Electric Powered Cobra

Don · #1 (**permalink**) 07-02-2009, 08:53 AM

How To Make Your Own Electric Car
Jay Yarow|Jul. 1, 2009, 5:00 PM|1

Source: The Business Insider Green Sheet

Quote:

" Raul Atkinson, a software engineer, wanted an electric car, but couldn't find one on the market that was affordable or good looking. So did what any reasonable person would do, he built his own.

He calls it the Raptor. He spent 2,000 of his spare hours building it from a 1965 Shelby Cobra body kit.

NBC(via Jalopnik): The car runs on a 3-phase AC induction motor and is currently powered by 290 nickel metal hydride batteries (Atkinson says the next version will use a lithium ion battery). It can reach speeds up to 100 MPH and can travel from zero to 60 mph in about eight seconds. The time it takes to charge the car is typically three hours, which will allow it to travel up to 80 miles depending on the driving environment.

Atkinson estimates the car cost about $85,000, but he thinks it could be made for cheap as an alternative to the Prius.

Our unsolicited advice to Mr. Atkinson: forget the mass market. Go high end. Think Lamborghini, Porsche. You'll make a profit, and you'll be less susceptible to the rise and fall of gas prices. Rich people don't need to worry about that crap.

Atkinson's tracked the progress of building his car at Electric Marin Wheels. This gallery will give you a sense of what you're in for: "

http://www.electricmarinwheels.com/Home.html

cobra de capell · #2 (**permalink**) 07-02-2009, 09:20 AM

How silly is this?

fsstnotch · #3 (**permalink**) 07-02-2009, 09:27 AM

What I dislike about this idea.....

290 batteries
0-60 in 8 sec
$85,000
80 miles
3 hours

I think that about sums it up!

It looks nice though

bomelia · #4 (**permalink**) 07-02-2009, 12:01 PM

I was out running yesterday... a string of cars rolled by with a Cobra 427 in the rear rumbling along. As it passed, the familiar smell of unburned gasoline wafted through the air. Was sweet.

Mike

jams · #5 (**permalink**) 07-03-2009, 06:00 AM

Electric cars have instant and consistant torque, just what you need when running the 1/4 mile.

Buzz · #6 (**permalink**) 07-03-2009, 10:46 AM

This HST electric Cobra has a 150mph top speed, 130 mile range and goes from 0 - 60 mph in 3.2 seconds. These figures, except for the 0-60 time are very similar to the original 427 Cobra. Of course, the original didn't take 8 hours (3 hrs @ 220v) to refuel, but any performance junkie has got to salivate at the thought of driving a car with 1000 ft/lbs of torque from 0 to 10000 rpm!! Once the battery/recharging/packaging issues are sorted out, and they will be eventually, there is awesome performance potential in electric powered vehicles.

Ron61 · #7 (**permalink**) 07-03-2009, 10:55 AM

Buzz,

I have real a little abut that Cobra and thought it was pretty good. The 130 mile range would be limited here as much of my driving is in the mountains and that would drain the batteries faster than out on a flat highway. But the performance figures are impressive, there would be no smog issues, no noise traps along the highway, and all of that instant torque. I just hope they can come up with a little better battery set up that will last a little longer and won't take so long to recharge.

Ron

Buzz · #8 (**permalink**) 07-03-2009, 11:57 AM

They will Ron - it's just a matter of time. EV's are not the be all and end all to solve all of the world's geo-politico-enviromental problems, but with a continuous 1000 ft/lbs of torque, zero emissions and a cost of less than 3 cents a mile even with current technology, they have my attention.

Consider the performance potential with integrated electronic traction controls and extras like active aero, stability and suspension management and hell, drag racing could reach new heights (or should I say lows

?) and with GPS-mapped road course data plugged into the ECM, the slot-car like performance could make current road racing look like a soapbox derby!

Critics lament that without the noise and smell of burning dinosaurs, performance cars would lose their visceral appeal, but I bet the sheer speed and awesome linear/lateral accelerative forces would turn many into believers after a few short rides. Plus, with a customizable audio system, you could make your car sound like anything you want. A melodious basso-profundo for cruising the boulevard and a wailing valkyrie shriek for canyon carving or track work.

