Cleveland Heads?

[WardL]

What is the deal on the 351 Cleveland heads? I thought they were the better heads when they came out in '69 (?). I'm surprised they aren't more common or even preferred. Other than they made more Windsor heads, why aren't the Cleveland heads more popular? Thanks.

[LMH]

They are old school. Modern after market heads are much better now and out perform the old "Clevor" set up.
Larry

[bobcowan]

The 4V C heads are good for restricted racing classes. Otherwise, you can get better performance from an off the shelf alum head for slightly more money. The '69 heads are also in somewhat limited supply; they didn't make them for very many years.

There's really nothing wrong with them, and some people have been able to get very good performance from them. The aftermarket W heads are just easier.

[767Jockey]

Actually, the state of the art now are the aftermarket aluminum Cleveland heads coming out of Australia. It is rare that you will find any aftermarket aluminum Windsor heads that have the flow capacity and the port velocities of these heads. If you look at all the high horsepower Engine Masters small block Fords almost every one of them have Cleveland heads on them. They're also great for the street as well because the ports not only flow massive amounts of air but in the modern heads the flow velocities are way up as well. The reputation of the old Cleveland heads was that they were dogs at low RPM's, and to a certain extent that was true. The ports were huge, they flowed enormous amounts of air for a small block head, and with only 351 cubic inches pulling on them, the port velocities just weren't there.

However, with the advent of cheap and easy stroker engines, put 400+ inches of small block under the old iron heads and crazy horsepower starts happening. Keep in mind that the old 4V heads are essentially a big block head - huge ports, canted valves, etc. If memory serves me correctly it's the only factory small block head with canted valves. The "old school" iron OEM Ford heads will make almost as much power sitting on a stroker as most modern aluminum Windsor heads, and if you put some Aussie aluminum state of the art Cleveland heads on that engine, virtually nothing can touch them.

Why Australia, you may ask? Because just as the Cleveland was phased out here in the states for cost reasons and became somewhat rare, the Cleveland was the only small block Ford offered down under, so all the development on the Cleveland was down there because the Cleveland was the only real game in town - to a large extent it still is. I'm sure some of our Aussie friends can chime in here and fill in the details on that.

[WardL]

Great, now maybe I can justify a trip down under! Think I can get the aluminum heads in my suitcase? I knew them Cleveland heads were the best! I wonder if any Boss 302s had Cleveland heads or what was the production run on them?

[Jac Mac]

Originally Posted by WardL

Great, now maybe I can justify a trip down under! Think I can get the aluminum heads in my suitcase? I knew them Cleveland heads were the best! I wonder if any Boss 302s had Cleveland heads or what was the production run on them?

Boss 302 was the inspiration for the Cleveland.
Yes the heads will fit in a suitcase, but doesnt John Kaase act as an agent for the 3V alloy CHI heads in the USA?

[roadrod2000]

Originally Posted by WardL

Great, now maybe I can justify a trip down under! Think I can get the aluminum heads in my suitcase? I knew them Cleveland heads were the best! I wonder if any Boss 302s had Cleveland heads or what was the production run on them?

All Boss 302's had the "Cleveland" style heads, that is what made them so very different from a standard 302.

[CobraEd]

http://www.jegs.com/i/Edelbrock/350/61629/10002/-1



.

[Rebel1]

Whilst the Windsor heads have had major improvements over the years, so have the Cleveland heads. While the 4V is still available there are now other Cleveland style heads more suited to street use.
Look here: http://www.chiheads.com.au/

As stated, these heads are the choice of heads for engine master challenges. You must however be practical with your choice. If it is a street engine you are building the 3V heads are a good balance between the older 2V and 4V heads.

As stated crazy horsepower can be had with very streetable engines which will run rings around a Windsor headed engine. I've seen Top of the line Windsor heads taken off a healthy Windsor block and replaced by Chi heads. No other alteration except some timing adjustments and 50Hp magically appear on the dyno report. Same day, same engine, same dyno, different heads.

[cobrarkc]

Actually a well prepared set of iron heads will out perform any windsor head out here. Keith Craft set many national records with them. Aluminum heads are expensive now prices are going up, the weak dollar has driven the cost up right now but if you have the cash you can't beat The CHI or AFD heads out of Austrailia. Yes Jon Kaase sells them here and Mark McKeown of MME is also a dealer. If you want more info go the the Cleveland forum. http://www.network54.com/Forum/119419/

[Rebel1]

Originally Posted by cobrarkc

Aluminum heads are expensive now prices are going up, the weak dollar has driven the cost up right now but if you have the cash you can't beat The CHI or AFD heads out of Austrailia.

Oi cobrarkc, us aussies don't mind if you want to spend your hard earned in Oz.

[IKE]

I replaced my closed chamber Cleveland heads with CHI s I got from TMeyer and could not be happier with the results. The CHI s have a slightly larger chamber volume, that along with being aluminum has allowed me to run pump gas with my current cam. As an earlier post stated there is a lot of info on Cleveland forum site.