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Kirkham Motorsports

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  • 1 Post By MFE III
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Old 09-29-2017, 08:06 PM
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Default Oil Cooler lines - film?

I run an oil cooler on my build and drive the car frequently. I notice a build up of film on the oil cooler lines. Thought it was caused by a bad fitting so replaced the fitting & hose. Still does the same thing. Any ideas as to what causes this? I don't see any signs of a leak.

In one of the pictures, I took my fingertip and wiped the film, just to make it show up better.

Any Ideas?

Paul



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Old 09-30-2017, 12:34 AM
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If it's everywhere including the fan blades and shrouding then I would guess at it being environmental pollution but that would show up on the leading edges of the body and the windscreen - if it's an oil leak it then it looks like a very small one creating a fine mist of oil. Is it oily, sticky or just dust an is it on the back side of the oil lines? Another possibility is that your braided lines are not oil compatible and are weeping oil.

Last edited by Snake2998; 09-30-2017 at 02:22 AM..
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Old 10-01-2017, 09:46 PM
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the film is only on the hose and the lower fitting. Both have been replaced twice and it still continues. Film is an oily buildup of dirt.

Front of car and nose metal is clean, except behind the hoses were some build up appears. Lines and fittings are Summit Racing brand

Anyone know who makes the hoses & fittings for Summit?

Paul
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Old 10-02-2017, 06:43 PM
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Paul, is there oil film on the whole line or just down near the fittings?
I'm wondering if the line is sweating through the hose itself.
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Old 10-03-2017, 01:00 PM
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Paul;
I plumbed my fuel system with stainless hose I bought from one of the big parts houses, either Summit or Jegs. Almost immediately I began to smell fuel in the garage. I never saw any fuel. After a bit of research and a few calls I redid the system in XRP brand hose, and the problem went away. XRP is made for racing and aviation; maybe it could help you.
Bill
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Old 10-03-2017, 01:18 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PaulProe View Post
the film is only on the hose and the lower fitting. Both have been replaced twice and it still continues. Film is an oily buildup of dirt.

Front of car and nose metal is clean, except behind the hoses were some build up appears. Lines and fittings are Summit Racing brand

Anyone know who makes the hoses & fittings for Summit?

Paul
Perhaps it's just the photo, but the 3rd photo looks like the film is on the lower section of the hose, but not on the upper section (the braid is more clearly visible). Perhaps the upper section is above the opening and not picking up contaminants through there - providing a clue as to where it's coming from.

Do you have a puller fan as well that's drawing in those contaminants while in traffic?
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Old 03-06-2018, 08:17 PM
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Perhaps coolant,sometimes glycol can be oily. Just a thought
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Old 03-07-2018, 05:37 AM
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Just a thought. The wind and air will spread a very minute of oil or coolant all over and make it really hard to find where it may come from. Have you tried wiping everything completely clean and then just running the car until everything is up to temperature and watching to see if you can see where it may come from? I had a tiny pin hole in a line once that I looked for and couldn't find so I did that and I also added that stuff that shows up under a black light. Then when I ran the car I spotted it almost immediately and it wasn't close to where the darn film was always showing up. It was about 3 inches in front of it and the wind was blowing it back and spreading it.

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Old 03-07-2018, 05:18 PM
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Default X2 on XRP products

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Originally Posted by sllib View Post
Paul;
I plumbed my fuel system with stainless hose I bought from one of the big parts houses, either Summit or Jegs. Almost immediately I began to smell fuel in the garage. I never saw any fuel. After a bit of research and a few calls I redid the system in XRP brand hose, and the problem went away. XRP is made for racing and aviation; maybe it could help you.
Bill
My local speed shop sells Xrp exclusively, they always seemed a bit pricey, but after doing quite about of re-plumbing with a mixture of brands it finally hit me that everything but the xrps ended up seeping...

A little leak at high pressure will make quite a messy oil fog...

I would vote for a leaky fitting or incompatible hose?

Steve H
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Old 03-09-2018, 05:59 AM
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You can add some UV dye to your oil then take the car out for a drive. Then a black light should show you the source of the leak. I recently located an oil leak on mine that way.
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Old 03-09-2018, 07:23 AM
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Default Leaks

I recently had a gas leak. Thought it was the fittings. Nope. The braided gas line was not compatible with Ethanol gas.

I bet its the hose isnt compatible with the oil.
Find different type of hose.

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Old 03-09-2018, 09:17 AM
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It appears you have a wicking action in the braids originating at the lower fittings. (wicking upwards)

The left side appears a bit worse as it also extends downward into the 90 elbow.

Typically these type leaks are introduced during assembly. If the hose is not fully screwed into the locking collar (counter-clock wise until it contacts the upper fitting threaded area and then backed off a 1/4 turn) the hose backs out during fitting screw-in. (placing a ring of electrical tape at the base of collar-hose area can help show movement).
Make sure there is a slight gap (daylight) between the Fitting once screwed in and the collar 1/32" non-swivel. 1/16" on swivel fittings.

