UN and Gun Rights

[Tom Kirkham]

NRA video on the UN and Gun laws:

[sllib]

What a shame they didn't take down the UN building instead of the twin towers.

[SP01715]

F*** the U.N...

[392cobra]

A vintage Warren Poster...

[Anthony]

Somehow I think firearm topics are meant for a different site.

Tom, are you trying to stir the pot?

[Buzz]

People posting and representing this nonsense as a current domestic issue are pushing their own agendas and insulting your intelligence. All of the information, documents and even the officials shown in that video are from 2001 - 2004. The proposed treaty in question deals with regulation of the international firearms trade particularly to regions of conflict and oppressive regimes - nothing to do with US domestic firearms policies. Here's a link to the treaty's summary: http://www.un.org/disarmament/convar...html/ATT.shtml

The UN has always been a platform for people lobbying on behalf of everything from whaling to banning fur coats to the plight of cane toad in Australia. Nothing new here.

The UN CANNOT take away your constitutional RKBA. No US president - even the furthest left leaning - would be foolish enough to try to revoke 2A rights. Focus inwards on intelligent discourse countering the wide-eyed ranting of the Brady Bunch and their supporters to keep firearm ownership by law abiding citizens in a positive light.

Wide-eyed alarmism like the BS presented here by pied pipers masquerading as your friends is just as detrimental to the RKBA as the anti-gun propoganda spouted by the Brady bunch and their followers in that it plays up to the stereotype of pro-gun activists being a bunch of whacked out idiots. People that rally support by playing on fears and deep emotions have their own agendas and care little about you or your rights.

What business is this of mine - a foreigner who doesn't live in the US? A lot actually, because the upholding of the American belief in the rights of citizens to defend themselves and their families is one powerful, shining beacon to free societies around the world of the reality that weakening the the law abiding citizen serves only to strengthen and embolden the criminals and enemies of freedom. If the US RKBA is ever lost, it would pave the way for tyrannical disarmament of citizens around the world.

The most powerful weapon in the arsenal of those who believe in the RKBA is the vote. Keep the intelligent discourse open and ensure that it remains clear to all political leaders and aspiring political leaders that tampering with the 2A is political suicide.

People who use BS to trump up non-issues and promote irrational emotionalism and fear mongering about the issue to enhance their own popularity should be given the heave-ho as well.

[Ronbo]

Buzz, let me throw a twist your way...

So what was the UN's stance when England and Australia stripped the the right of their citizens to own firearms???

Fact of the matter is the UN never has, or will attempt to adopt a policy of pressuring it's members to ensure it's citizen's freedom to defend themselves.

The UN should have died with the Warsaw pact, they are a shining example of non-represenative government.

[427sharpe]

Thanks Tom...reminded me to renew my NRA membership!
Now read the first paragraph on IANSA page about rape in Africa, lamenting how roving military bands use firearms to rape and plunder...all the while trying to get citizens to give up 2A rights! Imbeciles.

[Buzz]

It's not really a twist, Ronbo - we agree that the UN is little more now than a huge special interest lobby and their stance on most issues runs mostly against the grain of the model of a free western-style democracy.

What I am against is the dishonest strategy of whipping peoples' emotions into a frenzy by misrepresenting and blowing a non-issue way out of context. The proposed treaty that was referenced in the OP is not targeted at private ownership of firearms in the US. Representing it as such is just plain lying in order to gain popularity by pandering to people's knee jerk reactions to an emotionally charged issue.

The UN as it functions today is a waste of time, but they are not coming to take your guns! That can only happen from within if intelligent people remain silent and complacent and allow the loudmouth rabble rousers and snake oil salesmen on both sides of the aisle to manipulate the sentiments of concerned citizens in a self-serving bid for power and influence. Beware the pied pipers.

[LoBelly]

Originally Posted by Ronbo

Buzz, let me throw a twist your way...

So what was the UN's stance when England and Australia stripped the the right of their citizens to own firearms???

....

.

Point of order -

Most states in Australia have aligned the gun ownership laws
Basically - you have to be licensed to own a gun
The minimum age is 12 (where I live)

I think that Ronbo is basically proving Buzz's point here:

The NRA (& others) have been waging a fear campain based on untrue statements secure in the knowledge that they're unlikely to be called on it.

The following sites have reasonable summaries of the rules - no doubt many of you in the US would identify the serious limitations imposed.

http://www.rurallaw.org.au/handbook/....php#Ch15Se925
http://www.police.vic.gov.au/content...ocument_ID=219
http://ssaavic.com.au/ssaa.php?id=6&

As a society Australians can change these laws if they like by electing officials that will alter the rules - they are almost always on the ballot paper - few (none) get up.

Also - to support what Tom said - this is basically the only place where I hear from a broad(er) cross section of the US so its very informative to me and I appreciate being able to have these discussions and understand the divergent views.

.... back to your regular programming ....


LoBelly

[Ronbo]

Originally Posted by LoBelly

Point of order -

Most states in Australia have aligned the gun ownership laws
Basically - you have to be licensed to own a gun
The minimum age is 12 (where I live)

I think that Ronbo is basically proving Buzz's point here:

The NRA (& others) have been waging a fear campain based on untrue statements secure in the knowledge that they're unlikely to be called on it.

The following sites have reasonable summaries of the rules - no doubt many of you in the US would identify the serious limitations imposed.

http://www.rurallaw.org.au/handbook/....php#Ch15Se925
http://www.police.vic.gov.au/content...ocument_ID=219
http://ssaavic.com.au/ssaa.php?id=6&

As a society Australians can change these laws if they like by electing officials that will alter the rules - they are almost always on the ballot paper - few (none) get up.

Also - to support what Tom said - this is basically the only place where I hear from a broad(er) cross section of the US so its very informative to me and I appreciate being able to have these discussions and understand the divergent views.

.... back to your regular programming ....


LoBelly

I understand all to well...

Privileges are licensed, not rights.

[Tom Kirkham]

Originally Posted by Anthony

Somehow I think firearm topics are meant for a different site.

Tom, are you trying to stir the pot?

That is why I posted in the lounge. I actually highly respect the opinions of the people who post on this board. I am very interested in what the members of this forum opinions are, both for and against this issue as well as other issues. So yes, I am trying to stir the pot of fresh ideas and well reasoned thought. However, I am by no means trying to start a flame war. Flame wars have only succeed in driving people away and killing any new ideas.

[mdmull]

I'm just sayin' - "You wanna shoot the breeze about stuff that isn't necessarily Cobra related? Here's the place to be."

[BeanCounter]

Australians have no personal rights under Australia's Constitution

No wonder Quigley came back home.