"Is it real?"

[misfit41]

I never thought of this being an annoyance,once I had my dream car,but I admit it is, The thing is,,i dont mind when a car person ask,,but 98% dont realize how much a "real" car is worth,and at the same time,think a "kit car"is a mustang with a 500 dollar body worth maybe 3k,I just get tired of explaining to people who have no clue about my car anyway.
I had a guy at a meet tell me whan people say,,"is it real" he just exclaims,, WHAT ?? you think it's NOT real,,your TOO funny !! ,,they dont ask again he says. I may try it. Tk

[Excaliber]

I never considered an SPF a "kit" by any means. There is a vast difference between a kit and a roller.

Ernie

[Nedsel]

You know, there are long-time owners of genuine Shelby-built Cobras that are equally tired of the "Is it real?" question. I determined long ago that, if they couldn't figure it out, the answer didn't matter. So I get a lot of amusement out of responding, "Nope. It's paper mache." Then I start looking around at the sky and add, "Damn - I hope it doesn't rain!" They usually look a bit worried, then walk in the other direction.

[Excaliber]

I've often wondered if I did have an original (CSX2000-3000) if I would tell just anybody who asked. Heck, I'm a little paranoid all ready about people knowing where the Excalibur is.

Hey I discovered if I put the "meat balls" and stickers on the car some people think it's a DIFFERENT Cobra than the "other" one around town that looks "just like it", but doesn't have any stickers!

Ernie

[Bill E]

Is it a real one) It was but I fixed it. Hu what do you mean. Well, it had this flimsy ass round pipe chaise under it so cut it out and put in a cromoly simie hard back chaise with stress paned floors the body was getting dints in it from all the people poking it to see if it was aluminum, so got rid of it and put on a Hand laid glass body you can mate elephants on. (So dus it got a 427) No I fix that to after the thread time it ate itself. I built a 351 that makes the same power and wont die. I also got rid of those carpy ass brakes and put in some 13" roaters and Alcon calipers. Then I put in a 5 speed trany that shifts better and has better gear ratios. Wow You did do a lot of work it looks grate. Thanks

[SSS]

Terry, Ernie, my point is the definition of a kit (in terms of Cobra replicas) is a frame, body, and parts that go together to make a car. An SPF is made from a frame, body, and parts. An FFR is made from a frame, body, and parts. The difference is the design, components, and who builds it.

If SPF sent you the parts for you to build the car, it would be a "kit".

[Excaliber]

SSS,,,yeah thats an accurate definition of a "kit" all right.

...and then there are the "home builts", NOT a kit, but an individual design. Buy a body from Kirkham, build your own frame etc. I would not consider that a "kit".

FFR is perhaps the classic example of a "real" kit. Wait,,,,,,,, can you use the word real and FFR in the same sentence? LOL

Ernie

[2savage]

Originally posted by Excaliber


As to "REAL":
If Shelby built it, then it's a "real" Shelby, end of story.

Not aware that Shelby 'built' any Cobras. He did buy cars from AC and buy engines from Ford then put one in the other though

[terry lee]

SSS,
You are apparently from another planet, or you are suffering from some sort of overdose.

When you find out HOW TO PURCHASE ALL THE PARTS NECESSARY to buld a car from Superformance, Kirkham, or Shelby American will you please post it here so the rest of us will know what you know.

This really pi$$es me off because I along with Jamo, Turk, Toy Collector, Flying Freddy, and numerous others have spent a bunch of money to have some entity called a company assemble a Total Working Chassis (complete with a guarantee) that we could have put together ourselves. Geeze, I may have been able to save a few more bucks using some donner parts from some wreck instead of the brand new ones engineered, furnished, and installed properly by these money grabbing bastards that call themselves automobile manufactures.

I'll take my chances at 125MPH + on the track in my SPF over your "Kit Car" any day of the week.

But we wish you the best in the assembly of your kit.

Happy Trails
TL

[Back in Black]

Sent me the parts to build a new "t-bird" coupe, THAT would also be a kit. The comparison does not hold water. Manufacturers such as SPF, Shelby, and any other manufacturer that sells you a full roller or especially a turnkey, is NOT selling you a "kit". They are nearly completed or completed cars.

[zipzip]

I would suggest that anything built after 1966 (was that the last year?...) would be a "replica" and therefor not "real", although I hate using that term. "Authentic" also has some negatives, but I think "original" might be the best. If you can see it, touch it, put gas in it, isn't it "real"?

As far as "kit" versus "manufactured", I would say that you go back to one of the ways the automakers are judged - by quantity. If SPF makes over, say, 500 TURNKEY cars in one year, it is a production car. If they supply a roller, and someone contracted by the end user puts in the guts, it is a "kit" in my opinion.

427 s/o is right on - just enjoy it and ignore the ignorant - they're just secretly jealous that you are in the best looking car ever made.

Don't people buy rollers, turnkeys, or a big bucket of parts for other reasons than to make it more "real"?

