Door ferrules or ferrells what ever

[Michael C Henry]

I'm intent on getting my soft top and side curtains installed. I have an 84 Everett Morrison 427 SC replica, FIBERGLASS. I bought the top and side curtains from EM when they sold kits and parts from Florida (2001). I'm trying to get as much of the odd parts before the deed. The ferrules that came with from EM are threaded with nuts, polished round heads about 3/16" tall with square sides, that sit above door surface. They kind of look as if they were a stack of same size washers. Then I look at original aluminum cars and the ferrules they have are just slightly raised higher than the door surface with out side edges tapering to blend with the door surface. You may actually lay your arm on them. I now know that the original aluminum cars had pieces of pipe welded into the door to accept the smooth body ferrules, secured with a external snap ring on each ferrule. The original cars have three ferrules per door. The fiberglass replica ferrules have a threaded body with a nut that holds the ferrule to the fiberglass door top surface. Why did EM make their ferrules with the thick heads like this and why only two ferrules for each door? Did they have problems with the smooth slight original style head cracking from stress?
From what I've seen EM made the side curtain with only two down shafts so you could lay your arm across the door between the ferrules when side curtain was not being used. And the squarish heads were easier to make. I'm thinking I want three down shafts per side curtain and the ferrules should be the slight headed ferrules but with the threaded body and nut That outwardly resemble the originals. any response?

[my427cobra]

I had mine machined by a friend. Started with SS button head screws, drilled out the center full lenth of the bolt, machined the head to my contour/shape desire and then polished the heads. Threads allowed me to put spacers between the nut and the inside surface of the door to tighten them down.

I also countersunk the door surface (fiberglass body/doors of course) with an end mill of the right size so the heads were more flush with the door surface.

I'll send pics if you're interested.

Cheers
Greg

[Michael C Henry]

"Button head" is great description of what EM sent me, a long time ago. And yes I'd like to see pictures. You must have a fiber glass replica like mine, if you milled the door surface to sink the ferrule head. Upon testing the magnetic attraction of my button head ferrules from EM seem to be chromed steel. The button head -the nut- and my tool box all seem to have the same attraction.

[cycleguy55]

Moss Motors has 3 different ferrules / sockets currently listed:


https://mossmotors.com/socket-side-curtain


https://mossmotors.com/socket-side-curtain-in-door-top


https://mossmotors.com/socket-side-screen

I'm guessing the 3rd / last one may be the most desirable - it was used on Austin Healey 100, 100-6 and 3000 cars and has the lowest profile.

[Mike I]

Michael, my car is an E-M also, and I have two ferrules in each door. The holes for the ferrules are counterbored into the fiberglass so they sit barely above the fiberglass surface. Sorry for the fuzzy picture, took it in haste with my tablet.

Mike

[Michael C Henry]

Thank you for the pictures of the EM ferrules counter sunk into the fiber glass door of another EM. Are you happy with only two per door? I was looking at the EM button headed ferrules and noticed that the EM ferrules have a blind center hole. The side curtain lower posts actually rest on the end of the blind hole and not resting with the weight and or force of the side curtain laying on the fabric being pinched between the side curtain inner frame and flat top of the button ferrules. Are you happy with EM's plan of only two ferrules and post per door? Original aluminum car had three ferrules per door. All the MOSS ferrules are open ended ferrules. Now I'm concerned with milling the socket on my doors before because of the height effecting the fit frame to windshield. I'm going to outsource the repositioning of windshield and mounting side curtains and soft top. I want to do as much as I can. They are charging time & materials.. I'm trying to quote an old (long time ago) paper back book about Hot Rodding, that said one change will usually require other changes to get the desired effect.

[Michael C Henry]

I've cleaned up the threads on the 8 EM button head ferrules I have. They may be SS but have a strong magnetic attraction. The threads had ruff spots where it would take considerable effort to advance the nut. I used a triangular jeweler's file. The ruff threads looked as if they may be what you'd often see with SS. When you milled the fiberglass door for the ferruled, How did you do it? I'd probably use a Dremel an end cutting bit and a magnifier glasses, and get comfortable and take it slowly

[Mike I]

The two ferrules per door are plenty. If you're concerned that the window posts are too long, why not trim a little off the posts rather than open the ferrules? I used a spotface tool I borrowed from work. I think you're overthinking this, just take your time, measure carefully and go for it. Its not as complicated as you're thinking it is.

