Replica or a modern reproduction?

[4pipes]

Yep, not exactly an elevator test for "is it original".

[Thor maine]

So let me get this straight, if you have a new series from Shelby American with a CSX serial number or an AC Heritage LTD car with a COB or COX serial number or a Kirkman(because they supply bodies to Shelby American ?) you have a "Genuine Replica of the Original" car build in the 1960's ? And everyone else has Replica Kit car of the original car built in the 1960's. Sound about right?

[Dimis]

Originally Posted by Thor maine

So let me get this straight, if you have a new series from Shelby American with a CSX serial number or an AC Heritage LTD car with a COB or COX serial number or a Kirkman(because they supply bodies to Shelby American ?) you have a "Genuine Replica of the Original" car build in the 1960's ? And everyone else has Replica Kit car of the original car built in the 1960's. Sound about right?

Sounds right to me... IMHO.

But Evan will profess -
"NO! You own a 'fakeydoo' and my CSX is better that yours, 'Cos some book says so... Na-na-na-nahhh."

Sorry, I had to get in early before he post another thesis on just how good his is..!

[Ralphy]

For a person who started off saying the op is looking for real answers. He certainly helped in hijacking this thread.

Ralphy

[REAL 1]

Sorry. My bad. "Superformance".

[mdross1]

This is still dragging on, sure wish other questions got this much attention hope the original OP got the answer he was looking for.
After owning our car over 20 yrs have heard it all and been asked mostly basic questions by curious onlookers. I am certain most that ask about originality would not be able to tell the difference.
No doubt how some of the Cobra forum members feel about this subject it sure has been run through the mill this time.
Is it real worth all the anxiety this question seems to pose on some people not for me. Have to admit my answers when asked out on the road depends on my mood or how much of a hurry I am to get behind the wheel say when fueling up. We stopped entering our vehicles in car shows a long time ago then we did enjoy the conversations when asked about our cars origin.
Have always been so proud of my creation and it's performance nothing anybody could ever say would ever make me feel 2nd rate. A kit, replicar, continuation, whatever is pure flattery to the originals.
Can promise this my car was one heck of a lot more difficult to be bought, built, tuned and tweaked than just writing a check for an original. That being said the connection to my car is very strong. Of course I would love to own an original but we all know there are only so many to go around.
Proud? you darn right I'm Proud I own a Big Block Cobra the rest of you can fill in the suffix.
Really like Thor Maine description a Hot Rod with a Cobra body.

[Ralphy]

I'm titling this as, "The Last Word."

Look I'm just as caught up in this as any. But the Shelby I know? He was a racer, a racer who wanted to win and win at the big show. He built street cars to fund his racing, even in the early sixties. So first off if you don't own a race car built for winning? Your a poser! Yes in this sense of the word even a sixties street vesion, is "A Replica."

I was drawn to these cars because of his winning. Not some street version mimic. That's the history and facts I like. I could give a whole lot less attention of how and when the CSX4000 or the CSX7000 were made and how many, blah blah blah blah........... I'd like to feel connected I bought what I could afford. Don't we all love Shelby's history?

I Like Racing!

I'm Out!
Ralphy/AKA 7th Degree Poser


Ralphy

[REAL 1]

Originally Posted by Ralphy

I'm titling this as, "The Last Word."

Look I'm just as caught up in this as any. But the Shelby I know? He was a racer, a racer who wanted to win and win at the big show. He built street cars to fund his racing, even in the early sixties. So first off if you don't own a race car built for winning? Your a poser! Yes in this sense of the word even a sixties street vesion, is "A Replica."

I was drawn to these cars because of his winning. Not some street version mimic. That's the history and facts I like. I could give a whole lot less attention of how and when the CSX4000 or the CSX7000 were made and how many, blah blah blah blah........... I'd like to feel connected I bought what I could afford. Don't we all love Shelby's history?

I Like Racing!

I'm Out!
Ralphy


Ralphy

Ralphy: No issue with your "last word". You are entitled to your own personal position.

Yes I'm sure all of here love Shelby History. Old and new.