Wes Tausend · #9 (**permalink**) 07-03-2009, 01:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Don

How To Make Your Own Electric Car
Jay Yarow|Jul. 1, 2009, 5:00 PM|1

Source: The Business Insider Green Sheet

Quote:

" Raul Atkinson, a software engineer, wanted an electric car, but couldn't find one on the market that was affordable or good looking. So did what any reasonable person would do, he built his own.

He calls it the Raptor. He spent 2,000 of his spare hours building it from a 1965 Shelby Cobra body kit.

NBC(via Jalopnik): The car runs on a 3-phase AC induction motor and is currently powered by 290 nickel metal hydride batteries (Atkinson says the next version will use a lithium ion battery). It can reach speeds up to 100 MPH and can travel from zero to 60 mph in about eight seconds. The time it takes to charge the car is typically three hours, which will allow it to travel up to 80 miles depending on the driving environment.

Atkinson estimates the car cost about $85,000, but he thinks it could be made for cheap as an alternative to the Prius.

Our unsolicited advice to Mr. Atkinson: forget the mass market. Go high end. Think Lamborghini, Porsche. You'll make a profit, and you'll be less susceptible to the rise and fall of gas prices. Rich people don't need to worry about that crap.

Atkinson's tracked the progress of building his car at Electric Marin Wheels. This gallery will give you a sense of what you're in for: "

http://www.electricmarinwheels.com/Home.html

Don,

Pretty cool. Of course not everyone thinks so. There was also a terrible reaction to change when the horse and buggy got replaced too, often by early electric cars (but soon gasoline won out, for the time being, anyway). It is now possible to buy high tech hybrid motor parts and engineer your own. Or how about a pre-engineered '32 highboy?

Some time ago you asked what mileage influence air conditioning had on electric or hybrid cars. Through a snafu in my reading comprehension, I never answered your question at the time. The answer is that my wifes 2007 Prius hybrid usually drops about 1 or 2 mpg on the highway, from 45 to 44, 43 for instance. We live in a cool region. Some other folks on http://priuschat.com/forums/ say it drops about 5% (.05 x 40 = 2mpg). This is not too bad, similar to other standard autos. The Prius has a sealed electrical driven AC compresser that runs at variable speed to maintain a dashboard set cabin temperature. It is a bit more reliable than a standard pulley driven compresser in that there is no shaft seal to leak refrigerant, identical to our dependable sealed home refrigerators, freezers, AC units, etc .

Winter driving in the city does drop considerably, down to about 36 mpg, both because the engine has to maintain heat for clean burning and cabin temp. It has electric heat for instant warmth, but uses engine coolant for general cabin heat. Both could be likely be improved by better insulation in this far north. We aren't used to dedicated cabin insulation because of the excess engine heat usually available in the past. Of course, 36 mpg isn't all that bad.

Wes

Quote:

Originally Posted by jams

Electric cars have instant and consistant torque, just what you need when running the 1/4 mile.

Jams,

I note that the 2007 Prius has 295 foot-pounds in the main motor. My 5.0 Cobra/Mustang V8 engine is rated at 300 foot-pounds OEM. The Prius has a traction limitation built into it to keep it from twisting it's tiny little axles apart, off the line. Our locomotives have a similar limit to prevent burning a notch in the rails on take-off. If it fails, the wheel melts through the ball of the rail in seconds, once it starts to spin. Talk about a burn-out...

Since computer controls are causing ever greater electrical controls to be applied to modern hydraulic transmissions, at great expense I might add, I think that automatic transmissions are headed for conversion to more reliable air-cooled full electric, even if power is from an internal combustion engine which won't be going away soon. An example are these large haul trucks. My 7000 pound Ford Excursion SUV, the polar opposite of a Prius, requires 4R100 tranny oil changes every 30K. Nice tow outfit, though.

