CSX 1000s... - Page 2

OnyxRider · #21 (**permalink**) 06-13-2014, 05:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mullen2

All this said, My car is no more fun to drive than a FFR,SPF or other. Im not here to say my car is better than anyone else's car. Im a collector, and I buy what gets my attention.

Happy motoring to all...

That's what I have been trying to say all along they all burn petro(except NYG) and should enjoy them for what they are.

I was knee deep in the Naval Special forces during the time when these were built. I really don't remember but I think because our family owned 1960's model no one was really interested in the CSX 1000's. I am a collector also and knowing the history maybe if I was watching the process I would have made a purchase too. You don't have to post here but was wondering what your total cost ended up to be at the time.

Ciao

Those pics were worth the price of joining this site.

twobjshelbys · #22 (**permalink**) 06-13-2014, 05:44 PM

So how about a real question about the car for mullen2.

When I looked at the one at the Hillbank booth at Barrett Jackson a couple of years ago they were very defensive of the car itself. They didn't want anyone near it claiming that just leaning on it could dent it. Now I suppose that is true of any aluminum car, even my GT, but do you think the hand rolled 1000 aluminum is any softer than the panels in a CSX4000 or Kirkham?

I had some up close and personal time with more than a few originals and they never seemed concerned about "touching".

Jamo · #23 (**permalink**) 06-13-2014, 05:57 PM

I know Kirkham uses a little thicker/stronger skin than the originals, so if the 1000s are more like the originals skin-wise, it probably would dimple a bit easier???

That being said, I spent a lot of time around Dick Smith's car, and damn if he didn't try to hurt it on occasion...seemed pretty tough for arruminum.

REAL 1 · #24 (**permalink**) 06-13-2014, 07:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by twobjshelbys

So how about a real question about the car for mullen2.

When I looked at the one at the Hillbank booth at Barrett Jackson a couple of years ago they were very defensive of the car itself. They didn't want anyone near it claiming that just leaning on it could dent it. Now I suppose that is true of any aluminum car, even my GT, but do you think the hand rolled 1000 aluminum is any softer than the panels in a CSX4000 or Kirkham?

I had some up close and personal time with more than a few originals and they never seemed concerned about "touching".

What is the Kirkham process.? Are some panels hand formed?

Any pics of the Kirkham process?

twobjshelbys · #25 (**permalink**) 06-13-2014, 07:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jamo

I know Kirkham uses a little thicker/stronger skin than the originals, so if the 1000s are more like the originals skin-wise, it probably would dimple a bit easier???

That being said, I spent a lot of time around Dick Smith's car, and damn if he didn't try to hurt it on occasion...seemed pretty tough for arruminum.

But aren't the Kirkham/Shelby panels formed using a different process (I'm betting the Polish factory didn't hand roll the Russian fighter jets)? That would make the hand rolled panels softer, although they would get a lot of "work hardening". There is an awesome video of David Kirkham repairing a smashed fender.

Jamo · #26 (**permalink**) 06-13-2014, 07:35 PM

I'm pretty sure they have a few Polish wheels (English ones are so passé) back at the MiG factory for some of the panels.

I known David posted some of the work there years ago.

mullen2 · #27 (**permalink**) 06-13-2014, 07:37 PM

Total original cost for my car was around 230,000 for the first owner. I own the car for over 300K. I was after the car for a while and it took a lot of convincing to own the car, so its a good bit over the 300 mark. One gentleman owns a hand full of the first 13 CSX1000 cars i'm told, so they are not easy to get. I would guess the other owners know what they have. At the time of production, who knew there would be so few made, so not as desirable at the time, like most classics. Like the Ford GT for instance. I almost bought a brand new Midnight Blue-Stripe Delete car from a dealer in Ohio in 2006 for 160K but now same car with no miles is what? 300K? Who knew? I was a day late wiring the deposit for the Ford GT. Some lucky man beat me to it. To this day a Ford GT is still on my list.