Or you could take the hoses out out and rigging some reducer fittings up (cap one end) and applying max shop air to pressurize the hose. Then apply soapy water solution to the outer hose. The Air more readily leaks out.
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Old 03-09-2018, 09:57 AM
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Hey Paul
I also used Summit SS hoses to plumb my oil cooler and fuel lines. I have no signs of the mentioned wicking, but . . .
I needed a couple of fittings during the build at one point and went to a local AN fittings and hose shop. Came up that I was running Summit hoses and the guy behind the counter goes off on cheap Chinese made hoses from Summit and said I'll soon smell fuel in my garage because of the poor quality. Says they seep. I dismissed it as him hyping his more expensive Earls hoses and have never had any problems or fuel smell. But with some of the comments here, maybe there is something to quality of Summit and Jegs branded hoses.
keep us posted.
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Old 03-09-2018, 10:39 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MFE III View Post
Hey Paul
I also used Summit SS hoses to plumb my oil cooler and fuel lines. I have no signs of the mentioned wicking, but . . .
I needed a couple of fittings during the build at one point and went to a local AN fittings and hose shop. Came up that I was running Summit hoses and the guy behind the counter goes off on cheap Chinese made hoses from Summit and said I'll soon smell fuel in my garage because of the poor quality. Says they seep. I dismissed it as him hyping his more expensive Earls hoses and have never had any problems or fuel smell. But with some of the comments here, maybe there is something to quality of Summit and Jegs branded hoses.
keep us posted.
My experience with said brands was exactly as described.
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Old 03-09-2018, 08:38 PM
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Lines and fittings are Summit Racing brand
And there you have it. Cheap low bidder of the week is who makes Summit. There are several quality brands, I prefer Fragola for oil and fuel.
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Old 03-10-2018, 05:34 AM
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So let me first say that I sell hose and fittings for a living. Mainly hydraulic experience but what I am going to say applies to any fluid hose. You are most likely suffering from one of two problems.
1. Incompatible hose and fitting combination: Ensure you have a hose a fitting made by the same manufacturer. Companies make, test and approve products designed to work in conjunction with each other. If you have one guys hose and another’s fittings “bad things” can happen. You think it’s just a hose and fitting and there’s almost no pressure but trust me it’s a big deal! I would strongly consider the use of Parker or Aeroquip hose and fittings but make sure you match the hose with a manufacturers approved fitting. You’d be surprised how many hose shops will assemble something for you that is engineered to fail from the get go.

2. Hose permission: this is where the hose develops porisity in the rubber from fluid incompatibility, heat or a combination thereof. Be sure you know your temperatures and ensure the hose is rated to that. Most nitrile rubber compounds are good to around 212F and have a broad range of fluid compatibility. EPDM hoses are good to much higher temperatures but are 100% incompatible with rubber. NEARLY ALL HEATER HOSE IS EPDM!

There is your Cliff Claven moment of the day. Feel free to PM me if you want additional information.

Last edited by jspanier; 03-10-2018 at 05:46 AM..
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Old 03-10-2018, 05:36 AM
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Air pressure test kits for all sizes of AN lines are inexpensive and readily available. All lines should be cleaned and tested after assembly. I have been using Fragola lines with Aero-quip fittings with great results.
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Old 03-11-2018, 05:11 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jspanier View Post
So let me first say that I sell hose and fittings for a living. Mainly hydraulic experience but what I am going to say applies to any fluid hose. You are most likely suffering from one of two problems.
1. Incompatible hose and fitting combination: Ensure you have a hose a fitting made by the same manufacturer. Companies make, test and approve products designed to work in conjunction with each other. If you have one guys hose and another’s fittings “bad things” can happen. You think it’s just a hose and fitting and there’s almost no pressure but trust me it’s a big deal! I would strongly consider the use of Parker or Aeroquip hose and fittings but make sure you match the hose with a manufacturers approved fitting. You’d be surprised how many hose shops will assemble something for you that is engineered to fail from the get go.

2. Hose permission: this is where the hose develops porisity in the rubber from fluid incompatibility, heat or a combination thereof. Be sure you know your temperatures and ensure the hose is rated to that. Most nitrile rubber compounds are good to around 212F and have a broad range of fluid compatibility. EPDM hoses are good to much higher temperatures but are 100% incompatible with rubber. NEARLY ALL HEATER HOSE IS EPDM!

There is your Cliff Claven moment of the day. Feel free to PM me if you want additional information.
I'll add that even within a brand you can have incompatible hose and fitting products. I bought a bunch of Fragola high pressure fuel line and fittings at Summit at the counter. When I got it home I discovered they had sold me incompatible hose and fittings. They would have gone together, but would not have held the pressure.

When you buy Summit brand, you have no guarantee that this week's fitting supplier has fully tested their product to be compatible with last week's hose supplier. Only place I'll use their stuff is barbed very low pressure, pipe thread, and hard line parts, but never the line. Summit stainless seamless tube is not seamless, just polished to look like it is. Their aluminum tube is pure junk too.
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Old 03-11-2018, 05:18 AM
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Quote:
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Air pressure test kits for all sizes of AN lines are inexpensive and readily available. All lines should be cleaned and tested after assembly. I have been using Fragola lines with Aero-quip fittings with great results.
Have to agree with "Cliff" on this one. I had an unusual project and Fragola told me they would rather I buy all from another supplier than mix their hose fittings with another hose. Exception being hard line product.

Keep in mind that when the term AN fitting is used, it is referring to the hard side, not the hose interface. Intermixing brands hard parts that are actually AN is no issue.
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Old 03-11-2018, 08:06 AM
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Even with hose and fittings from the same manufacturer, you can have a leak if not assembled correctly. My original point being, pressure test your assemblies before you install them on the car. If you have a problem, you will know it.
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