Wes

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ron61

I have real a little abut that Cobra and thought it was pretty good. The 130 mile range would be limited here as much of my driving is in the mountains and that would drain the batteries faster than out on a flat highway. But the performance figures are impressive, there would be no smog issues, no noise traps along the highway, and all of that instant torque. I just hope they can come up with a little better battery set up that will last a little longer and won't take so long to recharge.

Ron,

The batteries will get better unless the petroleum mega-corporations can succeed in locking up the world supply of raw materials for them and force an artificial delay. It's a high dollar poker game now, where carbon propoganda tries it's best to influence the slow thinkers. Batteries are dangerous, they're bad for the environment etc.

I'll still be hauling coal. The energy has to come from somewhere, even if it's from CO2 sequestered fuel. Wind and solar will never match what we use now and I don't know if the world ever be efficient enough to get by with just these. Nuclear power may change things the most. Realistically, I'll be retired before most of these changes occur anyway. Or I'll be an earth sequestered carbon-based lifeform.

Wes

...

Don · #10 (**permalink**) 07-03-2009, 08:52 PM

Mercedes has made a 10% investment in Telsa Motors, hedging for the 2016 CAFE of 35.5 mpg

" Strategic partnership: Daimler acquires stake in Tesla
• German automaker acquires nearly 10 percent of one of the leading electric vehicle companies
• Automakers agreed to cooperate in battery systems, electric drive systems and vehicle projects "

http://www.teslamotors.com/media/press_room.php?id=1356

http://www.teslamotors.com/

Buzz · #11 (**permalink**) 07-04-2009, 05:10 PM

in a seriously fugly lil' electric commuter car.
http://www.commutercars.com/

Wes Tausend · #12 (**permalink**) 07-05-2009, 01:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Don

Mercedes has made a 10% investment in Telsa Motors, hedging for the 2016 CAFE of 35.5 mpg

" Strategic partnership: Daimler acquires stake in Tesla
• German automaker acquires nearly 10 percent of one of the leading electric vehicle companies
• Automakers agreed to cooperate in battery systems, electric drive systems and vehicle projects "

http://www.teslamotors.com/media/press_room.php?id=1356

http://www.teslamotors.com/

Don,

That should be interesting. Daimler seems to be truly commited to coming transportation change. But like I said, it is a high stakes poker game ...using our money, of course.

I hope it's not like GM when they bought into improved NiMH battery tech during their EV1 era, and threatened the vendor/inventer with a lawsuit, if he advertised, again, how it would make electric cars more practical. They turned around and sold their 60% interest to Texaco. The improved NiMH patent runs out in 2014. It's eerily reminiscent of the miracle gas-saver carburator repression stories.

So I wish Tesla better luck having sold only 10% to the world power-brokers.

Wes

Quote:

Originally Posted by Buzz

in a seriously fugly lil' electric commuter car.
http://www.commutercars.com/

Buzz,

My wife might own a Prius ...but I think it's pretty homely ...practical, but fugly.

Worse yet, the 2010 Honda Insight looks just like it. Apparently, there is only one ideal slippery shape. And it's even worse than when all the cars starting looking like jellybeans.

The Prius was the most slippery production car in the world (.26) when the Gen II was introduced in 2004. Life will be a pretty boring if cars all start looking and sounding the same. The EV1 was better at .19 coef/drag when it was produced and leased.

Wes

...

Buzz · #13 (**permalink**) 07-05-2009, 03:10 PM

Yes, but did you check out the stats on that lil' machine I posted? It may be ugly, but it flat hauls and contrary to its top heavy appearance, it carves corners too!

Don · #14 (**permalink**) 07-05-2009, 03:20 PM

Not aware of any state or the federal government which has adopted gasoline taxes specifically intended to at least maintain the revenue base when and if electric cars/hybrids become more popular......., but its only a manner of time. As an example, I believe CT gas tax or a portion of goes to the General Fund rather than specifically for the Dept of Transportation.

How will an all electric vehicle be taxed on usage, not sales/property tax, in lieu of not purchasing gas. How will the mileage usage be monitored ? Will be another Health Care issue.

Wes Tausend · #15 (**permalink**) 07-05-2009, 09:14 PM

...

