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Guess The HP & Torque Contest
How good are you? Guess the crank HP and Torque @ 6200 RPM and be the "expert" on this thread! I should have dyno results by the end of next week.
Bore & Stroke: 4.125" x 4.000" (427 CID) Compression Ratio: 10.3:1 Cylinder Block: Dart 31345235 Aluminum, 9.500 Deck Rotating Assembly: SCAT SuperLight Heads: Edelbrock Victor Jr Heads 70CC Bearings: Performance Clevite Dampner: Innovators West Aluminum SFI Oil Pump: Melling Hi-Vol Pulleys: March, Aluminum Performance Rockers: CompCam 1332-16 Pro-Magnum Roller Lifters: CompCam 8931-16 Pro-Magnum Roller Valves: Ferrea F6202 1.600 x 5.060 11/32 Exhaust, F6207 2.055 x 5.060 11/32 Intake Camshaft: CompCam 35-426-8 (2200-6200 rpm) Valve Springs: CompCam 928-16 Push Rods: CCA796016 7.650 5/16 Hi-Tech Timing: ProGear Timing Set PG-4138 Distributor: MSD 8578 Pistons: Custom 70cc dish Carburetion: 1 Willey's 4-barrel |
Cam is 288/294 duration, .555/.576 lift.
Compression ratio? Lots of variable though. Rough stab in the dark... about 515 HP, 525 ft/lbs. Sounds like a nice engine! Personally, I don't like HV oil pumps unless a huge pan is used but to each his own. Larry |
535ft/lbs 530hp
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CR is 10.3:1 (it was listed)
Oil pan, a big Aviaid Does the builder matter? Gessford :) |
The intake and port work on the heads do matter a lot.
I'll gamble on excellent port work and a good intake. @6200 rpm 470 lb-ft, which is 555 Hp. I believe that is what you asked @6200 --- not the peak numbers. |
Yes, the cam top end is spec'd at 6200 so I figure that's the practical redline = close on max HP anyways, torque is on the downhill slide by then - but I could live with 470 lb-ft :)
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What intake?
If the heads are out of the box heads with a valve job, I don't think the cam will pull up that high. Comp Cam's notes are not for the particular cubic inch displacement that you're running, but for the smallest in that category. So if you look at their catalog, look at the cams for a 351W, and pick one that will peak at 6200, then it may be close to that for a 351. For a 427, it will be a lot lower. I did a 425ci Windsor with those heads, a similar camshaft, and a Victor Jr. intake. Running about 10.25:1. It made about 485hp @5400. I would expect this one to be a little higher, probably around 510-520hp, but then there are stingy dynos and there are liberal dynos... |
Now I see the CR. Duh.. guess I should read it better before posting!
Larry |
All the gruesome details -
Work Performed Honed bore of Innovators West Dampner Intake port matched to heads Measured bearing clearances, used standard bearings and X-Std bearings to get oil clearances perfect Honed Big Ends of Rods Dialed in Bell Housing Pilot Bearing bored for TKO input shaft clearance Engine Block Final Boring Pistons Balanced Checked Balance on Rods Measured crankshaft journals, provided additional clearance work as needed Parts List Cylinder Block Dart 31345235 Aluminum Block 9.500 Deck for 4.125 Bore 351C/351W FP602S Deck Dowels For 351W Block Decks Rotating Assembly SuperLight Rotating Assembly 351C Mains 351W Rods 4.000" Stroke 6.250" Rods. Custom Pistons HN Rod Brgs and H Main Brgs Additional Mallory for internal Balance HM1.00 x 1.000 Additional Mallory for internal Balance HM .875" x 1.000 99999-HM Installed Mallory Labor Heads and Intake manifold Edelbrock Victor JR Heads 70CC 77389 Edelbrock 2981 Victor JR 1x4 Manifold Options/Requirements Performance Rod Bearings clevite CB-663 HN std. with Rotating Assy Performance Main Bearings MS 1010 H std. W/Rotating Assy DuraBond Performance Cam Bearing set for Dart Block 260-1028 Base Felpro Gasket Rebuild Set Felpro 1262 Intake gasket, 95110SG Victor 1022 & 1023 Felpro Head Gaskets (Aluminum EDE Victor Heads) Felpro 2921 Rear Seal Kit Performance Felpro 2331 Race Set remainder Felpro OS34508R Pan Set Victor 95177SG Exhaust Gasket Set ARP Oil Pump Drive Shaft 154-7901 Innovator west Aluminum SFI Dampner 4 bolt ser # 32831 # 204 690-028 Brass Pilot Bushing 289 Bored ID to .668" Melling Hi-Vol Oil Pump performance pump 10833 March 1610 Pulley Set Aluminum Performance Custom RaceTek Pistons 70CC Dish (cr 10.3:1) Roller Rocker Systems Comp Cams 1332-16 pro magnum roller rockers Cylinder Head Valve Train Components Ferrea F6202 1.600 x 5.060 11/32 Exhaust Valves Ferrea F6207 2.055 x 5.060 11/32 Intake Valves Camshaft & Lifter Comp 35-426-8 Camshaft Comp Cams 8931-16 Pro magnum roller lifters Comp 928-16 Valve Springs 614-16 +.050 & 611-16 Std Valve Keepers Comp 4700 Spring Cup set Comp 741-16 Steel retainers 4776-16 Comp Spring Seat Shims 38-532-55 