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What Special Parts Needed for Adding a Supercharger
After putting 500 miles on my new-to-me Backdraft, I've decided it's way too slow for my liking, despite a few people on here trying to tell me I would think otherwise...
Anyways, I'm thinking about throwing on a supercharger while the car is locked away for this Colorado winter. My car has a 5.0 Coyote in it. What special parts do I need to retrofit a roots or twin-screw blower onto the car? Or has someone added a centrifugal supercharger to a 5.0 Backdraft that could also speak to that? I like the look of the top mount better but like the idea of mid/high range power more so with the centrifugal. Are y'all mounting the heat exchanger behind the radiator or in front? I know Vintage and some other companies have put superchargers on several of their cars, but they're asking a ridiculous amount of money for them. I can piece together a good kit for less than $4500 including injectors, intake and the handheld tuner but want to make sure I'm not missing anything special needed to retrofit. |
96535, from all the rave reviews I've heard of the Coyote power, I'm wondering if maybe your's in not tuned to its potential. Surely there are some hot dog chips that would liven it up, a bunch. I'd look into the tuning aspect before dropping even $4500 on a huffer. (BTW, superchargers are not just a bolt on and presto. Compression, cam, heads, timing, on and on are important to proper performance with one).
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Karl's right...to add a supercharger would probably require considerable work to the engine. You'd most likely need to lower your engine's compression ratio to avoid detonation.
There are two types...one sits on top of the engine where the intake manifold would go, the other looks like an overgrown alternator (it's called a centrifugal supercharger) and will take up a bit of real estate to the side of your water pump. The 289 models were sometimes fitted with a single centrifugal supercharger...and IIRC TWO centrifugal superchargers were used to make the SuperSnake models. How much extra air/fuel mixture is forced into the engine is adjustable...pulley ratios and all that sort of stuff. It would probably be possible to add a centrifugal one to an existing engine if you "gear" it properly. Again, it all depends on how high your compression ratio is. Good luck! Cheers! Dugly :cool: |
Why not just remove the existing Coyote and replace it with a supercharged Coyote? All the engineering work has been done, including engine management systems.
You may need to have the hood modified or replaced - but I'm sure Vintage / Cashburn can tell you all about that. |
This is the route I plan to follow.
The stock Coyote makes about 435hp. To the rear wheels you lose about 15% or so, now you're down to 370'ish. But we live in CO, and you lose about 2-3% per thousand feet. I live at 6,200' ASL, and frequently drive above 10,000' ASL. On a hot day at altitude you're down around 300hp. I agree with you, not nearly enough power. I'll start out with a stock 11-14 Coyote. I'll pull the heads off, and do some mild upgrades - P&P, springs, ARP studs, and MLS gaskets. Probably don't need all that, but a little extra insurance. I'll use a Roushe stage 2 kit, with a slightly smaller pulley. Roushe has a good reputation fro programming. That should put me at about 620'ish hp at the crank, 530 at the rear wheel. With a supercharger, the correction factor is significanly smaller. My FFR made 515hp on Lou's dyno, with the correction factor. I'll be happy to be making more than that. :) |
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I've had 2 Roushcharged Mustangs one 4.6l and one 5.0 Coyote. Neither needed internal engine mods. As long as you don't get froggy with boost its very reliable and safe.
Don't piece a system together. Buy a complete system and you will end up with very few problems. The Roush kit is a weekend install for a first timer. The guys at Roush can knock it out in less than a day. The Roush kits are designed for Mustangs and F150's. You'll need to fab up intercooler mounts and plumbing. |
Guys, this isn't my first rodeo with modding cars so no need to talk at me like I'm 12 years old. There is no need to change compression ratio, heads, cam or forge the internals for the boost range I'm looking at (less than 10 lbs). I just found a guy in Denver with a supercharger on his Backdraft Coyote that is looking to go bigger soon, so I'll simply put his on mine.
@cycleguy55 perhaps you missed this in my OP, but doing that swap isn't the least bit cost effective. Like I said, I can achieve my goal for less than $4500. @bobcowan I live in the Springs too |
I gotta ask...what is your current exhaust setup?
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I'll be using a 11-14 engine,because I also want an automatic transmission. The older engines are not forged, so you have to be a little more careful with boost. But still a boat load of power for a small'ish investment. I figure my complete drive line will be <$15K.
I think the standard exhaust from most kit makers is kind of a limiting factor - especially with big displacement and naturally aspirated. FI will extend that limit a little bit, but it's still a limitation. You can build a 1,000 hp Coyote engine, but I think it would be difficult with a standard Cobra kit exhaust. |
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As Bob mentioned, we're at altitude and N/A engines suffer the most up here. The car is already calibrated, and the engine is running at its peak performance for its current mods. Most of y'all are 50+ years old and think back to the days where a 12 second car was fast. I'm used to daily driving 9 and 10 second cars, so this Cobra is certainly slow in comparison. |
I think you can continue to throw money at your engine and chase more power, but your exhaust is really restrictive if you are using stock side pipes. You might consider starting there.
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x96535,
You might want to look at how and where the two blower types make power. They are very different to drive and live with. Your fuel system will need to flow enough to meet that the crankshaft power demands + an additional 50-100hp that it takes to drive the blower at speed. So if your making 650 at the crank you should have enough fuel flow to support 750ish hp. I prefer to run big hard lines for both the feed and return as it is less restriction on the pump which helps it survive longer. In the old days we would also drop a couple of heat ranges on the plugs. Jason |
This one has been for sale for a little while. Don't know if you saw it before you purchased yours.
1965 Used Backdraft RT3B Black Label Cobra at The Garage Inc. Serving Miami, FL, IID 15330356 |
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I didn't realize Backdraft was building cars in 1965 - and so few miles in 51 years! :LOL: |
" I'm used to daily driving 9 and 10 second cars, so this Cobra is certainly slow in comparison."
96535, Are you saying your daily drivers are 9 and 10 second cars? What, 1/8th mile? With having rides as fast as you stated, I can't imagine why you are even bothering with a Cobra. There are a few of us geezers that can testify that getting one of these roller skates even into the 10s, in a 1/4 mile, and still be totally streetable, much less into the 9s is pretty much near impossible. |
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As for the exhaust being the first item to address as mentioned above, the guys at Vintage tried out a different style exhaust that supposedly has less restriction and ended up making less power. If anything the best flowing exhaust compared to the current exhaust on the car is MAYBE worth 20 RWHP with a tune. And I highly doubt it's even that much. A little restriction is good for the engine with the exception being in a turbo application. |
At 10 psi boost you will need roughly 2/3 more fuel. Make sure your fuel pump and lines can supply the fuel. It gets ugly if you suddenly go lean at full throttle high rpm.
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You need to replace the powdered metal rods Ford used in the n/a versions of the engine with a set of Manley's (or comparable) like they use in the Terminators and supercharged Coyotes.
Ed p.s. Other stuff you will minimally need to do; You also need to replace the n/a pistons and it has nothing to do with the c/r, although you ought to give special consideration to that also. A supercharged engine is hard on piston skirts and will collapse the skirts of an n/a piston very quickly. You need a very significant increase in skirt thickness if you want the piston skirts to survive in a supercharged engine. While you are at it you should also upgrade the wrist pins to tool steel pins with a wall thickness in the neighborhood of 0.180" or thicker and get rid of the moly rings. The first time you experience preignition / detonation you will knock the moly out of the OEM rings. The ring you need for the top land is a TotalSeal AP series (or equivalent) steel ring. |
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