degrees. In defense of the engine, the builder had used various parts, two different types of pistons (part were skirted some not) and rods, tolerance were not accurate, and the engine had not been balanced. The bottom line was I had been screwed, blued and tattooed. My advise on the sleves call or send George Anderson an email and he will give you honest and sound advise. He knows his stuff very well. http://www.gessford.com/ Good luck, Clois |
I would have the block sonic mapped, then decide.
If the walls are too thin you may even want to go with 8 sleeves and bring it back to standard bore. Nothing wrong with that at all, assuming the person installing the sleeves isn't the same guy who did Clois' old engine. George (Gessford Machine)s ure does a nice job installing sleeves. |
You might............
consider comparing the cost of sleeving to just buying one of the new Genesis 427 S.O. blocks. Just a thought.
:3DSMILE: :3DSMILE: :3DSMILE: |
There is absolutely nothing wrong with sleeving a block. If you have a good block that has not been blown up or windowed and passes mag test, I would not hesitate to put in 8 sleeves and run the heck out of it. It will be stronger than before and the sleeves will be better material than was in the bores to start with. Be sure to let a good shop install the sleeves..... properly installed sleeves will serve flawlessly, poorly installed sleeves will forever cause problems. Put in BBC 4.25" bore sleeves so you can have good choice of pistons / rings. If you end up not using the block, please let me know.
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I'd go with 8. It isn't that much more to do. Plus you can claim it's a standard bore 427 and show us all the piston box to prove it. (don't forget to delete this post and destroy the evidence).
Seriously, I think if done properly sleeves are a good way to go as long as the price is right. |
I'd do the sonic check first.....I've done 4.275" bores without sleeves....but I would rather put 8 in and make it 4.250 as suggested above....and do it with a thin wall sleeve.
George my 427 has 8 sleeves since 1994....and I still Red Light...just ask Rick Lake...the sleeves didn't help me race better...but the motor runs fine...have a good shop install and use liquid nitrogen. |
Lineslinger Mark I would go with the 8 sleeves. As long as the machining is done correct. Thin wall sleeves work great and you can not see them when done. Old Red has beat that red car for he last 8 years at the Run&Gun. The car as not broken once. He does 10-15 runs for the bracket racing, This motor just keeps running, on the other hand I have also seen some of the otherengine builders motor generade all over the place. George's car get 3 days of hard running. Pete Tork who runs that other line of motor also never breaks:CRY: I could have won last year bracket Pete.:eek: ;) :D I run a motor with 8 sleeves now. The shelby motor has them. Any other questions?:confused: %/ Rick Lake
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I'm gonna sleeve it. Thank you for the advice and observations gentlemen
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Lineslinger Mark that's great. you have 2 months to get it done. Run&Gun is on SEPT 21-24 at Gateway. Want to see the car. :eek: Get going. If you go with george, tell Him to move his A$$, he hates motors he builds that beat him at this event.;) :D :LOL: :LOL: :LOL: , Right George. Rick Lake
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Is the sleeve put into the liquid Nitrogen and then inserted into the bore, allowing it to expand after insertion?(this is starting to sound like something my wife might like to read). Just curious as I haven't seen this process before.
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some picture links...
Bore block for sleeves after sleeves installed freezing a sleeve installing quickly |
liquid nitrogen
Fascinating stuff, thank you George. That process looks like "handle with extreme care" is just a simple pair of leather gloves all you wear when working with that material?
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The Nitrogen is kept in a DOT approved container and we pour it into the size of container that fits the sleeve size...you should see the tall one we have for the 17" long x 8.250 diameter sleeve work we do...it's also good for a quick bag of ice in a plastic zip-lock late in the day...hahahha
Safety glasses too...but all you need is a simple pair of leather gloves....and of course a pair of pliers to pull it from the container when it's ready....the sleeve bubbles until it's down to the zub-zero temp required...when it quits making bubbles...we pull it and install quickly......the sequence is important too...you don't install right down the line etc....everyone has a secret or special way they do this process.....we've been using Nitrogen since about 1993....for every type of sleeve we install except most flanged ones.... G |
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