Texas Title, Registration and Emissions Questions

[elmariachi]

This question is for those who have direct experience:

I live in Houston/Harris Cty and am looking at building a kit or possibly buying a finished roller, either of which will be powered by my recently-acquired, now-being-rebuilt '66 side oiler. I have had some less-than-productive conversations with a couple of State agencies in Austin about titling, registration and emissions. For those of you in Houston and/or DFW:

1. Are these kit cars with old FE engines in fact subject to the emissions requirements and if so, how are you getting around them?

2. Are your cars titled as later model assembled vehicles or actual '60's era Cobras?

The State is telling me that in the case of a kit, it will be titled as a 2008 Assembled Vehicle, and be subject to 2008 emissions. In the case of the roller, it will be titled as the year shown on the roller title, and should a title not exist, it too will be registered as a 2008. In both cases it will be subject to 2008 emissions. And should I take the later route of offering up no title and representing it as "scratch-built," I then have to fill out 4 State forms, have it safety inspected, submit pencil tracings of relevant engine serial #s, and even have it weighed. All just to get a 2008 title.

The State's position regarding emissions:

Kit Kars
Vehicles have to meet the emissions standards for the year the vehicle is assembled. Vehicle manufacturers have to certify that their vehicles meet EPA emissions standards. A lot of kit car manufacturers also comply with this requirement. If you purchase one of these kit cars, follow the instructions on assembly, including the emissions components. You should be able to pass an emissions test just like any other new car.

And regarding the older engine:

Just as the EPA does not allow an individual to reverse engineer a vehicle to defeat emission standards, they do not allow an individual to build a brand new "old" vehicle to bypass emissions standards. It is possible if you actually use old parts (like a 1965 engine, or complete 60s frame and powertrain) that the vehicle will be registered as that model year (replica), but this is a TxDOT issue. However it is registered, is how DPS inspection stations will test it.

Problem with that is, TXDOT said that a newly-assembled car with a 1966 engine would still be titled as a 2008.

Having been in the car business in Texas previously, I know all about titling and registering cars, but this is absolute BS. So any recent or relevant experience appreciated, and feel free to PM or email me offline if you have creative advice.

Thanks,

Jim

[Cobrabill]

Register it out of state as a 65 and transfer it to Texas later.

[bdeutsch]

kind of funny in a round about way....

BOb

[elmariachi]

Originally Posted by Cobrabill

Register it out of state as a 65 and transfer it to Texas later.

Okay, sure. So tell me which state and how to do it given that I live in Texas and not somewhere else.

Originally Posted by bdeutsch

Texas is Taking Lessons from California? kind of funny in a round about way....

BOb

My thoughts exactly.

[Cobrabill]

Arizona registers Kit cars as the year they replicate for instance.E-mail me off line

[elmariachi]

Houston, TX.

[madmaxx]

As usual all the people you have spoke to are dumb fuks. The law clearly states it will be titled as a 2008 assembled vehicle and under remarks it will say replica 1965 ford. That absolves you of emissions.

#2 YOU DO NOT PAY SALES TAX THE FIRST TIME YOU REGISTER AN ASSEMBLED VEHICLE IN TEXAS. Reference motor vehicle tax manual 1d, or since I am nice
http://www.window.state.tx.us/taxinfo/audit/mv/1d.htm

I scanned the law as far as replica but to no surprise it will not let me post, it is to large like my whacker i will try to save under my album

[elmariachi]

Originally Posted by madmaxx

As usual all the people you have spoke to are dumb fuks. The law clearly states it will be titled as a 2008 assembled vehicle and under remarks it will say replica 1965 ford. That absolves you of emissions.

You can say that again. I told someone earlier now I know whay Charles Whitman carried that rifle up to the top of the clock tower in Austin.

But the only way I can see to get the "1965 Ford" in under the remarks is if I surrender an MSO from a new kit. The title of the roller I am looking at doesn't mention anything other than 2006 AV.

You are correct on the taxes, not worried about that.

Originally Posted by Cobrabill

E-mail me off line

You've got mail.

[madmaxx]

I tried to post to my gallery after resizing to no avail. It bewilders me. I will email to my work tomorrow. PM with you email and I will email the law scanned pages from texas tax law and everything you need to title. I wishied I could have posted here because it comes up once a month it seams.

