Installing a new Canton pan - Do I still need the windage tray???

[blykins]

Measure the pickup/pan clearance while you're in there, just for giggles.

[mjhcobra]

How would you measure the clearance? I assume it would be what was required since Canton made the pan and the pickup.

[blykins]

Never assume that it's right, always assume it's wrong...

You measure by taking a straightedge and tape measure....measure from the pan rail (with gasket) to the pickup. Then measure from the rail on the pan down to the pans sump. Subtract the two and that's your measurement.

[Dwight]

I use Playdough. I put it inside a plastic bag and place it onto the pickup. Install pan. Or just pressure the pan down real hard.
Remove pan, very carefully remove Playdough from bag, take a razor blade and cut thru the center of the Playdough. Then measure.

Dwight

make sure the pickup is parallel with the pan. You don't want one side of the pickup higher than the other. Crooked!

[mjhcobra]

I measured the pickup from the block face and measured the pan to the bottom from the pan face with the windge tray and 2 gaskets and the diff was 3/8".

[blykins]

3/8" is good. The gaskets will compress a little when it's all bolted together.

If you're doing this with the engine in the car, I would get about 4-6 5/16" studs and place them strategically around the pan rail. Glue your gaskets on with Right Stuff or your favorite gasket sealer. Smear a thin layer in between each part of the sandwich to seal. Don't lay beads, as beads will find their way into the crankcase.

On the gasket that goes on closest to the block, look at the rear main cap and make sure the gasket doesn't cover the rear main seal drain. If it does, it could help the chance of a rear main seal leak. Take an X-Acto knife or razor blade and cut out around it. Also, if you're using ARP main studs (and some main bolts), make sure that they don't stick down below the cap far enough to keep the oil pan from sitting against the block. Make sure the windage tray doesn't block the drain or hit on any fasteners as well.

Let everything seal up over night and don't put any oil in it until you're confident it's sealed and dry.

[mjhcobra]

My Engine is out and hanging from a hoist so access is pretty good. I may put a few studs in just to help the alignment. I will check the rear main drain. I put this motor together a long time ago and forgot about the drain.
No problems with bolts before so I should be good this time around.
Thanks for the tips.

[RICK LAKE]

mjhcobra There have been some questionable testing done. On certain motor windage trays really help. In other cases no. Hemi's and FE motors have long side walls where the crank shaft spins and depending on what you are doing with the car, the crank will not whip up the oil like other motors. I do know this that solid lifter and solid rollers need all the oil spray they can get. This is the contact point between the bottom of a flat tappet or roller and camshaft contact spot. New solid lifters, (non roller) now have small holes of .010"-.015" for oiling of the contact location. This extends the life of both surfaces. I used to run solids in other motors and 10-15K miles and the wear was showing and the camshaft had wear issues. We also ran a higher valve lash above spec. This also increases wear at idle. If you are running a canton diamond windage tray, it works more like a scraper and I use this. SIDE note, make sure you can rotate the crank shaft 360 degrees and not hit the windage tray. Mine did and had to be modified. If you are running a roller lifter you can cheat the control of oil spray, flat tappets,I wouldn't. Stroker motor would need to be checked too.
1/4" to 3/8" clearance for pickup is good. I also tack weld the tube to the oil pump. It's a safety issue to protect a $10,000 motor. If you are going to race, pull the oil pump and safety wire the 4 bolts on the bottom of the pump. Also Over fill the motor 1quart of oil. This stops any starvation of the oil getting back to the pan. The oil returns are slow in and FE motor and this helps. It may leak from the rear main seal or may not. Also make sure your dipstick is reading the correct oil level.
Do you have any oiling modes done to the motor?? Mostly the adding of limiters to the heads for the rocker oiling and valve spring cooling. I know some of the guys are running a .060" oriface in both heads. I use a .080" to be safe. It fills the heads with oil and helps cool the valve springs and rockers. Easy way is to add allen screw into the supply hole in the head, tap head, drill hole in middle of screw and inset. Make sure it clears the bolt for the shafts and use the correct bolt or stud for the supply hole.
What oil pump are you running. I would reccomend an HVHP pump with a min of 60# spring. I like 80# better. I race and use #100 psi spring. 15 years of racing and no failures to bottom end of motor. IMO the most important thing is not let the motor idle for long and have a min of 30# of pressure at idle. There is a 10-20 psi loss of pressure from the front of the motor to the back of the motor.
Side notes, if you are running an oiler cooler, add an accusump to the motor. You can use it as both a preoiler before starting the motor,( 85% of motor wear happens on starting a motor and waiting for oil pressure to build ) and if running high "G" turns help maintain oil pressure when the oil is slow to return to the oil pan. This is also the reason for running 1 quart over full. You can use a manual valve or go electrical. Good luck. Rick L.