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and another thing
Isn't Canfield and AFR connected in some way?
Eric :MECOOL: |
no. Canfield heads are available before AFR.
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How about?
Arao makes these bad boys! Break out your check book!
http://www.araoengineering.com/Ford/frdsmb.htm Eric :MECOOL: |
Thanks for the great info guys! It is clear to me now that I need to upgrade my heads. It looks like the wallet is going to take a beating again in the near future.
The AFR's "appear" to be a great choice, if one were to believe the article. . . and the canfields have the proven 20 degree design . . . but those arao's . . . wow! Imagine 32 valves in a hemi-headed Windsor stroked out to roughly 410 c.i. That would make even my big-block chevy and mopar buddies sit up and take notice! I would guess those heads aren't very streetable, but they would definitely get the nod-of-approval visually. One thing is certain, I need to subscribe to MM & FF. I have been missing out on a lot of good info. And I agree Gary, they need to include those really big breathers in the comparison. Charlie |
Yep!
MM&FF is a great mag.
I have little time to read, but I will read that mag cover to cover. I just wish they had more FF's in it instead of all Mustangs. Eric :MECOOL: |
Re: Oops
Quote:
Just in case you find yourself needing a still higher power-to-weight ratio... |
I have seen those 32 valve heads in magazines years ago, for chevies. I have never seen a set in person, on anything, ever. Pricey though!
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Hey Fixit!
Yeah,
I see em over at the track (One Mustang used them at the World Ford Challenge) now and again. But you have to need to move some serious air to make use of them. On the other hand, they look very cool under your hood, and they aught to! :eek: I could see a Dart block, with Windsor journals, and a 4.100 stroke out to 450 something cubes and those heads with a .600 lift cam. Man THAT would make a motor! You'd have 20 large in it, but what the heck!....:LOL: Eric |
which set of 32V heads are these? The ones with DOHC's, or the ones that use a custom set of rockers (heavy) with stock pushrods and in-block cam?
If pushrods activating heavy rocker heads, even with 32V's, don't expect too much rpm-wise. It'll be a low-range engine. Good luck finding replacement parts in a few years. If it's a true DOHC on the other hand... |
from the website
"The pushrods see approximately the same pressure as in a two valve operation. This is due to the generally lower valve lift, and the generally less radical cam profile with the 4 valve configuration."
That's what it says... Eric :MECOOL: |
I just read that Ford SVO has come out with a new head, supposedly to fill the gap between their GT-40X heads and the race-only Yates heads. It supposedly flows much better and is perfect for the strokers, though maybe still not as good as the AFR heads.
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Does anyone still care about the stroker dyno results?
408 forged everything CompCams XE282HR hydraulic cam Speed Demon 750 Edelbrock RPM Air-Gap (DUAL PLANE guys) AFR 185 heads 10.25:1 (pump gas okay if it's 94) 508fwhp 540lb-ft without crappy weather (90F degrees) correction. Eric was the first guy I talked to w/ AFR heads at DVSF-II, put the bug in my ear. Our car will idle at 300rpm no kidding but it's one of the meanest things you ever heard. Likes to idle at 600 though and scream to RPMs I don't want to screw with. Making over 500lb-ft from the start of the dyno pull (3000) to 5800, still making 495 at 6000. Can't keep 295's on the ground, but looking forward to the experience of drag radials... Our dyno guy said w/ a set of 205 afr's, a single plane intake, and a bigger carb, we'd see 600hp. BUT... This guy likes to spend a few hours knocking down the CNC marks on the AFR heads. He showed me numbers from his flow bench and he can get 30 more feet of flow by doing this. He said if that's all he did to our motor, it'd be making 525-540hp. I thought it was BS, but he showed me dyno sheets from similar head re-workings. Un-real. Stroker, Holley or Demon, decent intake, AFR heads, you can't lose...that cam is a sweet puppy too...:3DSMILE: |
by the way would like to pull out that dual plane once, put a 6600rpm chip in the box and see if things are that noticeably different.
