Motor choice

fastraxsg · #1 (**permalink**) 08-20-2006, 11:08 AM

Being out of the USA has provided some unique challenges from me. I am having trouble getting a kit imported and was thinking about undertaking a scratch build, I can get a body locally if worse comes to worse but motor and trans are problem, when thinking about the usual choices. However, today I looked a beautiful 1996 BMW 530i with a 3 litre V-8 and auto transmission. The car is complete, never in an accident and runs like a top. Any one out there on this site ever put a Beemer V-8 in a Cobra? Should I duck now before the usual insults are hurled?

hssss · #2 (**permalink**) 08-20-2006, 02:09 PM

http://forums.corner-carvers.com/showthread.php?t=29060
Food for thought.

FUNFER2 · #3 (**permalink**) 08-20-2006, 02:12 PM

PLEASE...................don't. Find a way for a Ford engine.

hssss · #4 (**permalink**) 08-20-2006, 09:27 PM

That was not an add for a LSx, rather a comment on the BMW. Note the MB with a Ford.

fastraxsg · #5 (**permalink**) 08-20-2006, 09:53 PM

Not a problem, I'm not biased toward any motor, it's just we have titling issues here and by using an old car and re-body and re-chassis can sometimes work. The BMW is the only car locally with a V-8 at this time, unless you count a HummerH-3...plus it was in the right price range and unique. So...I've been told its more complicated and such. There is a guy on Cobraclub.com that has a Cobra with a 4.8 or 4.4 beemer motor and it looks good, well not as good as the Lexus V-8, he is building one of those now. It's just that in Indonesia, car life/modifications/cobras are not easy to do. That is why I have my old sorta wannabbee Cobra now.....thanks

hssss · #6 (**permalink**) 08-21-2006, 06:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by fastraxsg

Not a problem, I'm not biased toward any motor, it's just we have titling issues here and by using an old car and re-body and re-chassis can sometimes work. The BMW is the only car locally with a V-8 at this time, unless you count a HummerH-3...plus it was in the right price range and unique. So...I've been told its more complicated and such. There is a guy on Cobraclub.com that has a Cobra with a 4.8 or 4.4 beemer motor and it looks good, well not as good as the Lexus V-8, he is building one of those now. It's just that in Indonesia, car life/modifications/cobras are not easy to do. That is why I have my old sorta wannabbee Cobra now.....thanks

Just a couple of thoughts. Using the parts and title of the BMW are the best way to get a car registered there It might be worthwhile to do, depending on yur fabrication skills, a space framed version of Ken Miles Flip-top car http://www.csxinfo.net/compcars/fliptop/fliptop.htm this would allow more engine room and the ability to service it. You might look at some of the Locost 7 sites for the means of adapting strut fromt spindles to A arms. In short build a kinda wide Locost 7 using the BMW running gear http://locostusa.com/forums/viewtopic.php?t=1004 then drape a Cobra body around it using a tilt nose. I would think that though a country is bad on customs charges for a complete car they should be less so for repair parts. The thought being that if you have trouble with the body have it cut into quarters and shipped as parts in seperate shipments. The Locost style frame materials should be able to be sourced in the local market. Just some thoughts.

Excaliber · #7 (**permalink**) 08-20-2006, 11:26 PM

Being overseas really makes a difference, with the laws and regulations you gotta do what you gotta do. I respect that and still admire those who do the best they can. Now in this 'land of plenty', I'm not so easy going...

As for the USA, I'm getting rather 'annoyed' with the general acceptance of all kinds of TO many incorrect small blocks (AND BIG BLOCKS) and suspension components that don't even attempt to replicate the real thing. Not to mention body shapes, wheels, dash's, gauges and a host of other things. I don't like the cookie cutter cars and am not afraid to say so, SPF, BDR and FFR lead the charge.

The cars I admire most are truly 'old school' which is what this hobby USED to be about! A well built ACCURATE Hi Tech is a thing of beauty, for instance. In general were loosing it to a market willing to buy at a nice price with less appreciation of what it means to 'replicate' a Cobra.

It's only a replica is the often heard excuse, and thats all it is, an EXCUSE!

fastraxsg · #8 (**permalink**) 08-21-2006, 09:01 AM

One of these days we are supposed to move back to the States, when I don't know but....then its time to do a FIA or similar type...I'd love to have a set of Webers to hear every time I start it up...until then, this is the best I can do..now if you ever get bored and want to trade cars, let me know....

wilf leek · #9 (**permalink**) 08-21-2006, 10:45 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Excaliber

Being overseas really makes a difference, with the laws and regulations you gotta do what you gotta do. I respect that and still admire those who do the best they can. Now in this 'land of plenty', I'm not so easy going...