Valve Stem Seal Positive camshaft thrust plate CCA796016 Push Rods 7.650 5/16 Hi-Tech ProGear Timing Set PG-4138 Transmission/Bell Housing/Clutch 11" Clutch - 5/16" Bolts - TKO 600 Setup 360850 McLeod 11 Pressure Plate Clutch 260871R McLeod 11" Performance reverse Disc 16031 Throw out Brg McLeod McLeod Flywheel Lt. Wt 463200 Neutral Balance 28-33# Steel SFI TCET4617 TKO 600 .82 5th Road Race Transmission ANR 2253 Trans Mount Lakewood Bell Hsg 15202 Lakewood Alignment Dowel set .014" offset Miscellaneous 7200-180 MCS Hi-Performance 180 Degree Thermostat Hi Torque 351WStarter (Gear Reduction) CVR 5055 ProTorque Alternator Bracket Pioneer Aluminum Timing Cover 500302s Spark Plugs 14MM 3/4" Reach flat gasket style 8585 brass dist gear for his 8352 Distributor Water Pump Edelbrock 8843 Fuel Log & Fittings, Carb Willey's Ignition Components MSD 8578 Distributor for Dart Block and Victor Intake Clearances MSD 8222 Blaster Coil Epoxy Filled MSD 6420 6AL Ignition Box MSD 8010 Dist Hold Down Bracket FMS M012259-M302 Black Wire Set Gessford Custom Wire Loom Setup - Side Mount Fasteners For Engine Assembly ARP Block Head Studs for DART as follows: AR36201LB Stud 1/2 x 3.62 90# W/ARP Lube AR54L Stud 1/2" x 5.4 LG 2008514 Washer 1/2x7/8x.120" no chamfer 3008304 Nut 1/2-20 12PT ARP Head Stud Kit 154-4203 1/2" SBF ARP 554-9503 Accessory Bolt Kit ARP 612-2000 (2) 612-3500 (2) for Water Pump ARP 612-2000 5/16-18 2.5 ARP 612-3500 5/16-18 3.5 ARP Dampner Bolt ARP 454-2101 Intake Bolt set ARP 334-7203 R/A Studs 7/16-2.12 chg to 1.90" 200-7201 255-1002 ARP cam bolt 100-2801 ARP flywheel bolts 200-8558 ARP Washer set 150-2201 ARP Pressure Plate Bolt Set MRG 6087 Oil Pan Bolt Set MRG 1516 Fuel Pump Block Off Plate Aviaid Oil Pan 351W 55356 Aviaid Oil Dip Stick Setup Dart Block Harrison Tank, mounts & straps |
Quote:
It will probably peak at about 6500. I'll guess 530 hp / 450 ftlbs at the flywheel at 6200. |
I was wondering if there was a little margin on that cam spec, nice to hear that confirmed. Also found out the Willy's carb is #62502 (650 CFM) with "race floats" for what it's worth.
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650CFM seems a bit skinny for that much motor. What were the thoughts on going small on the carb? My guess is it will peak at 490HP at 5,000 or so and go down hill to 450 at 6,200. With an 850 CFM carb I would guess at 40-50 more horses to about 530 at 5,600 and then still be over 500 at 6,200.
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That is what Gessford decided for that motor, I was thinking 650 is a little skinny too.
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Still show no head work. If any port work was done on the heads/intake do you have flow figures?
If none, then I'm with Brent; I think this big inch puppy will be under-cammed, under-headed and under-carbed to reach 6200 and still be gaining power. I look for it to basically sign off at about 5800 and be 500hp/450tq. I hope I'm wrong but with lots of inches breathing through unported heads (even Victors) I wouldn't expect the RPM. It'll be a monster down low though. |
I think I know why Gessford chose the Willy's 650 CFM carb size. When they were working through the engine build, some Comp Cam engineers were brought into the discussion. Gessford was working out the Comp Cam component set for a "spec motor". I didn't know what that meant at the time (and still don't), but the Willy's carb description below makes further reference to "spec motor" in the IMCA context.
Willy's HP Gas Carburetor WCD62502 Holley HP 650 mainbody, gloss black powder coating, 750 baseplate w/stainless steel butterflies and Teflon bushed throttle shafts, 1.250" venturi, externally adjustable metering blocks. The new WCD62501 and WCD62502 are the most powerful carbs available for the IMCA SPEC motor. These new carbs offer instant throttle response and more torque for the open wheeled modified driver. |
I believe you will indeed have instant throttle response. Not saying you wont be happy with it on the street. But that carb is apparently designed for a 360 cubic inch motor.
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500 square
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While it is on the dyno, maybe you can try a larger carb and see what the difference is.
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I think I'll ask Gessford why the 650 CFM.
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Here's a calculator that says maybe 650 CFM is right for that motor -
Carburetor Size Calculator Load in the data then run your cursor over the generated bar graphs, you'll get specific CFM for VE and RPM. |
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