What are my engine choices

[Aussie Mike]

Originally Posted by Rog246

Wouldn't that stir up all the Jag owners !!
Just keep the lid on it down-" it's just a worked 4.2 mate "

It's legit. Ford owned Jaguar for a while

[Rog246]

When you passed them Mike you could almost say TATA now !! LOL

[750hp]

Am I mistaken, or hasn't Craig W previously said that he has (or can get) an FE motor complianced in his AP cars?

[kyleb]

Dimis.
No worries.
I hope I didn't come across as terse.
It's sometimes hard to gauge intent in written word.
I have been a ford guy my whole life, so if I didn't have to comply with emissions at the time then my car would have a Ford engine fitted.
My point is that now I do have the LS in it, I'm very impressed.
It's a shame that people feel they can't voice their views on these subjects.
I don't think Zacson was shot down in flames, he was just wanting to know what choices are available and I feel it's been shown that there are many great options nowadays.
Cheers

[d488y2]

I'm going with a 1995 EFI 351 Windsor for my build. My Engineer says it shouldn't be a problem just as long as it can pass an IM240 test and ADR79.

[750hp]

How did Robnell get an 8 throttle body / Motec big block ford through rego back in the day? Different times, but that was also never a factory motor combo...

[Towmaster]

Originally Posted by 750hp

How did Robnell get an 8 throttle body / Motec big block ford through rego back in the day? Different times, but that was also never a factory motor combo...

I could have got mine registered with a carby as late as 2003...... So I am guessing a fuel injected motor back then would have been ok.

The 460 was available in F trucks right up to 1997.... according to Wikipedia. If guys now are using Fuel injected 351's (also fitted to F trucks of the same vintage) then I am guessing maybe if the 1997 460 was fuel injected? then it could also be an option? Just thinking aloud.....
The FE engine ceased production in 1976. (Wikipedia)

Were Robnell's produced as an ICV or a limited run production vehicle? If it was limited run production then they could get their own engines tested and then use them?

[albanycobra]

I need a 460 for my GT40.....

[Gav]

Robnell where a limited production car, so they probably did.

[spookypt]

Originally Posted by Gav

Robnell where a limited production car, so they probably did.

Gav all my research suggests only factory built cars were lvc. The kits sold were icv.

[Gav]

Originally Posted by spookypt

Gav all my research suggests only factory built cars were lvc. The kits sold were icv.

It depended on the state sold I think.

[kyleb]

The factory built Robnells were approved as limited run production vehicles.
I was lucky enough to see the factory car on the dyno at the EPA vehicle testing facility in the late 80s at Altona whilst trying to get the engines approved.
The requirements were certainly a lot less stringent in those days.

[spookypt]

Originally Posted by kyleb

The factory built Robnells were approved as limited run production vehicles.
I was lucky enough to see the factory car on the dyno at the EPA vehicle testing facility in the late 80s at Altona whilst trying to get the engines approved.
The requirements were certainly a lot less stringent in those days.

And only those low production factory built cars, built and complianced pre 89 were legal the with 8stacks and live pipes. Robnell aren't all the same sadly as I have very recently discovered.

Spookypt

[kyleb]

You would think that these regulations would be harmonised with all states in agreeance but sadly not so.
It's awesome that you were able to get yours through and that's the way I feel it should be in all states.
Our little ICV community, I wouldn't have thought has too much of an environmental impact taken into account the amount on the road.
Unfortunately for the Vic guys the 8 stack may have to go on after its passed !!

[damage]

Like I said it is all up to the individual transport officers interpretation of the rules that they are enforcing. Different people read things differently hence why this forum erupts into the odd argument every now and then

I fail to see why it is a common belief that an 8 stack wouldn't pass emissions and based on Rogers comment earlier in this thread someone else has also run this process previously and been successful.

