Aluminum flywheel vs Steel and Clutch ?

[FUNFER2]

I'm having KC build me a Pond alum. 482 cu. engine. (625-650 HP) Now I need to start asking for particulars. I have the TKO 3550.

With those of you that have tried both alum. & steel flywheels, mainly for the street, what are your experiences, what worked better, ect. ?

Second- what is the best brand choice for my application

Which type of disk, McLeod, Centerforce, Hays, Ram ect. ?
Dual Friction, puck type ect. ?

[Ant]

FUNFER2,

I guess it all depends on if you want a quicker revving engine go for a light alloy flywheel or probably a better way to go is flexplate for the starter gear, and use a Tilton or AP steel flywheel which is only as big as the size of your clutch driven plates eg 7.5" in my case as I am using a Tilton cerametallic twin plate 740ft Ibs torque pressure plate. I dont think they use alloy flywheels as much as they did in the 1960's and 1970's with the steel insert for the clutch!!!

The ceramic material has some ability to allow slippage for rally car and road cars. Also we run a QM 19Ibs steel bellhousing which gives some safety.

[Ronbo]

I don't know how far you are in sourcing components, but I had Keith supply the entire driveline from engine to trannie. Considring the cost of the components and shipping from several vendors I saved money and everything is setup, ready to go.

Went with the aluminum flywheel per Kirkham and others recommendation.

You can see pics of the "kit" in my gallery. (Kieth is also a Mass-flo dealer so I bought the injection system through him as well)

[blykins]

I have used an aluminum flywheel on a Cobra before. This was on a 428FE. The differences were it needed a little more clutch when taking off from a dead stop and it seemed to let the engine rev a little more freely. On a light car, (unless money is a worry) I don't see any reason not to use one. It's less weight hanging off the back of the crankshaft.

As for clutches, stay away from puck style discs for the street. Use a good dual friction setup from McLeod or RAM. Stay away from Centerforce as a lot of guys have trouble with the weights.

I carry all of the above, and when I spec FE clutches for Cobras, I usually go with an 11" dual friction clutch disc. Depending on the horsepower and application, I'll either go with a diaphragm plate with an organic/ceramic disc, or a Long style plate with an organic/ceramic or ceramic/Kevlar disc.

You want to put the power to the ground without slippage, but you don't want something that will aggravate you to death on the street. However, one thing that guys don't understand is that you rarely can have your cake and eat it too. You can't have a clutch that will hold 650hp and actuate like a Honda. You can get into twin disc setups, but they're about twice the price of a single disc setup.

I have a McLeod clutch package that I use for 600-650hp Cobras with FE's. If you're interested, shoot me an email or PM.

[FUNFER2]

Ronbo- how much was the mass-flo, complete ?
I did a fast search and only found the system at their site and it was apx. $4,000.

[Ronbo]

Originally Posted by FUNFER2

Ronbo- how much was the mass-flo, complete ?
I did a fast search and only found the system at their site and it was apx. $4,000.

My Invoice from Kieth wasn't itemized, so I can't really give you any one part's cost.

Talk to Lance at KC and get an estimate, my package was a little over $27k, pretty good considering the upgrades (Shelby block) Mass-flo and driveline. I think the Shelby blocks have gone up again.

[blykins]

Kevin,

What is your trans again? Is it a newer TKO 500/600 or is it a 3550?

[FUNFER2]

It's the TKO 3550 I believe.

[undy]

Originally Posted by FUNFER2

It's the TKO 3550 I believe.

It's toast, within the first couple weeks of drive time, w/ 600+ lbft..

TKO600, 0.82 overdrive.. No question about it, the only way to go.

OBTW.. Those 28 spline currie axles of yours are toast too and you'll have to change the diff to 31 spline. Kev, puttin' a big motor in it (as you're finding out) is the tip-o-the-iceburg. Once you put that 482 in it the standard Lone Star drivetrain fare behind the engine is too frigile and must be replaced. Dig deeper, there's another 4 or 5 grand you'll have to come up with. The engine's about 60% or your costs to get there. Trust me, I know..

You're constantly trying to reinvent the wheel. Listen to Keith. He'll guide you through the whole process. Ram aluminum flywheel with a "Long Syle" Ram clutch, rated at 2600 lbs. He'll tell you what you need, for the whole car. LISTEN TO HIM!!!

Sorry to many trips to the Keurig machine this AM...

All truth, no bullsheet

Dave

[FUNFER2]

Hey bud, that's all part of the plan. Any part that is too weak, is coming out. The axles may be ok with such a light car and I will not be using slicks. As we all know, a hard launch with sticky tires is very hard on all the drive train.

"You're constantly trying to reinvent the wheel". Not really, I just like researching everything, ask my wife. lol
And, there's no harm with asking others which products work the best. That's what is so great about CC, everybody will lend help and answer even the stupidest questions to high teck.

From the start, I've trusted Keith and always will.