Mdross: Have no issue with non "Cobra" owners using "hot rod with a Cobra shaped body" to describe their cars either. "Replica" seems better to me though but whatever floats your boat.

[AL427SBF]

A little off topic to the OP's question but you do bring up an interesting point ...

Originally Posted by Ralphy

[b] ... I'd like to feel connected I bought what I could afford ...

There is a connection with any of these cars to the Shelby story, but it is "money" that decides how strong that connection is. The SAAC registry simply defines the 3 levels that exist and with criteria that recognizes the OEM (or non-OEM) relationship.

[Ralphy]

Damn it again! lol

I have a SAAC Atlanta 20 year poster. It says something like PROTECING SA and it's history. Now it doesen't say promoting, preserving or some more friendly word than protecting.

Now jump forward and read a blurb. Nowhere is KIT CAR used! Do a search.
:: SAAC ::

"So, to our way of thinking, the current crop of Cobras are genuine but are not original." Also not, "Real"!

"We now find that as the value of Cobras and Shelbys continues to appreciate, the cars have been priced beyond the means of some people who still want to be SAAC members. These people have opted to own Cobra replicas, Shelby look-alikes and other Ford performance cars of which there is presently no shortage. The national club is happy to have these people as participating members, and they add a lot to the club. We like to think of them as potential Cobra or Shelby owners."


Ralphy/AKA 7th Degree Poser

Originally Posted by AL427SBF

A little off topic to the OP's question but you do bring up an interesting point ...



There is a connection with any of these cars to the Shelby story, but it is "money" that decides how strong that connection is. The SAAC registry simply defines the 3 levels that exist and with criteria that recognizes the OEM (or non-OEM) relationship.

[REAL 1]

Originally Posted by Ralphy

Damn it again! lol

I have a SAAC Atlanta 20 year poster. It says something like PROTECING SA and it's history. Now it doesen't say promoting, preserving or some more friendly word than protecting.

Now jump forward and read a blurb. Nowhere is KIT CAR used! Do a search.
:: SAAC ::




Ralphy/AKA 7th Degree Poser

Ralphy: You truly are struggling with this. This is not rocket science.,

Here's what SAAC is saying:

"So, to our way of think We now find that as the value of Cobras and Shelbys continues to appreciate, the cars have been priced beyond the means of some people who still want to be SAAC members. These people have opted to own Cobra replicas, Shelby look-alikes and other Ford performance cars of which there is presently no shortage. The national club is happy to have these people as participating members, and they add a lot to the club. We like to think of them as potential Cobra or Shelby owners. However, they should not expect that we will suddenly change the club’s policy to include cars outside of our purview as equal partners to Cobras and Shelbys.

As far as CSX4000 and CSX7000 cars are concerned, SAAC accepts these cars as genuine Shelby American Cobras (as opposed to "original" Shelby American Cobras). The definition we use to identify an original Cobra is one which was, 1) built between 1961 and 1968, 2) at the direction of and under contract from Carroll Shelby/Shelby American Inc., and 3) sold by Shelby American or one of its franchised dealers. The only difference between original Cobras and CSX4000 and CSX7000 cars is the time frame in which they were built (1). However, all three factors separate Shelby’s current cars from all the rest of the Cobra replicas, AC MK IVs, COB/COX continuation cars, etc. So, to our way of thinking, the current crop of Cobras are genuine but are not original."




Ralphy, you need to stop injecting your own spin to what SAAC said. The link you posted explains their position most clearly and succinctly. Not hard to understand. They did not add "Also not Real" you did. How did you calculate
7th degree? I know how you figure the poser part but how did you come up with 7th degree or is that number like the rest of what you been saying, just pulled out of arse?

Just get me the calculation. Thanks.


Cheers.

[jhv48]

"Since it is written, it therefore must be true!"

[D111]

as for the "original" members question,
my answer has pretty much ended up being after a bit over 3 years of owning my BDR has been its a "backdraft Cobra from South Africa". if they ask is that a kit I say the same thing.if they ask is it original I say the same thing .90 percent of the time its at a traffic light and only have a moment to reply,
and the response is most always Wow beautiful gorgeous ect to which my responses thank you.to me that's what it is and it's easy.