Get your inspection certificate to say 1965, get your insurance card to say 1965 and if possilbe get a new mso to say 1965 if not take documentaion demonstrating car replicates 1965 and you will be good to go. my files are 900kb if anyone knows a secret

[elmariachi]

Originally Posted by madmaxx

Get your inspection certificate to say 1965, get your insurance card to say 1965 and if possilbe get a new mso to say 1965 if not take documentaion demonstrating car replicates 1965 and you will be good to go. my files are 900kb if anyone knows a secret

I think I can get the inspection to say 1965. There's no way to get an MSO from the manufacturer. Check your PM for my email address, you can send me the files.

[madmaxx]

I just emailed you the documents. It is easy to get your insurance to say 1965 also, they write whatever you want. In reality that is all you need for inspection, when the inspection station asks for your insurance card not your title but for resale value get the title correct with 1965 replica under remarks.

What other states do or do not do is irrevalent. I used the courthouse off 225 in pasadena, they checked every receipt and had the tax book out for 20 minutes came out and said that will be $105. I had all my paperwork, receipts and the car described the same on all forms expect I tried to bs them to title as 1965 which they nicely crossed out and wrote 2008 but wrote 1965 replcia under remarks. Antoher courthouse wanted me to get a chassis number the stupid fuks did not realize the MSO specified the chassis number. Instead of educating the dumb a$$$ i went to a courthouse I knew had done it before.

[madmaxx]

I get so furious when people have such a hard time with these courthouses, I mean where else can you stand in line to give money away and not get anything in return. I got a stop you have my blood boiling

[madmaxx]

It makes perfect sense you should not pay sales tax the first time you register a car. GM,Ford,chrysler, etc do not pay sales tax it is the second owner who pays it which is the customers on the sales lots. If gm never sold a vehicle they would not have to pay taxes. The paid taxes, shipping and accrued expenses while assembling.

[elmariachi]

Originally Posted by madmaxx

I just emailed you the documents.

I got them thanks. They match what the Gestapo sent me today. I have no problem taking the assembled vehicle route, though the footnote about it being a '65 Cobra replica was the debate that left me concerned. The idiots at the DMV said that even with that footnote, it would have to pass emissions if it were assembled in 2008. But to your point, the plan seems to be about getting insurance as a '65 first, then getting it safety-only inspected a '65 using the insurance card. That would seem to once and for all solve the emission issue. Then I apply for an AV title and make sure my docs are in order.

[Joe Wicked]

You can upload the pictures to a free photobucket account and then post them here. They give you a link to use for each picture.

[madmaxx]

Joe,

PM me your email, I will email the documents and maybe you can post, i have no clue.

[madmaxx]

as you say the idiot at dmv, they are not the ones doing the inspection and have no clue, let them feel rightious getting in ther 1988 escort. Get it titled with replica 1965 under remarks and you are good to go. The key is to have everything in order, and their are a couple forms that have to be notorized. I would have your inspection station write 2006 assembled vehicle and in paranthesis write (1965 replica) then it leads the lambs at the courthouse in the right direction. Long story short the way i found out about this is i was looking at a used spf and he did not have it titled with the remarks. It was simple for him to correct but it took 8 weeks and he sold it out from under me since i would not give him a penny until the title was clean. worked out better anyways

[Francis]

This is a common question, and the latter posts are accurate. I recently went through this process in Feb 08 in TX - dallas area. I have contact # for all agencies that you can call and get the correct information. you can email me directly though this site.

Also, the reason you don't have to pay car sales tax (6.25% in dallas) on the car when you first register it, is that it assumes you paid the purchase sales tax on the components (8.25%).

Francis

[SSSammy]

Jim, print off this post I did a year ago. It describes the steps in the TX ASVE process:

Texas registration - engine age

You don't actually have to have an MSO if you fill out all the forms and take tracings of the "VIN" and the engine VIN if it has one. Things will go smoothly if you have purchase receipts or bill of sale for chassis, engine, trans, paint, etc. You will sign a certification that *you* built the car yourself.

First step is insurance, then inspection, then title and registration. Your insurance guy should cooperate with putting the description as 1965 Ford Replica on the insurance card. That will get it inspected as a 65. Technically, the civilian inspection stations are not supposed to be doing these newly built, non-compliant cars. You may have one that agrees to do it, but the DPS says the correct process is to bring it to one of their Waiver Stations and have them do it. Do whatever you can get away with, the title and registration people just want the green sheet.

good luck,
Sam

[madmaxx]

the title and registration people just want the green sheet.

BINGO!!!!!!!!!