[Michael C Henry]

I usually over think these things and frequently am still surprised but yet something I hadn't considered. The tool s that I have and think might be used are a Fostner bit and a Dremel with a squared end bit. Heck I hadn't looked at the EM ferrules before and just now noticed the blind ends. I've had the soft top, side curtains, front bows and inside hoop for the soft top, and all the hardware ( snaps and lift dot fasteners )for about 19 years now and noticed the square shouldered heads and blind ends. I figured that the blind ends on the ferrules were there by reason they're meant to carry the weight or force of the side curtain and not have the fabric pinched hard between the side curtain inner frame and the top of the ferrule. At the time anything EM said was SS was SS. and stainless isn't as shinny as chrome but is forever, I'm thinking that if the first ferrule is SS then I may be able to turn the edges of the squared shoulder head with the threaded body chucked in to the drill press with a flat file and then smooth and polish with abrasive cloth. I've never done a soft top and my original 56 AC never had any side curtains. It has been 42 years since I had that car. Heck when I left LA in June of 71 I hadn't put the soft top on before. I got caught in rain and drove for a while leaning forward and inward until I stopped at a truck weigh station got completely soaked putting the soft top on the car, I didn't know about the two little feet on the front bows front center,that engage the top of the wind shield top frame. The soft top material stretched between the front bow frames and I ruined the soft top. Remember ata boys are great until the aw **** and you start over.

[Michael C Henry]

I took a chance, I tried one of the EM button headed ferrules. I chucked the threaded body into the drill press chuck and started with a large flat file.. I turned out to be Stainless Steel material and it took me longer to clean the file than it took to file in the nice radius and polish with sand paper and crocus cloth. I left about half of the original head thickness full-unchanged, So I rounded top outside of the button head ferrule to about half the thickness and not all the way to the hole, so there is still some flat on top. The first ferrule looks great. So I will continue. If I could get the soft and side curtain ferrules established before the windshield epic. I need to see other soft top and side curtain installations . How the edges and corner meet. The side curtains gauge the windshield positioning. and last would be to finish the soft top install. I'll take any advise, instructions and pictures.
Roadsters are great but it does rain some times, especially here in WA. I never started in the rain but been caught out in it. It poured down.

[KevinW]

Originally Posted by cycleguy55

Moss Motors has 3 different ferrules / sockets currently listed:
.....

I'm guessing the 3rd / last one may be the most desirable - it was used on Austin Healey 100, 100-6 and 3000 cars and has the lowest profile.

Just to say I just came across this thread/post using the search facility as prices for official Cobra ferrules in the UK can be abs ridiculous. Found the UK version of the Moss site, same catalogue numbers and good prices. Thank you!

[Michael C Henry]

If Everett-Morrison says its stuff is Stainless Steel Than it is Stainless Steel. The Ferrules from EM are intended to be installed in fiberglass bodied cars. They are 3/8"ID and 1/2"OD. Threaded externally with 1/2x13 NF nut and takes a 3/4" wrench. The ferrules have a blind hole with a solid bottom that the soft top and side curtain frames set into so the weight is being supported off the bottom and the side curtain bottom seal is not being crushed between. The ferrules flat top head is intended to help when installing the top or side curtain s so the tips of the support frames will stay on top and maybe find the hole and not be constantly falling to the side and dinging the painted body surfaces.

Another thing the aluminum bodied cars have a short lengths of pipe under the body surface that hold their smooth ferrules. They tend to have three ferruled per side on the doors. The ferrules end up being located near places where you might place yore arm, so those ferrules have rounded heads to save your arms. The fiber glass EM cars have only two side curtain frame down legs per side and are not anywhere you might place your arm, so the flat heads are better left flat. I over thought and rounded the ferrules I had from EM in their kits and had to buy another set of eight ferrules with nuts, and star washers. I just happened to catch someone in the office during the Covid closure an they sold and shipped replacement ferrules for $99.99. I did it to myself. I have the soft installed by "Convertibles Only" in Seattle. When they drilled the body for the soft top hoop frame ferrules, They caught the tops of the door latch support frames that are where the door latches catch, the drill caught an jerk side ways . The body hole is enlarged and the metal member was all ragged . I removed the metal frames and ground them for smoothness and for the ferrule and hut to fit through. I epoxied the hole to form the exact 1/2" round hole. I epoxied A SS fender washer under each hole to make a reinforced hole with a parallel surface for the nut to tighten to. The body hole looks great the excess hole filled by the epoxy is covered an not seen. Those frames had been painted earlier with Rust Oleum gloss black paint. The left side went great with the repaint as the weather was nice. the right side is not going well as the weather turned, it's cold an cloudy with wind. I discovered yet more I didn't know I didn't know. With Rust Oleum spray paint, The paint has to go beyond dry to cured before re spraying or else it wrinkles and has to be redone.