Dick smith record broken 4/11/2015

[DMXF]

Originally Posted by mr0077

So is the 221 mph run at Bonneville mentioned in an earlier post a not legit achievement? I guess the Le Mans hardtop might make it apples and oranges, but...

I ran across a brief statement about it somewhere (I think online) years ago with a reference to Union Oil sponsorship. Googling will show the car owner is a grandson of the Union Oil founding tycoon. The registry also mentions it and states there was a Bonneville sticker on the car showing 221 mph. It would be nice to find some official documentation. I sent an email yesterday to a fellow supposedly involved with Bonneville records to see if he can get us closer to the details. I have no idea which section of Bonneville it may have occurred on. I imagine a complication in getting to the bottom of it is what sanctioning body or organization it was run under, if they didn't all aggregate records for runs there. The other important issue is exactly what body modifications were done. Perhaps someone like Ned has a picture of the car in the configuration in that time period?

[Virgil]

Thanks again for all your support!!!

Next year, we'll run race fuel, (maybe that oxgeninated VP if I get permission from Mauh, this year was straight pumped 91) more tire pressure and take it a little further in fourth before shifting into fifth. That might just put us at 200MPH.

[DMXF]

Originally Posted by big-boss

I took my street sorted KMP498 to 150 a couple of times- it was a handful to be mild.

Back in '65-'66 Shelby American advised owners of Cobras who were going to use the cars for any serious performance usage that things like bump steer, etc needed to be set up. It was just part of finishing the cars for the intended use.

One aspect that Virgil may have hit upon, however, is the Hoosier tires have more "rake" than some popular tires used on Cobras, even the Avons, ie; the fronts are notably smaller than the rears. Years ago I remember a Goodyear engineer telling me their front and rear "Cobra" tires are made from the same mold, they just insert a spacer to make the rears wider - this is a compromise for cost savings. Back in the day Dick Smith and most Cobra racers ran rear tires that were notably taller than the fronts. While I think the trend since the 70's has been to have the front diameter closer to the rear than they were at the 60's and 70's extremes, the fact is some degree of this disparity helps keep the car planted at high speeds. Even in Nascar stock cars in the early 90's one thing that Jack Roush's cars had used to their advantage until everyone else caught on was cited as building more rake into the bodies when they were put on the chassis.

[cudino]

Originally Posted by mikeinatlanta

Weighing this against an undocumented claim by a very accomplished and respected person who is no longer with us serves no positive purpose. The good new is that we now have a documented top speed with actual measurements, photos, known conditions, and car configuration. It's time we move out of speculation and recognize a provable accomplishment for what it is. Thank you Virgil. Can't wait to see the first one hit 200.

I consider it a shame that some feel praising Virgil’s tremendous accomplishment must be burdened by also having to put someone else down, in this case an attempt to discredit Dick Smith’s 198.045mph speed record. Photos of Dick’s car at Daytona are readily available, and eyewitness accounts from the race corroborate the Certificate that Dick received as documented proof of this feat.

FYI Dick’s car ran a small windscreen at Daytona. Anecdotally, Dick Smith’s crew chief Dick Young has firsthand knowledge that the full windshield on Dick’s car will come out at speeds above 165mph, as these guys painfully found out at Portland in 1986.

From what I know about Dick Smith I agree with several of the other folks who posted on this thread, Dick would surely be amongst the first to congratulate you Virgil. Excellent job!

- Wade

[mickmate]

Congrats Virgil impressive run. The last tuning my local Holley ace and I did on 3035 had it running really well and that was on the street motor. I'd love to see those two run side by side.
Adding rake on a car without caster adjustment reduces the caster and the stability at speed. I think the rake may help by dropping the nose to reduce the kiting effect.

[Virgil]

Thanks, definitely believe rake helps. 3 1/2" font frame rail to ground, back rail = 6 1/2" to ground.

[mikeinatlanta]

That's some serious rake. How much do you run in normal track configuration? Also curious what you are running for springs?


EDIT: Not trying to start any issues. My apologies.

[Jamo]

I'm wondering, Mike, were you there? From all accounts, it was properly measured with the equipment that was used at the time.

About the same time period, there was a landing on the moon, but there are folks (like you?) that seem to doubt that happened as well.

YOU brought it up...you shouldn't have because this is Virgil's time to shine.

Leave this thread now. That's it.

[Jerry Clayton]

Records---------when they say that records are made to be broken, they don't mean also killing the horse----------

The only reason the UNOFFICIAL WORLD record with my top fuel car wasn't official was that they ( FIA ) wanted a 2 way run----------would be kind of hard to get it stopped from the starting line to the fence---------

Oh, and pics are in my gallery---

Congradulations Virgil

[Virgil]

Mikeinatlata:

Bilstein coil overs,- front springs = 750lbs / rears = 650lbs

[Virgil]

Thanks again everyone, for your heartfelt congratulations.

Let's all stay positive and have fun, Cobra fun!!

[REAL 1]

Virgil: Kudos to you! That is an amazing accomplishment. Another record in the book for Shelby Cobras. You are certainly carrying the torch well.
While Dick Smith's record was official for the time there were always nay sayers based on as I understand in large part the cars aerodynamics and whether it was possible.

Virgil's feat which was recorded and timed with modern time keeping equipment actually should eliminate any doubt with regard to Dick Smith's record. Virgil's record in a car identical in shape and similar in power ran slightly faster than Dick's time. Why would anyone now doubt Dick's feat? Dick Smith was an icon and a legend in the Cobra world and part of its lore.
Virgil, I note you also run your Cobra on road courses. Do you change diff ratio's for road work, tires, suspension etc...?

Based on your use of the car in high speed activities whether involving turns or high speed records have you thought about caging the car, 5 point restraints, HANS etc... and removing the wood dash for safety? Since I have become very involved in track events in the past couple years, attended racing schools etc... I have become very a tuned to the safety aspects of the sport and recently purchased a Boss 302 AI spec race car with a full Watson Racing cage primarily for the cage.

Cobras as much as they do offer in brutal performance they offer as little in safety in stock form.

Also I noted that you joined CC in 2006 but only have less than 40 posts. Personally I think you should be posting more as you clearly have a lot to offer the community.

Kudos again.

[Virgil]

Thanks Real 1, all good safety points, you certainly can never be too safe!

A local news crew showed up here at home yesterday. Interviewed me, my wife and daughter, took a ride in 4224 then went back to their news station and broadcasted it
on the evening news; even shows the car going through the traps at Mojave!

Anyone interested in viewing it may see it at:
La Jolla man breaks vintage speed racing record | FOX5 San Diego

[mr0077]

Virgil, that's a great tribute to an awesome accomplishment, best wishes on 200+ next year.

And another thing, I don't think this takes away from Dick Smith's accomplishment or the Boneville run...they're very separate accomplishments. Dick Smith still holds the record for a Cobra on a closed circuit. The 221 mph at Bonneville was (best we know) a flying mile record for Cobras. Virgil did his in a standing start mile run, helluvan accomplishment in my mind!

[Jamo]

Cool news video...it's all about la familia.

[Virgil]

Thanks Jamo!

[LMH]

Very cool news video! I like your sign over your garage door too!
Larry

[gunkk]

congrats!

[Virgil]

Thank you!

[Dominik]

Well done!

You may want to cover the passenger side for the next run. That could be beneficial to keep the car on the ground and reduce drag. Well, 200 mph should be easy now :-)

Nice achievement and it hopefully brings out some competition which is always good!