Basically and very simplistically if you look at a modern day plenum all it is is an inlet manifold that brings the eight inlet runners into one common butterfly and air filter arrangement. You still have throttle position sensors, still have map sensors, a MAF isn't altogether necessary although could still be utilized if you had to have one and then still have o2 sensors so why cant it pass emissions if its in the hands of a good tuner.

[albanycobra]

I already said you can get an 8 Stack Windsor approved.Roaring Forties have everything you need to pass emissions and have had for years. RF have passed IM240 testing with a windsor 8stacked which is more difficult than adr37/01.

Here's what I learnt about emissions while getting my car licensed in 2013. Cat convertors have come along away in the last few years and secondary combustion happens in modern Cats, this process really cleans up your emissions. By using these Cats it allows motors with a bit of overlap to get through with a bit of tuning. Also modern programmable ecu's have a much higher resolution which gives much better control and closed loop operation.

[kyleb]

Originally Posted by albanycobra

I already said you can get an 8 Stack Windsor approved.Roaring Forties have everything you need to pass emissions and have had for years. RF have passed IM240 testing with a windsor 8stacked which is more difficult than adr37/01.

Here's what I learnt about emissions while getting my car licensed in 2013. Cat convertors have come along away in the last few years and secondary combustion happens in modern Cats, this process really cleans up your emissions. By using these Cats it allows motors with a bit of overlap to get through with a bit of tuning. Also modern programmable ecu's have a much higher resolution which gives much better control and closed loop operation.

And as I said before... There are different requirements between states.
Have a look at the RF website and you will note the 302 can be used in all states except Victoria.
That's what sucks !!
Sorry Jasbel for the thread shift.

[Beejay]

Originally Posted by albanycobra

I already said you can get an 8 Stack Windsor approved.Roaring Forties have everything you need to pass emissions and have had for years. RF have passed IM240 testing with a windsor 8stacked which is more difficult than adr37/01.

Here's what I learnt about emissions while getting my car licensed in 2013. Cat convertors have come along away in the last few years and secondary combustion happens in modern Cats, this process really cleans up your emissions. By using these Cats it allows motors with a bit of overlap to get through with a bit of tuning. Also modern programmable ecu's have a much higher resolution which gives much better control and closed loop operation.

Pretty sure that the IM240 is just the test method, it does not specify the limits required.

How many test facilities are there in Qld? Does everyone up there need to do the test like in NSW?

I agree, it would be great if there was a clear set of rules and regulations that are black and white.

Cheers,

Ben

[albanycobra]

Victoria ,you use the club rego option and run what ever you want....Whats Bernie running in his Alloy Kirkham?

You are right the RF page does say ADR79 but is that actually right? Treeve?

[DaveW]

Ben is correct, IM240 is a driving 4 minute (....240 sec) test where the driver follows a simulated throttle on/off, cruise, RPM, and load over time cycle.
Attached emissions equipment captures the emissions output measurements during the test.

The measurements are then compared to the relevant ADR37/xx requirements for a pass/failure result.

I have discussed with several tuners as i work towards my ECU selection,
The key components of the output is Tune, Cam, Compression. O2 sensors, not throttle bodies or ignition system.
The induction side...# of throttle bodies will have no effect on emissions provided the fuel A/R is tuned appropriately, the issue for big throttle bodies, is the ratio of opening to pedal movement affecting large TB, and multiple large TBs, vehicle drivability.....chime in here Gav...
The CAM and O2 sensors seem to be the issue. The wilder the cams, the more total unburnt hydrocarbons TUHC produced at the relatively low rpm scale used on the IM240 test cycle.
The leaner you go to correct this, elevates the NOx and you fail at this measurement.
I'm told that good wide band O2 sensors are a key factor in the ability (speed) of the ECU to react to changed conditions and that most vehicles fail the IM240 at the throttle chop and accel points in the drive cycle.

This is all I've learnt so far, but suffice to say, there is a good chance you will pass provided the CAM is from something relatively mild and the tuner is on the ball.

Dave