460 oil pressure eye-opener!

Tom Wells · #1 (**permalink**) 05-17-2010, 10:22 AM

Here's a link to a thread in the 460ford web site's Jon Kaase forum:

http://www.460ford.com/forum/showthread.php?t=145132

If you have a 460, you probably are aware of (Engine Masters winner, BBF and RBBBF (really big bbf

builder) ) Jon Kaase.

If you follow this forum, you probably are aware of oil pressure problems with some of the 500+ cubic inch 385 series Cobras in road race situations.

You probably also are aware that the Canton road race pan for the 460 doesn't work! Oil pressure drops drastically in turns.
An Accusump (luckily, Canton makes the Accusump - imagine that

) is often necessary to keep oil pressure up when road racing the 385 series.

Anyway, read the whole thread, contribute your experiences, and see if there can be a good solution to this problem.

Tom

PurpleVenom · #2 (**permalink**) 05-17-2010, 11:59 AM

I have the canton pan, front sump, and have not had issues thus far, street or on the track. I actually paid attention to this when I was at Putnam in April and saw no fluctuations in the pressure. I have this pan - http://www.cantonracingproducts.com/...ion&key=15-764 and the 15-763 pickup on my 460.

Here is how I received it:

Here is a picture of the baffle before modification:

And after:

I did the modification to clear the pickup assembly as I put the pan on with the engine in the car. I liked this pan due to low ground clearance and having the trap doors and baffling. And before the argument starts on front sump vs. rear sump - I have experienced no issues on road courses nor drag strip, it works for me and my car.

HTH,
Tim

Cobra75 · #3 (**permalink**) 05-17-2010, 01:20 PM

Indy,
We're about to install a 545 ci 460 with a Canton #13-766 Drag race pan. I noticed on the dyno sheet (below), a similar oil pressure drop from 72.6 PSI @4400 rpm to 66.8 PSI @6000 rpm. Certainly not as dramatic as Kaase's experience which went from 60 to 48 PSI but at much higher RPMs. I'm not sure I should be concerned since ~66 PSI at 6000 is very satisfactory.

What say you?

Elder

Tom Wells · #4 (**permalink**) 05-17-2010, 02:34 PM

Tim,

Thanks - your pan is quite different from mine - maybe I should try to get Canton to swap mine for that one. I have the 15-764 which was the only suitable one available in 2001 when the engine was assembled.

Mine looks completely different - has four trap doors and didn't require any mods.

Wonder what happened?

Maybe I will call and ask...

Tom

Randy Rosenberg · #5 (**permalink**) 05-17-2010, 05:29 PM

A couple of guys about 10+years ago were having problems with their oil pressure going too low during long left hand turns (ie: The carousel @ sear's pt and turn #2 @ thunderhill). I observed this as well with my 460. To solve the problem, Craig Hill made some modifications to my Avaiad pan (which he recommended as an upgrade from the stock canton pan) and installed a 3qt accusump.

mdross1 · #6 (**permalink**) 06-12-2010, 04:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Randy Rosenberg

A couple of guys about 10+years ago were having problems with their oil pressure going too low during long left hand turns (ie: The carousel @ sear's pt and turn #2 @ thunderhill). I observed this as well with my 460. To solve the problem, Craig Hill made some modifications to my Avaiad pan (which he recommended as an upgrade from the stock canton pan) and installed a 3qt accusump.

I have been thinking about installing the Accusump on my car because of it sitting for months on end in cold weather.Always think about that first startup every spring.

mdross1 · #7 (**permalink**) 08-14-2010, 06:07 AM

Have not noticed oil pressure drop with Canton pan will keep an eye peeled now that car is being used.

FWB · #8 (**permalink**) 08-14-2010, 06:49 AM

the pan isn't the only factor in the 460 loosing oil pressure. the 460 is essentially a truck motor designed for a mild hydraulic cam, low rpm usage. when a high lift cam is introduced the oiling holes in the lifter bores get exposed on max lift and full oil pressure is lost thru the passage resulting in the pan quickly getting sucked dry. extra capacity helps, accusump helps but the source is usually in the lifter galley. when using solid cams in the 460 it is often wise to bore out and bush the lifter bores to eliminate the problem. high lift hydraulic cams also expose the galley. a restricter is often needed.

just my two cents, from wiping out bearings at the dragstrip and finally after two motors finding the problem on the test stand.....

Tom Wells · #9 (**permalink**) 08-14-2010, 08:19 AM

Elder,

Please forgive the lateness of the reply to your question - I just saw the question!

My solution (?) is the 3-QT Accusump. Guess who makes it? Canton! What a coincidence.

Anyway, it works fine - no more pressure loss in the turns on various tracks. It did get to where the loss is noticeable on the street, but keeping the Gs below .3 seems to prevent any problems - particularly with howly street tires and law enforcement officers...

I would not do any spirited cornering with a 460 without an Accusump. That's my story and I'm sticking to it.

Tom

mdross1 · #10 (**permalink**) 08-16-2010, 06:27 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by FWB

the pan isn't the only factor in the 460 loosing oil pressure. the 460 is essentially a truck motor designed for a mild hydraulic cam, low rpm usage. when a high lift cam is introduced the oiling holes in the lifter bores get exposed on max lift and full oil pressure is lost thru the passage resulting in the pan quickly getting sucked dry. extra capacity helps, accusump helps but the source is usually in the lifter galley. when using solid cams in the 460 it is often wise to bore out and bush the lifter bores to eliminate the problem. high lift hydraulic cams also expose the galley. a restricter is often needed.

just my two cents, from wiping out bearings at the dragstrip and finally after two motors finding the problem on the test stand.....

Makes me wonder how much lift are you using to push the lifters that far out of the bores.Over .600?