Got an e mail fro Todd Andrews at Roush this morning and my motor is almost all back together and is scheduled for dyno by this weekend. It is to leave and ship back to Phoenix the beginning of next week. I hope Anthem is capable to do the install. I should be on the road soon. Has anyone talked to ( John ) Anthem recently? Are they set up to do the work?

"It took it's first breath" according to Todd Andrews at Roush. My motor has been on the Dyno and it getting it self wrapped up to ship back to Phoenix. It will be back in Phoenix next week and in it's resting place by the weekend, thanks to John at Anthem Motors. It will be good to get my Cobra back just in time for Christmas. Nice to see a little chrome and polished aluminum under the tree.

Congrats!! That will be one of the best christmas presents I can think of
Ron

Tim,
Any word on your motor from Roush? Will it make it here by Christmas?

Ron,
My motor has shipped and will be here Monday or Tuesday. Todd has been great. I hope the car is put together by Christmas but realistic with the Holiday probable right after. Good to go so far. One of John's mechanics, Rob Varetoni is going to do the install. With Anthem closed up, he has a shop off of 26th and Bell rd. Just 5 minutes from my home. Roush, according to Todd is going to set him up as an authorized Roush dealer I believe since Anthem is closed. He is a great mechanic and knows the Roush motors and Cobras. Hated to see Anthem close but John has been great with the care of my Cobra and motor the whole way. Rob's shop is going called No Limit Auto.

Let me know how he is to work with and how it goes. Hope you get back on the road soon

there was a 2 post exchange on the first page and after reading all the posts it was never revisted, I am interested. Do rings rotate on the piston or not?. I have always worked under the impression that if they do it is minimal, for 2 reasons 1) it would create more wear in the piston/cylinder wall and after pulling hundreds of engines down the wear is usually relgated to the top groove/cylinder and attributed to the heat/ring tension 2) the crosshatch used to seat the rings would act to prevent/restrict rotation. So which is it?? Usually the sticking is the ring sticking in the groove and not expanding on to the wall correctly.

rotating
 

According to my knowledge, the rings do rotate. But if, or not seems to be secondary. If they stick, they can't rotate - correct. But why did they stick? Was the ring gap to small? Were the rings not plane? Out of round? Or the ring gap out of round?

Has the engine been run too cold? If Roush revvs it high at the dyno and you only cruise at 55 we are looking at vastly different operating conditions, even though the thermostat should balance that out.
However, an aluminium block dissipates heat so much better that you may experience all sorts of heat differentials in the block.

I also agree with Stentor, you should have gotten a new engine right away. Or at least an interim engine to enjoy your car over thanksgiving and christmas.

Dom

Guys,
Roush tore that motor right down to the block. I have a Shelby block. The motor was completely gone through. I know that it has new pistons, rings, ect. Beehive valve springs were also added. I have not gotten the whole list yet from Roush. When they dyno the motor, they also break it in. It is good to go when I get it. As for the temp it always ran normal at about 200 - 210 degrees. Mine was the 3rd. engine like this they built. According to Todd Andrews at Roush they have learned a lot since mine and have made many improvements which I have now. Got to get it in the car to see.

Yes, rings do rotate on the piston.......how much, I'm not sure, but I've seen it in a few motors I've built and later gone thru to freshen them up. some motors more than others, I have no idea why, they were all built by me the same way........

I've often wondered why automotive pistons are not made similar to outboard motor pistons, with a "pin" in the ring groove so the rings can't rotate.........

David

Two-stroke outboards have ports in the cylinder walls so the rings MUST be pinned to keep the ends from clipping in the ports. In addition to the added complexity and expense, the pins can cause problems themselves. They can work outward and score the cylinder. They can also get loose and migrate through the piston crown.

Is John at Anthem Motors out of business or is he just relocating?

I worked 30 years in the bike industry, it is my opinion that they put the pins in to insure proper location so they don't hook in the ports. I accept that they move some, but I don't think they "rotate" which would indicate circling in the ring groove. Because there are precise locations the end gaps are set at, if the rings rotated they surely wouldn't rotate exactly the same and at some point all the gaps would line up for a period. Usually when ring sticks, it is the sealing against the cylinder that is the problem, not that it can't rotate. The same 2-strokes that are pinned don't rotate at all and seal,they also "stick" rings causing a loss of sealing. It still seems unlikely there would be more than a minor "oscillation" in the ring movement back and forth because of the crosshatch. Again, pistons are soft compared to ring material, and a constant rotation would effectively wear the ring groove out in no time,especially moving up and down so rapidly. As I pointed out earlier, the ring land that takes the worse beating is the top one from being so close to the heat. Except in a case of piston seizure, I don't recall ever seeing a second groove wear out. Rings are also of various configurations, some dykes type, some with a taper on one edge....with no particular concern for rotation, but for better cylinder wall sealing. In the 30 years in the bike business I pulled down at least 100 sportbike engines as well as snowmobile and dirtbikes,watercraft and offroad vehicles. I always examine every part on disassembly and have never seen a set of rings that had gaps staggered differently than how they were installed. There may have been some minor variances,but since they are installed by eye instead of some precise gauge, the variance could just be from the assembly. Once again that would indicate that all the rings rotate equally, which seems unlikely as well since they are constructed 3 different ways, of 3 different materials. Maybe there's one of those engineering clips with a clear cylinder that would show some, but I haven't seen one.

I don't think the rings actually rotate per se, but they do move from the installed location......After about one hour of break-in and dyno time on my pressant race motor, I changed the oil and filter and when I drained the oil, I found about a quart of water in the pan, so I tore the engine down to see what the problem was.....(failed head gasket)

As I tore it down, I was very careful with everything as this was a brand new BOSS 302 block and I just knew it had a crack in it somewhere and would have to send it back to Ford. I took photos to document any and everything I did and found and what I found was a failed head gasket, causing the water in the oil..
I also found that the rings on 4 pistons had "move/rotated" some from the original position..... I made sure checking 2 or 3 times each piston as to the location of the ring gaps before installing them in the block, the rings were put as per directions on the box (Mahle rings).....on 3 pistons the ring movement was not very much, may 20 to 30 degress at most, on the forth one, the top ring had rotated enough so that the gap was lined up with the gap of the second ring, not good..... I checked with a number of engine builders and they told me they had seen this before, kinda normal for some rings to rotate some, they all said depending on the ring type/manufacter, some rings "move" more than others.........

on other engines I've done, ring movement/rotation has been minor....

Had I not seen it myself, I would have never thought the rings would rotate....

David

Think he's OOB.....
Just heard about it from a guy at the PAV....

Wud it dyno at this time? :3DSMILE:

E

Don't have the paper work from the dyno yet. As soon as I get it, I'll post the #'s.

http://i158.photobucket.com/albums/t...by_korean3.jpg

E :D

I'd keep the car off the wheel dyno for at least 1000 miles and break it in easy. Warm it up very good if you put it on the wheel dyno again. You'll probably have a solid engine for years to come. Just an opinion.

Greg,
You are absolutly right. That I know.