As far as the Aluminum thickness. I really don't know. I don't have any dings in my car yet but I also tell everyone don't lean on it! I am guessing the owner of the car you spoke about told the auction house don't let anyone lean on it! Im just careful with it. I have taken it to dinner on Marco Island and could not go in to eat because of the crowd around the car. Everyone wants to tap on it and see if it is Aluminum. Its fun to talk about the car but I was afraid to leave it with everyone wanting to leaning on it and take photos. So after 30 minutes I took her home with a empty stomach.

LMH · #28 (**permalink**) 06-13-2014, 07:50 PM

You can see some of the dies used to form the body panels in this Kirkham video:

[ame]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O4XcDzotE3Y[/ame]

Larry

OnyxRider · #29 (**permalink**) 06-13-2014, 07:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mullen2

Total original cost for my car was around 230,000 for the first owner. I own the car for over 300K. I was after the car for a while and it took a lot of convincing to own the car, so its a good bit over the 300 mark. One gentleman owns a hand full of the first 14 CSX1000 cars i'm told, so they are not easy to get. I would guess the other owners know what they have. At the time of production, who knew there would be so few made, so not as desirable at the time, like most classics. Like the Ford GT for instance. I almost bought a brand new Midnight Blue-Stripe Delete car from a dealer in Ohio in 2006 for 160K but now same car with no miles is what? 300K? Who knew? I was a day late wiring the deposit for the Ford GT. Some lucky man beat me to it. To this day a Ford GT is still on my list.

As far as the Aluminum thickness. I really don't know. I don't have any dings in my car yet but I also tell everyone don't lean on it! I am guessing the owner of the car you spoke about told the auction house don't let anyone lean on it! Im just careful with it. I have taken it to dinner on Marco Island and could not go in to eat because of the crowd around the car. Everyone wants to tap on it and see if it is Aluminum. Its fun to talk about the car but I was afraid to leave it with everyone wanting to leaning on it and take photos. So after 30 minutes I took her home with a empty stomach.

I do have a few chips in front of the rear wheel wells from the sticky racing tires kicking up rocks. Anyone know where I can get a nice pair of the vinyl/leather covers to protect the paint? I don't have any photos on my new computer of my car but will get some and have them posted.

To the guys who know how to post photos here. Can we try to get photos of the other known CSX 1000 cars posted in this thread? I have seen 4 or 5 of the cars on this site. Would be nice to have the photos lined up in order of production for viewing pleasure as well as it would be nice to document the known cars.

Great site CC...

Scratching my head twice this week. lol Naples, Florida...car collector... not my friend Collier?

Thanks for the Info... going to keep track now on these few.

I was posting a comment in a GT thread about what the future value would be for them and how many will be manufactured. I bought two vehicles from Pond(collection) and was offered the red GT and declined. But I have been keeping an eye on another one. Will keep an eye on auctions America when it comes up for auction.

...

mullen2 · #30 (**permalink**) 06-13-2014, 09:47 PM

Found this statement below on the ac owners club website, looks like it is based in the UK. AC stated they still had original wooden jigs from 1962 to create a Aluminum body in a official press release in Oct. of 2000. Who knows, but thought it was worth bringing this up.

The AC press release of 17th Oct 2000 states (re 427)
"available to special order at a special price-£150,000 this reflects the thousands of man hours required to hand craft the aluminium bodywork using wooden jigs in use by AC since 1962 and the considerable effort needed to source some of the components"

CobraV8 · #31 (**permalink**) 06-14-2014, 02:15 AM

As far as the body buck is concerned I think only the front section and the buck for the trunk lid of the real 289 cars still exist.

At least all pictures I saw so far only showed these two parts.

I read several statements from Autokraft claiming they own the 427 buck as well, however it seems like they are using fibreglass bucks for the 427 style bodies. At least I saw them on several pics from the Autokraft shop:

(credit for the photos goes to google)

The MKIV bodies were far from the shape of the CSX3... cars in several areas (nose section, wheel flares, rear fenders), so they must have changed the buck as the later 427 bodies from Autokraft look much better.