As for the USA, I'm getting rather 'annoyed' with the general acceptance of all kinds of TO many incorrect small blocks (AND BIG BLOCKS) and suspension components that don't even attempt to replicate the real thing. Not to mention body shapes, wheels, dash's, gauges and a host of other things. I don't like the cookie cutter cars and am not afraid to say so, SPF, BDR and FFR lead the charge.

The cars I admire most are truly 'old school' which is what this hobby USED to be about! A well built ACCURATE Hi Tech is a thing of beauty, for instance. In general were loosing it to a market willing to buy at a nice price with less appreciation of what it means to 'replicate' a Cobra.

It's only a replica is the often heard excuse, and thats all it is, an EXCUSE!

How times change, it seems only yesterday that you were buying the same Excaliber for the second time. Fantastically original car that, not a "cookie cutter" cobra in any way, oh no. Very "old school".

Consistency is all.

GeorgiaSnake · #10 (**permalink**) 08-21-2006, 11:15 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Excaliber

The cars I admire most are truly 'old school' which is what this hobby USED to be about! A well built ACCURATE Hi Tech is a thing of beauty, for instance. In general were loosing it to a market willing to buy at a nice price with less appreciation of what it means to 'replicate' a Cobra.

I'm confused - is it "old school" or "high tech" that you admire?

FUNFER2 · #11 (**permalink**) 08-21-2006, 01:55 PM

I'm with you Excaliber. I don't mean to offend anyone with idealization what a Cobra should be but, I don't accept anything other than a FIA type small block, 427 side oiler or a FE, as a engine. I also don't believe in a "Hot Rodded" Cobra. I can't even see using 17" wheels, unless maybe, for racing. Don't like automatics, or BMW suspension's, wood dashes or high back seats. Cobras were built as a race car. Fuel fumes, harsh ridding, noisy and hit the pedal so it pushes you back in your seat and scares the crap out of your passenger, gives you the "Cobra experience". I don't care that you can put in a crate Ford 514cu. with 630 hp or a Chevy 572 cube for easy and cheaper power than building a expensive "FE". I've even heard of a crate Hemi in a cobra ! (shameful) You could even put in a relatively stock, rice engine with twin turbos, coolers, alcohol injection and incredible boost numbers and have 800 + hp............it's not a cobra. Is my cobra as original ? No, I've just polished the aluminum on the engine, half of the wheels and dash ect., and I still get people asking, "is it real" ? Which I reply, "no but thank you". "I wish I could afford one though" Even a kirkham is out of my reach so, I'll have fun driving my Lone Star. I'm not saying that anything other than original is wrong. "To each it's own" and "what ever makes you happy" IS, what I saying but, at least try to stay with in the parameter of original. I would never....put a V-8 in a BMW unless it was manufactured that way. Or how about putting a rice burner engine in our sprint car, I don't think so ! LOL !!! A Cobra is all about great....... "American muscle power".

Excaliber · #12 (**permalink**) 08-21-2006, 11:12 AM

There are a few exceptions to the rule. For instance there are not enough Excaliburs to 'dilute' the market and they are hardly a 'cookie cutter' being mass produced. That said, I DID grow tired of opening the hood to reveal yet another (yawn) 302 fuel injected Mustang motor. I tell you this, I was ALWAYS careful to point out HOW the Excal should not be considered an 'accurate' replica in any way! Celebrate your car for what it is, but don't pretend your (insert any number of modern replicas here) is anything CLOSE to 'original' specs!

A 427 SC Kirkham showed up at a local gathering here recently, with a small block. I found it rather annoying, but whats even MORE annoying is the K brothers warm embrace of essentially a 'crate' motor'! Kirkhams USED to be known for an accurate build, thats changing as they 'market' to the masses. You wanna run a small block? Get an FIA! You wanna run a 460, uh, OK, Im not sure WHAT your trying to do with that!

We ARE seeing the end of an era.

Look at the early replicas and the attention to detail and the effort to make an accurate car that went into them. Workmanship and dedication like that has been lost, such is life, marketing will go on. The masses have spoken.

wilf leek · #13 (**permalink**) 08-21-2006, 11:16 AM

Whatever happened to "Its your car, its your dream, you build it how you like?"

Anything else is just fascism.