[REAL 1]

All cars, whether GM, Ford, SPF, FFR start out as a collection of parts.

Kit seems to imply that you receive the parts that make up the car ie. body, frame, suspension, wiring, hardware etc and assemble it.

Roller programs sell you the completed car sans engine and trans. You install and drive. Not really a "kit" as the term is normally used.

2Savage: You need to read some history books. The only person who built Cobras were Shelby. Period. AC merely supplied the platform which was modified as to body, suspension and wheels including an increase in track widith over the Ace to create the Cobra. Shelby turned an outdated 2 seat roadster into a World Champion and automotive legend.

As to the 427 Cobra, this was Shelby's baby from Miles pondering "what if" to the drawing board and design. AC simply fabricated chasis and body to Shelby spec.

There. Now you know the facts.

[Chaplin]

Oh look, the sun came up today.

[Excaliber]

Ha ha,,,,Shelby indeed DID "build" the cars, not a "kit", not a "home built". A "manufacturer", licensed to bo business as such. And like ALL manufacturers, choosing wisely, or stupidly as the case may be, the various "parts" and "pieces" necessary to assemble his "product".

If Ford shipped you the parts to build a "T-Bird", that would NOT be a "kit", that would be a "miracle" and when were done you would have a "home built". Why? Because those parts are NOT available as a "kit" to the general public, like FFR is.

Same thing applies to SPF, simply NOT available as a "kit". Kirkham? Now that I think about it, same thing! NOT available as a "kit", ALL THOUGH you can purchase some significant parts, when your done you have a "home built".

If DV builds you a C.R. it's NOT a "home built" and NOT a "kit". He is a "proffesional" builder. It's a "custom" build by a recognized builder, all though you could call it a "kit" as C.R.'s ARE offered that way.

This IS complicated,,,,,and yet,,,,,so easy at the same time!

Ernie

[SSS]

Terry, SPF is a nice Cobra replica, but not because it's not built from a "kit". I'm not building my Cobra, mine is being built in a factory too. My manufacturer offers kits along with turnkeys. It's much cheaper than an SPF, and somehow it's still professionally built.

I also prefer to have a professional build my car. But, there's no reason to expect SPF to be better at putting a Cobra together than any other professional. What makes an SPF different from mine is the design of the car and what components go in it. Which professional builds it should have little to do with the value.

I'm sorry you find my audacity to compare an SPF to a "kit" so offensive. If SPF started offering kits, would that affect the quality of your car somehow?

[SSS]

Originally posted by Back in Black

Sent me the parts to build a new "t-bird" coupe, THAT would also be a kit. The comparison does not hold water. Manufacturers such as SPF, Shelby, and any other manufacturer that sells you a full roller or especially a turnkey, is NOT selling you a "kit". They are nearly completed or completed cars.

Yep, that would be a "t-bird" kit. No, SPF does not sell you a kit, but they build the car from a kit. I define a kit as the body, frame, and all the parts necessary to make a Cobra. How do you define a kit?

Gordon Levy builds FFRs. Totally finished turnkeys. He builds the cars from a kit, just like SPF builds theirs. The only difference is who builds it and what components they put in it.

[2savage]

Originally posted by REAL 1


2Savage: You need to read some history books. The only person who built Cobras were Shelby. Period. AC merely supplied the platform which was modified.

Did a bit of research on the web. Here's what I came up with....

February 1962.
The first 260 Roadster, minus engine and transmission, is air freighted on February 2, 1962, to Shelby's shop in Southern California.

Shelby had been talking with people at AC Cars, Ltd. about a new engine for their Ace. They agreed to send Shelby an Ace to build his first prototype with. Shelby’s dream was on its way to becoming a reality. A few weeks later, the first AC "Cobra" was delivered, engineless, to the Los Angeles airport. A mere eight hours after being unloaded, the first Cobra roared to life.

Finally,
http://www.cobragt40.co.za/Cobra%20Hist.htm

Certainly Shelby did some chassis tuning and tweaked the suspension among other things. It would appear from the information in the books and on the web that the AC ACE had been in existence for many years and was successfully raced in Europe during this time.

I guess this a bit 'OT' for what is a real one. I say they're all 'real'. I think therefore etc etc.

[427 S/O]

Websters dictionary.........

Kit...

1. A set of articles or implements used for a specific purpose:
2. A set of parts or materials to be assembled:
3. A packaged set of related materials:

There you go...No matter how you boys spin it, it's still a kit.

Feel like someone took the red out
out of your candy?.

[SSS]

Ernie, "home built" is an appropriate term. I agree with that. The affect of it is debatable.

[REAL 1]

The first prototype with 260 engine XHP, was just that. A prototype. The car was further developed through testing by Shelby as noted above and became the Cobra. The name AC Shelby Cobra was quickly dropped as were the AC badges and the car became known exclusively in the U.S. as the Shelby Cobra with Cobra badges. If not for Shelby, the Ace and probably AC would have faded away into automotive history as a footnote somewhere.

Dem is da facts.