Are there any pictures of the original 427 body buck at all? Never saw one...

Simon

CobraDan · #32 (**permalink**) 06-14-2014, 04:34 AM

Mullen2
I see you live in Naples, I have been located in Cape Coral for 17 years now, and we are so close. I would like to see your car up close & would protect it with my life while you go in and have dinner. Send me an email at cobradandfw@gmail.com

REAL 1 · #33 (**permalink**) 06-14-2014, 05:13 AM

Watched the Kirkham videos on Youtube. Just amazing craftsmanship.

You can understand and appreciate watching those videos why SAAC considers Kirkhams genuine Cobras. Special cars.

Saw the Kirkham Coupe. Want one. Wow!

mullen2 · #34 (**permalink**) 06-14-2014, 10:24 AM

CobraV8 asked-Are there any pictures of the original 427 body buck at all? Never saw one...

Cobra V8, I have not seen any other photos of the bucks other than what we have here. Edit. Have been informed by LMH, the above car in process is a FIA body not a 427 body.

ERA Chas · #35 (**permalink**) 06-14-2014, 12:28 PM

That appears to be a 289 car grille opening with the later oil scoop below. Like what 3002 became but that was done at Shelby.

LMH · #36 (**permalink**) 06-14-2014, 01:31 PM

That's a leaf spring FIA body on the buck.
Larry

OnyxRider · #37 (**permalink**) 06-14-2014, 03:27 PM

Not sure if these are accurate I sort of came across these when looking for something else. If someone wants to copy and paste before the page is lost please do. CSX1000 Aluminum

http://www.gessford.com/CSX1000-Retail-Price-Sheet.pdf

Also I didn't want to dilute this thread but does anyone discuss AC heritage and the Cobras they still make?

http://www.acheritage.co.uk/newbuildac427.html

...

LMH · #38 (**permalink**) 06-14-2014, 04:50 PM

The buck in post #3 is the same buck pictured in the AC heritage link photo's. Same company.
Larry

mullen2 · #39 (**permalink**) 06-16-2014, 03:59 PM

Pretty sure that is the ones built by Brooklands.

mullen2 · #40 (**permalink**) 07-13-2014, 12:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mullen2

Pretty sure that is the ones built by Brooklands.

I have to correct my self from above statement. I was speaking to some one involved with building the first of the 13 CSX 1000 cars. For some clarity the first 13 were built by AC that has now become AC Heritage. After the deal fell apart the remaining CSX 1000 cars had the bodies built by North Devon Metalcraft. Statement from AC Heritage is the first 13 CSX1000 cars were the first AC Shelby Cobras built since the 1960's and they were very excited about building them. To bad more were not built for Carroll...

The first 13 were the only cars that came from shelby with the old style nose badge saying "Shelby AC Cobra" and having the AC connection. If some one wants to post the pic Ill take a pic of the badge on my car, I can't figure how to post pics here.

Statement from AC Heritage "Cars were manufactured the traditional way using the same alloy and gas welded with 1mm strips of rod cut from the sheet parent metal . We use the same bucks to Re body " orginals " all the drawings we use were the originals for your and the other 12 cars."

From the above statement directly from AC Heritage it looks like only 13 were AC based. CSX1013 must be the last of the AC built CSX1000 cars.

So they must also have the same thickness Aluminum as the 60's built AC cars to answer someones earlier question about metal thickness.

It also looks like some of the original wooden bucks are now in AC Heritage Museum in England. This statement comes from the Museum website, time frame 2010.
"Amongst the AC Heritage equipment which will be in active service will be the original factory body bucks from the AC works in Thames Ditton on which the bodies for the famous AC Ace and original AC Cobra sports cars were built in the 1950s and ‘60s, along with Aston Martin ‘Zagato’original bodywork displays."