Is our hobby/passion disapearing?

[john chesnut]

I know that I am totally crazy. I couldn't pick a worst time to be bringing to market not only new versions of my Dragon cars but also a Cobra kit too. I know that the economy stinks. I know that there are less and less people that are willing to build their own car. I know that the demand for the cars that we love is diminishing. Most of us that love the Cobra and other sports cars of the 50's and 60's are now in OUR 50's and 60's. UOCH!! I know that the younger generation hasn't grown up lusting after those cars. So, there are fewer potential customers.
It's obvious that the number of people involved in our hobby is diminishing. About 8 years ago, the now defunct Kit Car Magazine sold ( I was told)around 90,000 copies per issue. In the end is was in the 20,000 range. I go to the Carlisle show and I have been to the Knotts show. The number of people at those shows is down right miniscule.
The combination of these events has and is having a devestating effect on the companies that design, build, and sell the kits that we have been building. I won't list names but the number of companies that have folded is substantial and growing almost daily.
From a purely business stand point owning a Kit Car company is stupid! The work is long and hard. To develop the product and then to manufacture it, market it, and support it, is time consuming and expensive. How do you make a small fortune owning a Kit Car company? Start with a large one!
And, yet I can't stop waking up in the middle of the night and going into the garage to work on some part of my cars that I have had an idea for. It is a sickness. There should be a support group with monthly meetings. I would stand up and say "My name is John Chesnut, and I am a car-aholic". We would drink coffee, have snacks, and discuss ways to get through the next month without spending this months salary for the part we NEED to have!
For the past 8 years I have been working on my cars. I am never been satisfied and I have been redesigning and making improvements, it seems, almost daily. For the first time I can say that I am completely happy with the body designs, chassis design, and the C5 Corvette independent suspensions that I am using.
I have just started taking orders and delivering my 66 Snake replica. And, I have a few orders for my new C5 based Dragon. I have designed the Dragon so that the builder can customize it to their tasts. I have a full height windshield, a low wrap around one, 1 or double head fairings, or a spoiler, a Targa roof and a new Coupe version. I will show these for the first time at Carlisle in May.
If you are looking for a car with an extremely high level of performance I would appreciate you checking my cars out. My company will never be large. I like it that way. I like having satisfied customers. I will do what is necessary to make building the car of your dreams rewarding and fun. I plan to be around for some time to come! Have a great one, John
www.chesnutmotorsports.com, www.dragonmotorcars.com

[rustyBob]

I think you hit the nail on the head John ....YOU CARE....about your product by makeing changes about the quality of the materials and what people think of it and that is going to stand out in peoples opinions about you and your product. There is no shame in haveing a small company with people that care about what they are doing and doing it wright the first time. I think you will do fine if you keep you chin up as well as the quality and materials,deliver on time and dont make excuses if you miss a deadline be upfront and honest and people will say good things about you and your compamy...............HONESTY................is still the best policy.

[RedBarchetta]

John, I think this hobby has been largely populated by either car guys that didn't understand customer service, customer service guys that didn't understand how to properly manufacture a car, or a littany of others that created a "cobra like" body and thought the world would beat a path to their door. You come off as the rare exception that is totally committed to providing the best components and best customer service...your clients are fortunate (whether they realize it or not).

I attended my first Knott's show several years ago (around year 2000) when there were still plenty of choices and the event was well attended. It was on that day that I personally sat in many cars and learned that of all them there, the Superformance option was the best for ME. It actually fit my 6'3" frame the best and I also realized that I (probably) didn't have all the correct tools, time and patience required to build a car in kit form. It ended up being a very good choice for me personally.

Around that same time Factory Five was coming on stronger and really woke up the masses to the whole concept of a donor car for parts. Their kits are some of the most complete in the industry and they have done really well over the years and have a great following.

But when you consider all the lawsuits associated with this hobby (thank you, Mr. Shelby), one has to ask if the Smith brothers (and all the other players) are actually making any money at this? If you're in it "for the love of the game," then a profit may not be as important and breaking even keeps people employed and your passion at your fingertips every day. Not a bad trade-off if you can manage it correctly.

