Oil recommendations

[mikeinatlanta]

double post

[zrayr]

This enough hot oil pressure for ya ?



BTW, not mentioned recently is the primary benefit to running a quality synthetic: Less Friction = a longer lasting engine.

Z

[bobcowan]

too much pressure for a SBF. It takes a lot of energy to make that much pressure - wasted energy. And it puts a lot of strain on the drive shaft. You run a high risk of shearing the pin on the drive gear.

[DAVID GAGNARD]

Originally Posted by bobcowan

too much pressure for a SBF. It takes a lot of energy to make that much pressure - wasted energy. And it puts a lot of strain on the drive shaft. You run a high risk of shearing the pin on the drive gear.

I was thinking the same thing,talking to some of the most respected engine builders in the country and Ford SVT people, they pretty much all agree that anything from 50 psi to 60 psi at full throttle is more than enough oil pressure for a SBF engine......

One engine builder that builds SBF engines for racing that have a 9,000 rpm rev limiter has his engines running no more than 65 psi at 9,000 rpms...

My race engine oil pressure was 60 psi at 7,000 rpms and that was at 220 to 240 degrees of oil temp during a 30 minute road race,ran 8 seasons like that on the same engine with zero problems....

[zrayr]

Originally Posted by bobcowan

too much pressure for a SBF. It takes a lot of energy to make that much pressure - wasted energy. And it puts a lot of strain on the drive shaft. You run a high risk of shearing the pin on the drive gear.

The pin shearing is one of the oldest old wives tales. When a pin shears it's because something jammed the oil pump gears. Period.

As far as wasted energy, at 6,000 rpm I was down 2.7 HP when I changed to a Melling HV oil pump. I can spare that. As cruisg RPM the different was zero.

I've been building SBF engines for over 45 years, and using the HV pumps for the last 15 years, along with Mobil 1 15w-50, I've been setting up ththe engines for power and reliability for long distance endurance runs. So far I've had zero engine issues. Zero blown engines after running flat out for about 140 miles over and over again is proof enough for me that this combinatin works very very well

Z

[Gaz64]

The pin can shear from the drag the pump offers against rotation.

Usually with thick cold oil run to high rpm too early.

Larger pump with the same driveshaft/pin. Something will give.

[zrayr]

I do use Mobil 1 0w-40 in the winter, resulting in zero difference in oil
Pressure vs. the Mobil 1 15w-50 the rest of the year

Just want to add that one thing I've learned over the years, is that are very few hard and fast rules as it pertains to ones engine building methodology. In other words, there's more than one "right" way to do things and end up with successful results .

Z

[zrayr]

Originally Posted by Gaz64

The pin can shear from the drag the pump offers against rotation.

Usually with thick cold oil run to high rpm too early.

Larger pump with the same driveshaft/pin. Something will give.

Anyone that would give a cold engine full rpm deserves some grief. A little common sense goes a long way, especially where engine longevity is concerned.

Z

[Morris]

Originally Posted by zrayr

I do use Mobil 1 0w-40 in the winter, resulting in zero difference in oil
Pressure vs. the Mobil 1 15w-50 the rest of the year

Z

You might want to try Mobil 1 5w50 in the summer or we use Mobil 1 racing 0w50 in KMP259 all of the time, very high in ZDDP.

[zrayr]

Good suggestion.

The racing oil offers great protection. I'm not sure it's worth the extra cost as I am not having any heat or wear issues with the less expensive Mobil 1 15w-50. If there were more at stake beyond my personal enjoyment I would switch to it without hesitation.

Z

[Gaz64]

Originally Posted by zrayr

This enough hot oil pressure for ya ?



BTW, not mentioned recently is the primary benefit to running a quality synthetic: Less Friction = a longer lasting engine.

Z

Originally Posted by bobcowan

too much pressure for a SBF. It takes a lot of energy to make that much pressure - wasted energy. And it puts a lot of strain on the drive shaft. You run a high risk of shearing the pin on the drive gear.

Too much for liking. At 180F, idling at 900, I'd be happy with 20-30psi.
10 psi per 1000 rpm is a rule I've gone by for years.

Ray, if you have 70 at hot idle, what is your max pressure?