So what is the actual deal shelby america has a lock on the word cobra?I could see them having a lock on maybe the word Shelby Cobra but oh my goodness just the word cobra?

in that case the forum should think of changing its name to club poser :-) if only members authorized buy Shelby'to be called a" Cobra" this would be a very lonely forum.

[AL427SBF]

Originally Posted by D111

... So what is the actual deal shelby america has a lock on the word cobra?I could see them having a lock on maybe the word Shelby Cobra but oh my goodness just the word cobra? ...

Shelby America does not have a "lock" on the word cobra and is not responsible for creating the SAAC registry. If you want to appeal to the responsible party(s) start with the Cobra Club in Michigan, ask if Bill Kemper and John Rimer still compile the registry data, and then take your case to them (or their replacements).

Ralphy, a "blurb" is just that - a blurb. Do think those ~2 pages of summary capture all 1600 pages of content in the SAAC registry? Yes, "damn it" would be appropriate - if at yourself for another brain fart lol.

[AL427SBF]

Am I reading this right? There is a "class category" for SAAC membership -

These people have opted to own Cobra replicas, Shelby look-alikes and other Ford performance cars of which there is presently no shortage. The national club is happy to have these people as participating members, and they add a lot to the club. We like to think of them as potential Cobra or Shelby owners. However, they should not expect that we will suddenly change the club’s policy to include cars outside of our purview as equal partners to Cobras and Shelbys.

Sort of like a caste structure, we have landowners, landlords, and dare I say ...
... peasants who work the fields lol.

[Ralphy]

I would prefer,
... peasants who work the fields, that are screwing your mother, "ship".

Ralphy/AKA 7th Degree Poser

[AL427SBF]

Originally Posted by Ralphy

I would prefer,
... peasants who work the fields, that are screwing your mother, "ship".

Ralphy/AKA 7th Degree Poser

Ralphy, what are you trying to convey/communicate this time, please be precise, the word "ship" seems to be misplaced.

[AL427SBF]

Originally Posted by Ralphy

I would prefer,
... peasants who work the fields, that are screwing your mother, "ship".

Ralphy/AKA 7th Degree Poser

Ralphy, what are you trying to convey/communicate this time, please be precise, the word "ship" seems to be misplaced.

[OnyxRider]

Originally Posted by AL427SBF

Am I reading this right? There is a "class category" for SAAC membership -

Yes those with it and those that are clueless.

Someone please slow down this thread so I can get off!

[Dimis]

Real1 - Your point of distinction between genuine and original has been made... BUT if you believe in your mind that responding - "it's a genuine shelby cobra" (as opposed to original shelby cobra) doesn't purposefully give the poor sod asking the question the wrong impression, you Sir are sadly mistaken.

It's that simple... Irrespective of what is written where!

So, guess what...

If it walks like a duck, quacks like a duck, and looks like a duck...
I'm calling it a "duck"

You on the other hand, can maintain your belief, that because some humble book (that if I understand it correctly, requires payment to list and register your CSX4 series cobra), says so, it must be true!

The SAAC registry I value for its collation of historic documentation of the cars from the 60s and nothing more!

Trying to validate your argument (or perhaps it's your purchase) by piggybacking on that reflects more on you and your sad, perverse and desperate nature to satisfy your ego, that yours is better than someone else's.

Sorry mate, but FWIW: Ive the means to purchase a CSX4 series, just not the interest
I'm glad you however did have the interest. It re-affirms my thoughts and reasons why I pass on the opportunity.

If I had your car and was asked the question, "is that real?" Or a variant of, my answer would be equally as simple. "No, It's a modern reproduction" or "it's a continuation series" or frankly "No, it's plastic". That way NO-ONE is in any doubt.

Just saying, best you just run along and enjoy your car.
You've surly exhausted your Mass-debating skills.

Yeah! I said it

Enjoy,