Registration and engine choice in NSW

[Tenrocca]

Morning all,

A few months back I wrote to the RTA regarding compliant engines. Finally got a reply attached (after follow up phone calls and faxes). I guess it basically says what we all thought the rules where, although Im going to call the guy to clarify a few things - a I think it could be open to slightly different interpretations, particularly what constitutes a 3 year old compliant vehicle (eg, is the actual donor vehicle, or any vehicle from that a model line that ended less then 3 years ago).

I heard a rumour at nationals about the rules possibly changing, and its stated in the letter that they are not.

Cheers.

[Ralph_C]

OK... question ....

4th para. implies you can use anything that tests ok (which would include a 427 - may need to be injected to get past emissions test) .... does anyone know how much such a test costs???

[Beejay]

Ralph,

I think it would be almost impossible to get that engine to pass.

These modern motors need carbon canisters, cat converters etc. etc. to meet the specs, so I think it would be a big ask for an old dirty motor to meet 2007 standards.

Ben

[Rebel1]

There is one other aspect of that RTA letter worth looking into.

Paragraph 4 states: " you will need to have the vehicle tested at an RTA emission testing facility and pass"

This same sentence is used in the Queensland DOT regs, but guess what?.......

There is no no such testing facility here in Queensland....don't know about NSW.

A friend of mine has currently offered up his engine to the DOT here and has requested it be booked into their testing facility. They advised him they don't have a testing facility and suggested he send his engine to Melbourne for testing.

He is now talking to his local member.

[Philm]

If I can remember correctly when I was engineering my car we had the threat of the rules changing. I had to have the car done by the end of that year otherwise the new adrs would be in place and the engine we had would not be complient and would have to be tested.

The only option offered was a facility in Melbourne, I think it is with one of the car manufacturers and the cost was about $3000.00 per test and new car manufacturers found it hard to pass the first, second or third time.

The tests are quite involved and take about 6 hours to complete.

I asked about Penrith and Botony and was told that these site are not suitable for these tests. The Penrith and Botony sites are only used to check vehicles that are not new and are looking at regaining rego after a defect notice or re-registering an older car.

I think with the new ADRS it would be impossible to get an older engine thru, as Beejay has said.

My 2 cents, remember I am relying on my memory!!!


Phil

[sambo]

It's for many of the above reasons that I'm considering a 6.0L Gen IV, which meets the Euro 3 emissions. The problem is finding a cheap(ish) donor vehicle.

[Rebel1]

sambo, last I heard, a new LS2 crate engine costs about $9000.00. You still need to buy a computer, BCM, FBW throttle assy, alternator and a flywheel.

Thats still a reasonable price for a 400HP ( minimum) state of the art, all alloy engine. I can assure you a well built 351W will cost $15000.00 and thats carburetted and iron block.

All you need to so is drink more cans for recycling into chev engines.

[sambo]

Haha no problem with the cans and yes, I spoke to Eagle Autos today and they're selling the LS2 crate for $9,900. That's with US water/fuel pumps, etc. When you add clutch, 6 spd gearbox, ECU, etc I reckon you're talking at least 20k for the driveline alone. So I'm going to look into the 4.0L from Lexus before I go any further with the GM idea.

[stuartt]

i didn't think crate engines were allowed anymore.

[Asp302]

Well for my 2 cents worth, when we started building people did take their cars to the Penrith facility for emissions testing. We were worried that since we were LPG and they were talking about emissions testing for LPG that we would have to take it to Melbourne (at a cost of about 3 grand plus transporting). What pees me off is that they are so hard on us, but the new fords etc generally dont pass the tests but since they are a big corporation it doesnt seem to matter. We ran LPG because it was the only way our dinasaur motor would get through as at the time we didnt have to worry about emissions testing, and guess what???? When the silly bugger at the RTA did the paper work he didnt put down we were LPG on the rego papers, so we can change over to petrol if we want hehehehehehehe. He also put our make as Cobra on the papers instead of Homemade or Indvid Constructed. Double bonus!!!!!

[Ralph_C]

Originally Posted by Beejay

These modern motors need carbon canisters, cat converters etc. etc. to meet the specs, so I think it would be a big ask for an old dirty motor to meet 2007 standards.

Ben, I was thinking a modern alloy 427 from the US. Bullitt Performance are a distributor for Shelby Automotive 427s (ads in latest Street Rodding). It would need cats, cans, etc. but would be a talking point... expensive (probably over $30k once passed), but ....


I read a couple of years ago that Corsa had their engines tested to Euro III spec (LS1 in a Monaro - 330+kw) - passed first time - comment was that it was all about the tune.

Robnell had their 429 passed (though that was late '90s)

and in Snaketales (2nd last issue), Bruce Allen (Editor) wrote about a guy in SA who convinced their RTA that he could use a 427 if it passed the test. Wonder if he is actually going to try to do it?


I would like to hear if any individual (rather than manufacturer) has actually succeeded and what was required.

If I thought there was a good chance, I would consider building another Cobra with an alloy big block (or maybe even put one in the Dax - it was designed for a 427 anyway).

There may be an opportunity for a tuning company/importer to make it happen on the basis of a number of possible sales to ICV builders - ie. a complete compliant engine including ECU, intakes/fuelling, back to cats... cost spread over a number of sales (but probably unlikely anyone will bother).

[Rob. Smith]

Just a bit to add...fuel injection must be factory "unadjustable" type so you can only use OEM stuff and an engine to match. Most engine designs before 2003 won't pass. They must be totally "stock standard" for the RTA to consider. LPG won't pass the emission standards any more as won't the big auto builders vehicles either....the trick is to meet the requirements of the latest "values"......it's all about litigation...the RTA doesn't want to know about ICV's...litigation can even come down to individual staff members of the RTA so there's not much enthusiasm at base level either.
Spell check says RTA should be RAT......say no more !
Smithy.

[Philm]

One of the biggest hurdles would be inconsistancy from all involved, from the engineer to person behind the counter at the RTA.

The only reason I would concider testing is if you want to build a "real replica" , would be to get one of those glorious small block Fords fitted and passed.


Phil

[norm down under]

Had My Reg In 04 In Vic . Step1 Get A Engineer . I Went To Damaged Auction Bought Whole And Used Engine Computer Wireing Loom Steering And Most Parts To Make Car Go .engineer And Vic Roads Very Happy ,used All Jag Undergear