TKO 600 Grinding.

jhv48 · #1 (**permalink**) 07-05-2010, 07:01 PM

I guess it's time to take it in for some exploratory surgery again.

The installer told me he dialed in the bell housing, but he probably didn't check it for being perfectly flat against the block or transmission.

He is obviously missing something. Now to convince him to do the job right.

ERA Chas · #2 (**permalink**) 07-05-2010, 07:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jhv48

I guess it's time to take it in for some exploratory surgery again.

He is obviously missing something. Now to convince him to do the job right.

Make sure the nose of the input shaft is inspected for wear or abuse. Measuring the distance from the mounting flange into the pilot hole and comparing to the distance from the trans face to the shaft nose will confirm if that's the problem.

eschaider · #3 (**permalink**) 07-06-2010, 02:11 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jhv48

I guess it's time to take it in for some exploratory surgery again.

The installer told me he dialed in the bell housing, but he probably didn't check it for being perfectly flat against the block or transmission.

He is obviously missing something. Now to convince him to do the job right.

jhv48,

Assuming the input shaft does not bottom out against the crank, I suspect your problem is what several of the guys have already identified - block/bellhousing alignment.

Using the offset dowels to align the bellhousing bore with the crank is difficult at best. It is far better to drill out the dowel pin holes a sixteenth or so, then lightly snug the bellhousing to the block, align it to the crank center and slide two, reamed to size, thick steel washers over the alignment dowels. Weld them to your bell housing and you are done - forever on this block.

The parallelism issue is easily solved as I think Blykins pointed out at a machine shop. A light cut (just adequate to clean up the transmission mounting surface) will permanently correct any parallelism issues.

A misalignment of 1˚ (which is admittedly a giant misalignment) with your crank center line will produce an offset of 0.0175" per inch of bellhousing depth. So a seven inch deep can with one degree of misalignment will have an offset at the pilot bearing of 7 x 0.0175" or 0.1225"! Correct can alignment is a big thing. Take the time to do it right.

Ed

jhv48 · #4 (**permalink**) 07-06-2010, 08:35 AM

I'm inclined to agree with the above. Something out of whack with the bell housing.

However, can someone explain the following:

1. Why does the trans shift smoothly after a brief cool down but hard when warmed up?
2. Why does reverse NOT grind when carefully engaged?
3. Why does it go easily into first gear if the car is just barely rolling forward?

These symptoms seem to be related to several failures, not just the pilot bushing.

In my mind, if the pilot bushing is dragging on the input shaft, reverse should always grind, and the forward gears should always be difficult to engage. And, rolling forward should have no effect on shifting quality.

What am I missing here?

ERA Chas · #5 (**permalink**) 07-06-2010, 09:25 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jhv48

What am I missing here?

Everything. You've asked for help and four guys on here agreed that the solution of the problem is in checking the bellhousing index and checking the input shaft length against the crank.

Stop speculating and just pull it down and you'll find the problem.

jhv48 · #6 (**permalink**) 07-06-2010, 10:12 AM

Hope you're right. Don't want to do this a fourth time.

Trying to make sure there isn't a second problem that should be addressed while the trans is out.

ekrupa2 · #7 (**permalink**) 07-06-2010, 04:49 PM

Jim - I am by no means a mechanic, and I only posted as I almost have the same set up us you. I speculate this is a heat issue...rather than a problem with the trans. That clutch slave line is very close to the headers and I tend to notice a change in shifting manners when sitting in stop and go traffic. But I stress nowhere to the extremes you have mentioned. I do know when I adjust my slave (via shims), I can change the adjustment only 1/32 of an inch to induce a grind when going from forward to reverse...and now know by feel where the sweet spot is. When in stop and go traffic, first gear can chatter a bit if my clutch let out is not perfect when there is no air movement cooling things down. This is not the case during non stop and go driving. I did switch to hi-temp fluid, and also installed a heat shield above the brake/clutch line prior to my motor drop. Good luck and I do hope you find the cause of your issue.

elmariachi · #8 (**permalink**) 07-06-2010, 05:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ekrupa2

Jim - I am by no means a mechanic, and I only posted as I almost have the same set up us you. I speculate this is a heat issue...rather than a problem with the trans.

Part of it is a heat issue. The vibration/grinding is definitely due to a worn pilot bushing or the pilot shaft pressing against the crank. The hard-to-shift issue may be exacerbated by that as well but I believe heat in the clutch fluid is a primary factor in the clutch fading and not releasing quickly when the pedal is pushed.

parhen4 · #9 (**permalink**) 08-11-2010, 09:49 PM

maybe you have done this, but if you haven't check your crank thrust bearing and see how much play you have.And see if it is in spec.

jhv48 · #10 (**permalink**) 11-02-2010, 03:38 PM

I give up. Now, the trans shifts just fine in all forward gears, but can either grind like heck or be smooth as pie when engaging reverse. Same crap shoot whether hot or cold.

So, I'm going to live with it. I just disconnected the neutral switch and strart the car in reverse in order to avoid any grinding.

blykins · #11 (**permalink**) 11-02-2010, 03:40 PM

If you sit with the clutch pushed in and give the transmission time enough to stop turning, it still grinds?

Try this....

When you're sitting there with the engine running and you want to go into reverse, go into 5th gear first, then down into reverse and see what happens.

jhv48 · #12 (**permalink**) 11-02-2010, 07:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by blykins

If you sit with the clutch pushed in and give the transmission time enough to stop turning, it still grinds?

Try this....

When you're sitting there with the engine running and you want to go into reverse, go into 5th gear first, then down into reverse and see what happens.

First thing we tried. Doesn't matter how long you wait or how many gears you engage first before finding reverse. Sometimes it will grind like there is no slowing down of rotation, sometimes it slips smoothly into reverse gear. No rhyme or reason, but heat seems to help the situation.