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Question for Owners of Originals
When does an original cobra stop becoming an original?
When I was in the market for an original '67 GTO the first thing I did was buy a Matching Number Guide for GM Classics. That gave me VIN, sequence number, part number and serial numbers for the major components. Once I had those, any '67 goat claiming to be original was scrutinized for engine and transmission ID's with the same sequence number as the chassis VIN, and the rear axle/differential’s dates code and casting numbers corresponded to the vehicle and year listed in the guide. I found one and enjoyed it for 7 years before selling it as a matching number car for a slight profit. I remember the carb was the toughest nut to crack, in '67 GM went from a Holley to a Rochester, early '67's had the Holley and mine had a Rochester - it took some time to ferret it out but I did. That 400 CID Y-block had 280K miles on it and was never rebuilt. So when does an original cobra stop becoming an original? What do the collectors of original cobras look for before buying? Just curious, it seems there is no standard that is followed with the collector market in general, and the SAAC appears to be silent on the subject regarding original cobras. |
SAAC isn't silent on the subject, the entire registry is proof of it. It has established some working definitions which are:
Original: Main frame tubes and pieces carrying the serial number stampings have not been replaced or altered and were produced between 1962 and 1968. Original/Restored: A car having less than 50% of it's original substructure or bodywork replaced but not the main frame tubes or pieces carrying the still existing serial number stampings. Original/Rebodied: A car having more than 50% of it's original substructure or bodywork replaced but not the main frame tubes or pieces carrying the still existing serial number stampings. Reconstruction: A car that has been rebuilt substantially to original specs, even replacement of main frame tubes but where some part of the car existed prior to reconstruction. Traceable documentation must be present. Air Car: A car built from scratch, no original or legit documentation or serial numbers. Now it might not be above some owners to misrepresent their cars as something they aren't for obvious reasons ($) but the registry exists to keep track of each car. Larry |
Go to the source, SAAC.
Buy a Registry. You'll have fewer questions at the end of the 1,618 page read. ;) |
Thanks for the info Larry, I don't have a registry and do not intend to buy one (rodneym) :) So the condition of the substructure and body determines degree of originality, essentially what AC provided and the degree that it has remained in tact (my take on it). Motor, transmission and rearend accountability not part of it. I wonder if 2nd gen vettes (1963–1967) follow a similar criteria, just a curiosity and nothing more. That matching number guide for GM classics I mentioned earlier had a vette section in it with the same traceability info as the GTO.
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Huge difference between vettes and Cobras. Vettes enjoyed a relatively stable production run each year for the most part and had the might of GM behind the parts supply. On the Cobra production line(s) things were swapped out as needed, when needed and sometimes there was little to no documentation.
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Larry |
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And yes, it does pretty much boil down to what AC Cars Ltd supplied back in the day to a degree. Of course, numbers matching original drivetrain plays a role in the cars originality and has a big effect on it's value but most original cars are not really very "original" any more. Bodies have been repaired, brakes have been changed, engines have been fixed, rebuilt, altered and so on. I saw a car that the owner told me was totally original and there's three different SW gauges of different years in the dash. It's still an original car though.
Larry |
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I found this for the C2 vettes The Corvette C2 Registry Note: listing is by year (upper left) that you can select from '63-'67. Not a lot of detail there but I didn't dig into the site either. |
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Nice to see that there is record of each car if the owner wants to have it listed. Larry |
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National Corvette Restorers Society |
I think we must get over the matching # nonsense and a Cobra might be a good start because non of them were alike. Get a car you like, drive it. Make extra money by investing in good shares on the stock market if you are afraid you loose money on the car purchase.
Cars are meant to be driven, hence they are called "automobiles". The worst I read in the 90s was a Chevy which was extra rare because it had a 3-speed manual instead of a 4-speed. Get a life and put a 4-speed in it! I hope owners of 60s cars get over themselves and just drive them. Pity that so many went to convert their 427s to SC look, which, ironically, made them look like Replicas... That said, I find that the purchase of a higher "continuation SC" number, 3058 and up, is good value for money. You may find one just slightly more expensive than a CSX4000. I got one offered a while back, with no engine. I could get a Chevy 454 for it... ;-) Sorry, I am too weak today to lift the latest registry and check the correct terminology. |
A little information sharing Dominik, nothing more, don't read so much into it.
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:-)
No worries, have a nice sunday! |
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