Then you have the whole "originality" debates. The ERAs and Kirkhams are dead nuts on dimensionally, but those of us with trained eyes can tell when a kit (i.e. FFR) rolls on by. I looked at your car, and based on the photos my trained eye can detect little cues that state just that. But, in the same argument, I can roll around town here and there and Joe Public would swear that my SPF is a real one. I just smile and say, "Yeah, it's a real Superformance manufactured replica!"

So you can build the best suspension, have the best construction, best components and all that, but you may not please the discerning buyer if the wrapper isn't a bulls-eye. Or non-Ford components, in some instances vastly superior as well, are being incorporated. Thus has been the issue with having choices in this hobby. Choices are good but they can also be confusing. Then the differentiating factors become price and customer support. Most buyers will give a little wiggle room on the former, but you can never waiver on the latter.

Yes, you have chosen a shall we say "unique" time to start a business like this one. But where some people view the water glass as half empty, there will be others that see opportunity and view it as half full.

Again, good luck with your venture and kudos to you for having both the resources and passion to follow your dreams.

Regards,

-Dean

[madmaxx]

I do know this, I took a 12 mile drive yesterday to look after a friends house, I saw about 8 people point at my car while I was a stop lights and two wave while I was driving. I try my best to ignore most people so I have no doubt the number was much higher. What needs to occur in the cobra market is better advertising to the 20's plus group. 99% of the people ask questions like what type of car is that, I bet it was expensive. I feel if the car was more accessible sales would skyrocket. The younger generations have grown up on civics and supra's.

[Dan Stryffeler]

"Is our hobby/passion disapearing?"

I don't know that it's disappearing, might be that it's just hitting a saturation point.

Every generation has some type of car that they've hot rodded; typically what was available cheaply at the time... most kids in their 20's want to work on the imports and that's ok - I don't think advertising would solve anything, because there's nothing there to solve. What our dad's hot rodded was different from what we did, which is different than our kids, and what their kids will do...

It was a pretty unique set of circumstances that lead to the demand for Cobra replicas - among them were low initial production numbers and amazing performance/looks. We are kind of a niche within a niche and the market might just go away with us.

The well run replica companies will be the ones that survive the current economy. No different from any other business...

Dan

[Clois Harlan]

John,

There needs to be a few more manufacturers out there like you and my bet is there will be more if they want to continue with their business' I have been fortunate with the people and companies I continue to done business with these days. A mans word is as important to me as any contract. The happy customer will always generate more business for a company than mis guided add. Honesty doesn't require one to remember what he told his last customer. You're one of the good guys John and I believe you will be successful at whatever you decide to do.

Clois Harlan

[Bob In Ct]

Like Yogi said "Nobody goes there anymore, it's too crowded."

Once the masses get onboard the fun is over. Seeing a Cobra go down the road is nothing special today. They seem to be everywhere.

Bob

[RedBarchetta]

Originally Posted by Bob In Ct

Seeing a Cobra go down the road is nothing special today. They seem to be everywhere.

Bob

Bob, that statement is somewhat true. But even in car crazy So Cal where seeing a Lamborghini (or other exotic or rarer vehicle) drive by is an everyday event (especially in the OC), our Cobras still get the rubber neckers, the questions, the occasional rear-ender in the adjacent lane caused by the rubber neckers, etc., etc.

Of course that will all end temporarily when the '10 Camaro hits the streets and my daily driver Z06 falls back to chopped liver status.

-Dean

[Got the Bug]

Originally Posted by Bob In Ct

Like Yogi said "Nobody goes there anymore, it's too crowded."

Once the masses get onboard the fun is over. Seeing a Cobra go down the road is nothing special today. They seem to be everywhere.

Bob

How did get the folks in CT get so jaded?

I just took a quick 20 minute run North on Hwy 1 from Santa Cruz then back by the water and down by the Boardwalk. Thumbs up and smiles everywhere...even in the liberal bastion of Santa Cruz.