one thing to remember is that when you're dealing with a 2400 pound car, the difference between 500HP and 520HP is like the difference between a stock Geo Metro and a Metro running a Cold-Air-Intake and split-fire plugs. If you're makin' 450+ horse you're going to pi$$ yourself the first time you give it half throttle in first. |
I read a couple of great SBF performance head comparison articles. One was on fordmuscle.com. I had to buy a month's membership for $5 to read it, but it was well worth it. I had to decide whether I would keep my TFS heads or change to Edlebrocks. The article was clear that the Twisted Wedge head is a great product. Mine will receive additional porting to match the new Vic Jr. intake. Jeremy spent the better part of a day porting and polishing the intake and will do the same on the heads. Now if I can decide on a carb, I'll be cooking. Speed Demon or Mighty
Demon? |
Speed Demon should be more than adequate I believe. I ran one on my 408 with Twisted wedge heads...almost 11/1 compression and a Weiand Stealth manifold. It performed well. No problems with gas as long as the engine is built with a zero deck height and all the combustion is in the head and not down in the cylinder...no pinging whatsoever ( although this has nothing to do with the carb ). The only problem I had with the Demon was hard stopping....it tended to flood out and wanted to stall no matter how I adjusted the floats. I also had problems with the float bowl screws stripping out. The aluminum body on a Demon is much softer than the zinc on Holleys and the early Demons had 12-20 screws that barely grabbed with 4 threads when fully tightened.....Newer units have about 8 more threads on the screws...still not great, but better.
I ended up changing back to an Edelbrock (AFB) 750 and basic as it is I love it...it never screws up and by the feel of it makes as much power as any other carb I've run.. ( next try is a Holley 950 Commander fuel injection that's sitting here... I hear the throttle response on them is great..):) |
fxbill, was your 750 mechanical or vacuum? I don't want to pay the extra money on a Demon unless there is a noticable difference over a Holley. I've been told by several to save my money and go with a Holley vacuum carb since I do all my driving on the street.
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Our dyno guy swears by a Holley any day over a Demon. He had his dyno holley out on loan the day we dyno'd but he swore he could get us 15-20 horse, better temps, better everything with an out of box holley of similar build to speed demon 750.
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Hi Tony,
Mine was a mechanical secondary. I've also run a Holley 830CFM double pumper and a Holley Avenger 770CFM on the same engine. No, I did not feel any difference between the Demon and the Holley. As far as I'm concerned they're the same carb. The Avenger was $100 less but with vacuum secondaries and you WILL notice a difference between a double pumper and one with vacuum secondaries although for street driving they're fine. I had problems getting the secondaries to open quick enough with the Avenger even with the lightest spring supplied with the carb. Although it ran smoothly and worked well right out of the box the 1407 Edelbrock kicks it's butt and there's a seat of the pants difference between the two. I sold both the Demon and the Avenger on Ebay recently and stuck with the Edelbrock. The nicest thing about the two that I sold is that they bring decent money on Ebay! The Edelbrock sells for $175 rebuilt from Edelbrock and there's sure not $250 performance difference between them. Not trying to sway you from what you want, but the 1407 outperforms them all on my engine... |
Thanks guys, this is good stuff. This hobby (like most) is filled with passionate opinions with regards to manufacturers, configurations etc. It's great to communicate with folks who have gone to the expense and effort to try different set ups and share the results. It's too easy to spend extra money in pursuit of results that don't happen. I'll look up the stats on a 1407.
Thanks! |
I think you'll find the 1407 to be a great carb. It's nothing more than an old venerable AFB with Edelbrock's or Weber's name on it. They never leak..( the top comes off the carb instead of the ends...no gaskets below the fuel level). The metering rods can be changed without disassembling the carb and the very few times in 30 years that I've ever had a problem with an AFB on the road I've been able to pull of the side of the road, take a screwdriver, pop the top of the carb off and rig it on the spot to get me where I'm going.....Try that with a Holley!....no offense ...I own Holleys too and they're great, but we all have our preferences, lol.:)
There's also a new Edelbrock carb out that you might want to look at. It's a remake of the old AVS ( adjustable venturi system) that has an easy to adjust seconday venturi that can be adjusted to open the secondaries at any point that you like. it's called the Thunder series.. I'm carbed out for the moment, but I've had old AVS's from the past ( in a spread bore configuration) and they perform very well. As soon as I can I'll be anxious to try the new one... |
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