Easy way to add HP?

[Selo]

Originally Posted by patrickt

Honestly Selo, you're probably better off just enjoying your car for this driving season and then upgrading to a different Cobra that is more to your liking over the winter months.

I'm not necessarily even asking for myself at this point, just surprised that no one really commented on the coyote as a desirable option.
I think twobjshelby's above is getting to the heart of the issue. That's what I was really asking about. Sounds like most people on this forum don't think the coyote is a pure Cobra engine. By the way, I love the fact that mine is loud and my garage smells like gas. Just wish it had a little more grunt. I'm going to be tweaking a few things within the next week or two that hopefully will improve the drivability, it's a damn nice car, no two ways about it, just needs a little attention.

[blykins]

Drive it for the season, pull the engine out at wintertime and send it to me. I’ll give you more grunt, while using some of the same parts. Easy peasy.

[eschaider]

Originally Posted by Selo

I'm ... surprised that no one really commented on the coyote as a desirable option...

Any small displacement engine (unless supercharged) will make it's horsepower with high engine speeds and low torque. Torque is what makes a car move when you initially push on the accelerator pedal.

If you intend to use a low torque engine and make your power with engine speed you will always be driving around town above 3000 rpm in traffic — and that gets old fast not to mention expensive.

This is a link (click here => Westech Dyno test) of a dyno pull of a 427 Windsor at Westech. Notice the engine has over 500 ft/lbs of torque even down below 4000 rpm. This is what moves a car around town and in traffic when you push on the accelerator.

This is a link (click here =>Hot Rod Coyote Dyno Test) to a Coyote dyno pull writeup by Hot Rod.and here is the Dyno chart for the engine;



Notice how the engine torque falls to 375 ft/lbs at 3000 rpm. When you take the engine down to 1500 / 2000 rpm (which is where you'll be driving it) it has even wimpier torque numbers — it will feel like the engine you have today that you want to replace. The only difference is your wallet will be a lot lighter. BTW FWIW it took E-85 and add ons to get those disappointing numbers.

The only way to fix the wimpy torque problem is displacement, you need to have 427 or more cubic inches of engine displacement, which is exactly what the Westech dyno pull showed.

There is one other fix for the problem and that is supercharging, which is in effect more inches but on demand.. When you supercharge a good basic design like Ford's 4 valve Modular family motors the result is stunning.

This is a series of dyno pulls from Kenne Bell showing what their superchargers are capable of on this engine platform. Notice all the numbers are on bone stock engines except for the KB compressor.



Even the diminutive 4.6L engine (that I use) produced 500 ft/lbs of torque at 2000 engine rpm and the torque was essentially table flat across the entire engine operating range. The other significant consideration is the figures are rear wheel torque and power figures not flywheel — add another 15% more power for the flywheel figures.

Those diminutive (diaplacement-wise) supercharged 4V Modular engines will slam your eyeballs against the back of your skull, if you hook them up. Ask me how I know. If you are a purist they are not period correct. If you are into eye candy and stunning performance they are just what the doctor ordered but on steroids. They do come from an OEM Cobra so the gene pool is sort of correct ...

Bottom line you are back to needing displacement, either a 427 or bigger n/a engine or a small displacement engine with a screw blower.

You ought to also spend $150 on those books I pointed you at. It is much less expensive than a $15,000 engine mistake but it will require you to actually read and learn the stuff in them.


Ed

[olddog]

Originally Posted by Selo

I'm not necessarily even asking for myself at this point, just surprised that no one really commented on the coyote as a desirable option.
I think twobjshelby's above is getting to the heart of the issue. That's what I was really asking about. Sounds like most people on this forum don't think the coyote is a pure Cobra engine. By the way, I love the fact that mine is loud and my garage smells like gas. Just wish it had a little more grunt. I'm going to be tweaking a few things within the next week or two that hopefully will improve the drivability, it's a damn nice car, no two ways about it, just needs a little attention.

You can look at them on Ford racing website.
https://performanceparts.ford.com/engines/#modular

The maximum Hp coyote is 5.2 ltr 580 Hp @ 7800 rpm 440 torque @ 4500 rpm and it is not street legal in a modern car. It costs $20K. I do believe you would have to get a wire harness and a new ECU which could set you back another $3K unless you could source used from a salvage yard.

The more typical coyote is 5.0 ltr 435 Hp @ 6500 rpm 400torque @ 4250 rpm. It costs $8K plus the CPU and wire harness.

The dyno chart I saw on a newer Mustang hit about 300 torque at 3000 rpm peaks at 350 and is back down to 300 at 7000 rpm, on a chassis dyno (power read from the wheels to the ground). From everything I have read these engine produce good low rpm torque and have a very flat torque curve. They can do that with the variable timing cam shafts, which also allows the torque to be produced to very high rpm numbers, which is the reason for the high Hp at high rpm. Also contributing to that is the very well designed 4 valve per cylinder heads. The heads make the engine and these are some of the best head designs out there.

They purr like a kitty cat at idle. They are smooth superb running engines everywhere. This is not what people expect to hear out of a Cobra, at least the old school guys. That said a Backdraft dealer has been putting Modulars and Coyotes in his Cobra's for years and he is a member on this site. Drawing a blank on his name.

400 Torque is not too shabby and it is flatter over a longer rpm range than a push rod engine. The size of the Coyote is huge. As big as a 460 in most directions, but shorter front to back. It is very wide and tall. The block is small, but the heads are massive. They house two camshaft per head.

They are a great engine, and if that floats your boat, so be it. Be prepared for smart ass, know it all, can't control their mouth, people talk to you and about you as if you stuck a Chevy engine in it. If you have thick skin and it doesn't bother you, or if you can kick the whole worlds ass, then go for it and be happy.

PS

You will note that the torque on the Coyote is pretty much what you can get out of a 347 stroker, actually a little less. The 347 stroker below 6000 will be similar but the Coyote will pull away in the top end. However a 347 stroker will pretty much bolt right in for a lot less total cost. You can build a lot stronger windsor stroker for about the same total money, most likely quite a bit less all said and done. It would still be a much easier to fit engine.

If you are set on a Coyote, I would look up the Backdraft dealer I mentioned.