Get a group of 10 or 20 cars and you'll get even more thumbs up.

[vector1]

i think what you are doing is tough, especially in today's economy. the market is saturated compared to disposable income available imo. to grow to the size to make a decent profit like ff or some of the other manufacturers will be tough. if you consider your time spent and other limited resources that go into this venture your roi will probably by dismal, so you must consider it a passion as you stated.

what you are doing is unique, using the vette suspension pieces and drive train that are readily available, but at what price? with the light weight and if the suspension is designed correctly this would be a terror on the track, and imo you should design for this, making it acceptable to scca, nasa, etc. i especially like the vette drivetrain options with the efi, al motor, etc.

have you done any inquires on the chevrolet forums to see if there is any interest?

good luck.

[1985 CCX]

John

My son's 5 and 6 are Cobra crazy thus the beginning of the next generation. My 5 yr old workes with me in the garage on a regular basis. At least as regular as I get out there.

They have been fortunate enough to spend alot of time behind the wheel of CSX3020 and GT40AM#2, of course pretending to be racing. Jack always was one to share these cars.

I would say that there will be another generation after us, hopefully the passion will continue as long as we can still get gas as we know it today. I am not sure a battery powered replica will pack the same punch as a old school piston popping plant.

[john chesnut]

Thanks for the input guys. I didn't mean to come off sounding like I am complaining about my sales. When I decided to do my cars I did them because I wanted to do them for myself. I never even intended to sell them. I began offering them for sale because some people that saw them wanted to buy them. I have been working hard to get the quality and desgn of my offering to the level that I would expect if I purchased it from some one else.
I know that my Cobra is not original and will not appeal to a big part of the market. I did it my way and it irepresents what I want out of a car.
My new Dragons are in my opinion, stunning in appearance and performance. (Wait until you see the Coupe!) Because it is an original design I don't need to worry about infringment lawsuits. But, because it is an original design it is a harder sell because there is not a pent up desire for it. That's OK, I love it.
The fact is that I am getting the number of orders that I want. My main concern is for the health of the hobby. I want there to be alot of manufacturers offering a wide array of cool cars. But, from a purely business standpoint there are alot of other businesses that are easier to run and offer a much higher return on investment. I applaud the other manufacturers that care about their customers, and build nice products. But, I doubt that many went into this business just because they see Kit Cars as an easy way to financial success. There has to be a passion for the cars. Hopefully enough of us will be around to be able to grow our hobby.

Jeff, great to see your kids at the breakfast. It's great to involve them. I have done this with my son and our relationship is the better for it.

I do belong to a couple of Vette forums and most of them love my cars, especially the Dragon. Bikers go nuts for my Hot Rod body ont he Dragon chassis! I have lots of places to show my cars.

[Joy]

I actually wonder why more car people don't buy them. I've wanted one since I saw my first replica back in the 80's when I tried to get my husband to replace our Taurus with one . (I'm ashamed to say I don't remember seeing an original in the 60's.) Now that we have the money, we got one. The car commercial that asks: When you turn your car on does it return the favor? - you betcha! The kids next door were in awe when it was delivered. I don't see that many here in SE CT, but there will be one out and about now. Good luck with your venture.

[madmaxx]

Yesterday evening, as a Japanese couple and their 3 year old walked by my house, the little girl goes "cool car". I have learned one thing in all my car sales, people do not buy good cars, they buy good looking cars, and noyone will argue with the fact that a Cobra is a good looking car. The population is not getting smaller, once the more fly by night companies go under and the big 2 or 3 are left supply will diminish and demand will go up for those remaining in business.

[WildBill3]

Our Passion and Your's is what sets us apart from the crowd of comuters what a great adventure were on.The comuters dont know what ther missing thats what the TV ads try to capture.John you have it,I would venture to say that people who visit this site want it.We all need to share it.I try and hope others will also.At the car shows thers usually a line for a Taste of my Passion...