[RET_COP]

Here is something else to think about. It may not pertain to most but for guys that are looking to get the best out of their engine even if it's in our minds try this...
Everyone is talking about viscosity and the drag on the oil pump. How about this.. Oil gets whipped up and fills with tiny air bubbles. Those air bubbles unlike oil are compressible. Take 50W oil for instance, the air bubbles will stay in suspension alot longer than in 30W oil. Now take the column of oil in a hydraulic lifter especially if you are running the plunger close to the top with .150" of oil. What happens at hi rpms? and strong spring pressures? COMPRESSION/COLLAPSE and loss of power. Lighter oil releases the air bubbles quicker. Now of you have a cheap lifter and the clearances are not built to close tolerances the oil will leak past the body and the plunger causing loss of lift and possible collapse. Thats when 40-50w oil is needed, just like loose bearing clearances. It depends on how your engine was built and the parts used as in the lifter case.
I know this is just usless information to most but is something to think about for some.
I run 175lbs. on the seat and 450lbs on the nose of my hydraulic cam. Oil recommendation for my lifters is 30w and I run them down pretty low so there is not alot of oil in the body. This is they way I like to run my engine and it has good power right to the intended rpm limit and beyond.
Run the lightest oil your engine needs and NO more-- whatever that my be.
warning___this is just my opinion not intended to knock anyone's theory of fact, for added conversation........ and it is not baseless.

[zrayr]

Originally Posted by Gaz64

Too much for liking. At 180F, idling at 900, I'd be happy with 20-30psi.
10 psi per 1000 rpm is a rule I've gone by for years.

Ray, if you have 70 at hot idle, what is your max pressure?

My photos are slightly misleading: when the car is fully warmed up BY DRIVING IT SLOWLY, the idle oil pressure goes down to 66. At cruising It will hit 90 for a minute when it is warm, but not what I consider hot. I take it easy until it maxes out at 80. The hot oil pressure maxes out at 78 to 80. I have the adjustable pressure relief spring set at 95 to 100. These numbers are identical whether I'm using Mobil 1 15w-50 or Mobil 1 0w-40. Up to now I've only used the 0w-40 in the winter. I'm not ready for an oil change yet so I'm inclined to keep it in there for a while longer this time.

As an interesting aside, these numbers are almost exactly what a stock well set up 1960's/1970's era Triumph 650cc twin will run at

The Melling pump I'm using is the high performance version of their high volume pump part number 10688 with their chrome moly oil pump shaft.

I don't have to be concerned with any perceived cavitation / hydraulic ilfter issues as referenced in a post above. I have solid lifters sourced fromcomp cams and using their EDM oiling hole (in the face)

Z

[Morris]

Originally Posted by zrayr

Good suggestion.

The racing oil offers great protection. I'm not sure it's worth the extra cost as I am not having any heat or wear issues with the less expensive Mobil 1 15w-50. If there were more at stake beyond my personal enjoyment I would switch to it without hesitation.

Z

Before the racing oil came out with the real high ZDDP numbers, we use to use half & half, Mobil 1 20w50 V-Twin Harley oil and Mobil 1 15w50 for that added protection of ZDDP. The racing oil is so much better for start-up 0w50.

[zrayr]

I'm very tempted to try it, but the 500 mile oil change recommendation is a little troublesome to my wallet.

Z

[CBattaglia]

Originally Posted by Marc Wulf

Hi all,
Getting ready to change oil for the first time.Don't know what's in it,but it's a 351W 400 h.p. Car is in Fla year round and driven on weekends.Also should mention,driven like a Cobra should be.Any advice on oil would be greatly appreciated.

I use Don Liugi. You won't find better!

[cycleguy55]

I've switched from 20W50 dino oil (previous owner's recommendation) to 5W30 synthetic. I'm running a Melling High Volume pump (M84DHV) and a custom pan from Armando's Racing Oil Pans in my BBF. Here's what I get:

• Cold: 70-75 PSI
• Hot (190°-200° F coolant and oil temperatures): 50-55 PSI @ 2,500 RPM

Not a lot of experience since the change, but the engine seems to turn over / start easier and run just a bit cooler - roughly 10° F.

I think I'm good.