Buzz,

You did make me look at the Tango again. The claimed performance is pretty impressive. Perhaps the stopping distance would be the shortcoming, considering the 3150 pounds. I wonder what the 0-60-0 time is. They don't give a stopping distance, but do spec, "Mazda Miata calipers with Hawk HP Plus (rear) and HPS (front) pads. Wilwood master cylinder and pedal assembly."

As a matter of curiosity, years ago I acquired an early Honda 750F with dual front and single rear discs with the thought of an electric bike that is easier to store than a car project. Lead acid batteries cause a considerable increase over OEM weight according to the plan. Of course I will never get time to actually assemble such an animal, but, hey, I'm a dreamer. I collect the stuff of dreams.

Wes

=================

Don,

Gas taxes, unlike health care, will not likely be free for half the population and not the unfortunate other. Maybe it will thereby be easier to solve in that respect.

I agree "fuel tax" will be tricky to meter. Maybe all energy will be taxed, no matter it's end use ...and powerlines and roads will come out of the same fund. Taxes (and death) will never be less, that is a certainy.

Wes

...

Ron61 · #16 (**permalink**) 07-06-2009, 02:57 AM

Buzz,

That is impressive but where do you find the projected price? I saw what it takes in parts and labor and then plus the overhead, but no actual price breakdown for each type of battery and set up. If they could just improve the looks a little I think they could have a good vehicle there. The range with the expensive batteries is also good, but would have to be cut due to mountain driving around here. I like the shorter recharge time.

Ron

Don · #17 (**permalink**) 07-06-2009, 02:12 PM

FYI......

" ExxonMobil and Electrovaya launch car program in Baltimore June 23, 2009

Today ExxonMobil took another important step in meeting the world’s growing energy needs by announcing the sponsorship of an all-electric car-sharing and rental program, called AltCar, at the Maryland Science Center in Baltimore, MD. "

Press Release:

http://www.exxonmobil.com/Corporate/...ectrovaya.aspx

Wes Tausend · #18 (**permalink**) 07-07-2009, 01:05 AM

...

Ron,

Quote:

...The range with the expensive batteries is also good, but would have to be cut due to mountain driving around here. I like the shorter recharge time.

Too bad they can't incorporate a regenerative charge back into the little guys battery like most hybrids. They charge up battery juice on the downhill to use going back up ...and nearly break even range with a car used in flat terrain. Or in the case of hybrids, you don't waste braking energy in the form of gasoline when you stop. The seldom used brake shoes last the life of the car since the regenerator mostly slows it down.

Wes

=======

Don,

Quote:

FYI......

" ExxonMobil and Electrovaya launch car program in Baltimore June 23, 2009
http://www.exxonmobil.com/Corporate/...ectrovaya.aspx

Nice link. Although it makes me look mean the way I talk about the petroleum industry. There is good people there like everywhere else. And we are so lucky that U.S. gas costs as little as it does, to give credit due to Corporate America and free enterprise.

Wes

...

Ron61 · #19 (**permalink**) 07-07-2009, 04:39 AM

Wes,

It does come with a trailer hitch to pull a trailer with a generator on it along so you can charge the batteries without having to stop. But on some of the steep mountain roads we have around here, even the older 6 cylinder cars have problems getting over some of the passes without over heating or they have to have no load on them. Not to many places that bad, but some on a couple of the major highways.
I like the Cobra but the 8 hour recharge time is what would spoil it.Now if they could just make a quick change battery pack so you could have one charging while you drove on the other that might work. Of course the price would take it out of most peoples range.

Ron

Buzz · #20 (**permalink**) 07-07-2009, 09:00 AM

Ron - Wes is referring to the use of regenerative braking to put some charge back into the batteries every time the car is slowed while running downhill in the mountains. Basically, the energy normally wasted as heat in conventional brake systems is converted to electricity and fed back to the batteries. Here is a good link that details the system:
http://auto.howstuffworks.com/auto-p...ve-braking.htm

The high prices on some of these electric cars are more reflective of low production volume and up front R&D costs than anything else. If and when any sort of assembly line production happens, they will fall in line with equivalently equipped and performing conventional vehicles.