Do you have a aluminum flywheel, if so, how do you like it ?
I don't quite understand some problems with starting from a traffic light with a alum. flywheel ?

[Stentor]

Originally Posted by FUNFER2

The axles may be ok with such a light car and I will not be using slicks. As we all know, a hard launch with sticky tires is very hard on all the drive train.

From the start, I've trusted Keith and always will.

Do you have a aluminum flywheel, if so, how do you like it ?
I don't quite understand some problems with starting from a traffic light with a alum. flywheel ?

The GY Billboards that you are getting are going to hook up much better than your current tires.

Yes, Keith knows his stuff--follow his guidance and you should be in good shape.

Incidentally, I have a McLeod Street Twin clutch and aluminum flywheel and have been very pleased.

[blykins]

Also, if you post your cam and intake specs, I'll be able to tell you where your hp/tq peaks will be. That will help in deciding on the overdrive ratio. Usually solid rollers give a hint that you're gonna be spinning the engine pretty high, but large a displacement will tame a large duration.

[Jon Miller]

I went with aluminum and am happy...flywheel cost me $80 used at the local mustang shop, resurface and match balance was $200, clutch was about $50 in the CC parts for sale section........Kid did the install for a chocolate milkshake. Just goes to show that these things don't have to cost a fortune.

-Jon

[wizard man]

funfer you will soon know what 600 plus will feel like keith did my 482fe on my kirkham and i have not seen this posted yet so let me (RESPECT THAT POWER BECAUSE IT REMINDS THE FORGETFUL ONES) breaking loose at 80 was soiled my undies

[Stentor]

Originally Posted by wizard man

funfer you will soon know what 600 plus will feel like keith did my 482fe on my kirkham and i have not seen this posted yet so let me (RESPECT THAT POWER BECAUSE IT REMINDS THE FORGETFUL ONES) breaking loose at 80 was soiled my undies

Yes, you absolutely need to respect the power--no doubt about that.

However, you might need to get some better tires (e.g., Avons, GY Billboards, drag radials) if you are breaking the tires loose at 80 mph.

[FUNFER2]

I agree, most don't know how to respect power. Same with the sprints cars, especially the younger guys.

I'm now looking for prices on a new Tremec 600 to handle the HP/TQ.
I got a descent price from someone here for $2,095.

[patrickt]

An aluminum flywheel in a Cobra also lends a certain margin of safety. When you're moving up fast through the gears, a quick shift, at say 5500 RPM, into third will bust your tires loose a little faster with a heavier flywheel. A lighter flywheel will be slightly more forgiving -- sometimes you want that. Personally, I always prefer to be forgiven; especially in the Cobra... thank you very much.

[FUNFER2]

Dave- "Given a 3.31 rear ratio, .82 final drive, and a 27" tire you will turning 2195 RPM at 65, 2027 at 60. 26.5" tire height will yield 2237 at 65.

All things equal, with a 0.64 and a 27" tire you'll see 1714 RPM at 65 and 1582 RPM at 60."

To save gas in 5th gear from 65 mph-75 mph and up, would the .64 be a better choice ?

A potential problem may be with my 331 gears on the highway at 60 mph, will the engine be running too high of rpm's for 4th gear, but too low for 5th and will be lugging ?

Like I said, 331 gearing, 295/50 tires, at 60 mph my rpm's are at 2,000.

These are quote's from another site. I don't understand with his taller gears, how he can have such low rpm's at the speed he's at ?

"I run a TKO-600 w/ 0.64 OD and 3.27 gears out back. RPM id 2100 at 75mph. My engine is a 427 Side Oiler, 10.6:1 CR, Edelbrock Performer RPM heads, single 850cfm carb, and a VERY heathy cam.

but 2100 @ 75mph while good for the hwy means that you rev up 4th gear for those 40-65 mph jaunts down back roads and traffic situations"

Another-

"I running a TKO600 with lots of h.p. With 370 gears in the axel my rpm's are at 2100 at 70 mph. in 5th gear. 125 mph at 4000 rpm. good luck."

Last example-
depending on camshaft you might want to think about a road race version tcet4617 for the 0.82 overdrive

some of the bb guys we sold to in the past had issues with the 0.64 od in that the car was doing 80-90 mph before they could really use 5th gear- either the motor wouldn't work down below 2500 rpm in 5th or they couldnt wind out till that speed to get it into 5th

also what rear end ratio are you going with i have some customers running 3.73 /0.64 od for a fix of above problem

this is a rare occurance but its something to concider before laying out the cake

if you have any ??s give us a call
FORTE'S PARTS CONNECTION
508-875-0016 "

Getting confused on which OD, .64 or .82 ?

[wizard man]

funfer my combos are 3;31 rear toploader from david kee and i love it by the way i have a jag rear for sale with 3;31 new its posted on club cobra if your interested but i think you have astraight axle

[FUNFER2]

I do have a straight axle and it would take a lot of work to change to a IRS, and maybe not even work at all. But thank you anyway,