If I wanted to put a crate motor into MY Kirkham, guess what, I would, and your opinion is worth just what I paid for it. And if you were to be "annoyed" by it, tough!

mikeinatlanta · #14 (**permalink**) 08-23-2006, 02:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Excaliber

A 427 SC Kirkham showed up at a local gathering here recently, with a small block. I found it rather annoying, but whats even MORE annoying is the K brothers warm embrace of essentially a 'crate' motor'! Kirkhams USED to be known for an accurate build, thats changing as they 'market' to the masses. You wanna run a small block? Get an FIA! You wanna run a 460, uh, OK, Im not sure WHAT your trying to do with that!

Interesting quote from a AC MKIII auction.http://www.rmauctions.com/AuctionRes...SaleCode=MO06#

"Unfortunately, as far as American buyers were concerned, there would be no solution. However, for a few lucky U.K. and European buyers, AC built what many have come to believe is the ultimate Cobra – the AC Cobra MK III.

For years, AC cars had been retaining and finishing cars destined for the European markets (the COX series), and the U.K. market (the COB series). As was the case in America, when the change was made to the coil spring chassis, the UK and European cars followed suit. However, higher fuel costs and lots of narrow, twisting roads made the 427 powered cars unsuited for use in these markets. Finally, at the end of production, 26 very special cars were built by AC cars, combining the coil spring chassis with the latest edition of Ford’s lightweight 289. Few Cobra enthusiasts are even aware of these cars, but the most knowledgeable have always regarded these as the ultimate Cobras – the purest evolution of the original spirit of the car."

Good luck with the beemer motor.

Excaliber · #15 (**permalink**) 08-21-2006, 11:29 AM

It's cars like Turks, currently on e-bay that I admire! It's cars like my friends older "Hi Tech" (the name of the manufacturer), with dual electric fuel pumps in the alloy skinned trunk that I admire (and a real 427 side oiler under the hood). It's cars like jdogs, a CSX with a 'real' motor under the hood. There are LOTS of good examples of 'classic specifications' Corbras and replicas out there. But their numbers are falling as we bow to the 'cheap' cookie cutter replacements readily available.

Where do YOU draw the line? Rice wheels? Crushed velvet interior? VW motor? A Honda powered front wheel drive replica Cobra? We ALL draw the line somewhere. Wilf might want a Roush crate motor 427 small block in his Kirkham, OK. Certainly not MY cup of tea, especially in THAT car! More suited to an FFR or a BDR, which are not well known for 'accuracy' anyway. Oh there hard to beat for price, but not something that gets my blood pumping. Kind of like seeing yet another small block 350 Chevy in a 'Hot Rod', TOTAL yawn factor.

Lets say your at the car show. Parked next to Ron's (Computerworks) incredibly detailed Kirkham accurate right down to last nut and bolt is an FFR with a fuel injected 302. Now WHICH car would YOU spend more time 'studying', talking about, taking pictures off and LEARNING from?

Steve R · #16 (**permalink**) 08-21-2006, 11:49 AM

Ernie,
Sounds like you are taking this stuff way too seriously.

Lowell W · #17 (**permalink**) 08-21-2006, 11:50 AM

Quote:

Look at the early replicas and the attention to detail and the effort to make an accurate car that went into them. Workmanship and dedication like that has been lost, such is life, marketing will go on. The masses have spoken.

Oh...you mean like the Arntz Cobras?

You have your car the way you want; I'll have mine my way. If you're the kind of person who's irritated by a Windsor in my car, that's your problem; not mine! If my car isn't "original" enough for you, or "Real" enough for you, have a good time hanging out with the rest of the snobs. You won't be "studying" my car at the show 'cause I'll be out driving and enjoying it!

Lowell

Excaliber · #18 (**permalink**) 08-21-2006, 11:58 AM

Actually the Arntz\Butlers are an interesting interpretation and worth a second look. Snob? Just recognizing reality, sometimes the truth hurts. I may well buy back my old Excalibur at some point, and I WILL enjoy it for what it is. But I will never admire it with the same passion as I would a well thought out and well built accurate replica. Which are becoming more rare everyday, and THATS the truth and THATS the point!

Steve R · #19 (**permalink**) 08-21-2006, 12:16 PM

Ernie,
For me, it's the word "annoyed" that goes beyond enjoying a particular cup of tea. Now, if they come over and pour it on my head, THAT'S a different story!

GeorgiaSnake · #20 (**permalink**) 08-21-2006, 02:11 PM

Ken, I say go for it and post pictures after it's finished.

I would think the wiring will be the most difficult challenge.