Replica or real? [help request from Switzerland and Italy]

[Paul F]

Originally Posted by RodKnock

...The VIN is LAC017? CA won't register/issue a VIN# that short. My CA VIN# uses the Kirkham issued chassis#, which is 11 characters. So, the VIN number should be at least 11 characters long, if not longer.

My VIN is only 9 characters.

Originally Posted by RodKnock

And the biggest clue that the title certificate is bogus? FEES PAID NONE. Come on, this is California. No business transacted at the DMV is free. Seriously?

SB100 is free. There are no charges at all when going for an SB100, which is not the same as going for a registration and SB100. My new title said No Fees when I got an SB100.

[RodKnock]

Originally Posted by Paul F

My VIN is only 9 characters.

I was told there's a minimum by the DMV and 11 characters worked in their computers. I highly doubt "LAC017" would pass muster at the DMV.

Not sure why yours would be 9, but the standard Kirkham chassis# is 11 characters.

Originally Posted by Paul F

SB100 is free. There are no charges at all when going for an SB100, which is not the same as going for a registration and SB100. My new title said No Fees when I got an SB100.

First, did you see this ""? Second, did I say anything about SB100 being free or not? While the SPCNS/SB100 process (visits to the CHP, BAR, B&L Inspection Station) may be free, titling, registration and taxes most certainly are NOT. Unless, you some how missed paying those taxes and fees. My title certificate states that I paid my fees and taxes. Lastly, the OP's registration didn't go through the SB100 process. Allegedly, it was titled in 1996 as a '61 Bristol. So, not sure what you're thinking there.

[Mark IV]

Originally Posted by RodKnock

The VIN is LAC017? CA won't register/issue a VIN# that short. My CA VIN# uses the Kirkham issued chassis#, which is 11 characters. So, the VIN number should be at least 11 characters long, if not longer.

So you can't register a 60's CSX car (CSXxxxx...7 characters)? Many cars had short VINs before the WMI 17 digit VIN became the rule in 1981.

And at one time NY couldn't handle a VIN over 15 digits! In the late 70s we sold Brougham motor homes that had an 18 digit VIN....NY could only put 15 on the registration. Solution? They took 3 digits off the end, the three unit number digits! Resulting in several units having the same title/registration VIN printed! Gotta love the DMV......................

[RodKnock]

Originally Posted by Mark IV

So you can't register a 60's CSX car (CSXxxxx...7 characters)? Many cars had short VINs before the WMI 17 digit VIN became the rule in 1981.

And at one time NY couldn't handle a VIN over 15 digits! In the late 70s we sold Brougham motor homes that had an 18 digit VIN....NY could only put 15 on the registration. Solution? They took 3 digits off the end, the three unit number digits! Resulting in several units having the same title/registration VIN printed! Gotta love the DMV......................

Are we talking about an original 1960's era Cobra here? Uh, no. Obviously the OP's car is not a 1960's original CSX. I don't have any clue what happened at the DMV that long ago or how they're registered today in CA's computers.

So far, we have two CA owners of replicas built more recently that have 9 characters. Anyone with shorter VIN's? My DMV representative and her manager had some difficulty making mine (11 characters) work. And hadn't seen anything that short before.

[MOTORHEAD]

Hello again Davide:
the california title showing the car as a 1961 Bristol is false, but this was commonly done as one way to register a custom built car (non-comforming to smog and crash test requirements) before sb100. It is still an option in some cases, but looked upon in some states as fraud. I don't know when sb100 was initiated,so it may not have been an option in 1996/7.
However, the swiss reg shows the car as a FORD 427 COBRA.
427 Cobras did not exist prior to 1965, so the 1961 Bristol assertion is bogus.

The engine is almost certainly in the 260/302 family, and has been lightly modified outwardly with a 4 barrel carb and manifold. What lies inside is anybodies guess.
If it was bored and stroked to 347 cubes and using a conservative factor of 1 hp/cu ",
you have approximaitly 350 HP. 1.5 hp/cu" would yield 525 hp.

How about driving it to Poland, to the Mig plant where the Kirkham bodies and frame are built ?

[DavideG]

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[LMH]

If you can find the chassis number stamped on the frame, we might be able to find out more info on the car if it was listed in the Cobra Registry. Not all cars are but it's a shot.
Larry

[*13*]

That should be a pretty desirable car, if you plan to sell it, regardless of what it is. Alumin bodied cobras, at the very least, are at the higher end of the replica field.
I don't think anyone has mentioned it yet, & it may give you a little more insight. In most states in the USA, we have smog regulations. One way to avoid these regulations, it was this way in California before they implemented the sb100 program, is to have your car titled per year of the engine block. Some went further & just made up a year(or even make/model) that superseded those smog regulations & titled it that way(our department that handles licensing isn't always on the ball).

[1ntCobra]

Are there any new pictures from the weekend? Did you find a serial number stamped into the driver's side shock tower?

[DavideG]

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[DavideG]

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[DavideG]

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[DavideG]

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[DavideG]

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[MOTORHEAD]

Wow ! I get to be first to respond ! I am honored !
No doubt about it !!! IT IS Kirkham 0469, as stamped on door hinges . Absolutley !!
The "LAC 017" was added later, maybe in GERMANY ? I see they had stamped the 017 on separate (Aluminum?) plates near the infamous red horns ! Remove the horns and plates and you will see the original kirkham sn, 0469, which I am sure is still there, as if they had ground the sn off, there would be no reason to cover it.
I will check history in the Cobra registry and report back.

Ted

[DavideG]

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[MOTORHEAD]

Only very basic info. Last sentence is telling:
"KMP469. Delivered 4/21/06. Coil spring chassis with 427 S/C body.
Purchased by Fritz Phillipps (GER)."

Ted

[DavideG]

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[maurice19]

David,
I could tell from the first picture of the knock offs that the Kirkham was somewhat newer than my #318. Sometime in 05 or 06 Kirkham came up with the wedge inserted on the hub outside the spinner to hold the knock off on.
Previous ones were wired on.

Agree totally with what Motorhead said concerning false cover on shock tower, door hinges, etc.

Maurice

[LMH]

Note in the one photo from the underside, it's written "427W". That's what I was referring to earlier in the thread. Looks like a stroked/bored 351W.
Larry