Kirk! We're under attack!! Suspension help.

[RedHawk]

Originally Posted by rbgray1

RedHawk,

Whoa.....Whoa.... Whoa....!

Just for the sake of confirmation based on your troubles, I spent the evening tonight bolting up my raw front suspension to confirm before and after measurements of the OEM A-Arms and the Heidts A-Arms.

Here's what I found:

The lower side to side ball joint Joint dimensions with factory A-Arms is 47-7/16 from side to side with the arms just below level by about a quarter inch, enough to measure from grease fitting to grease fitting(I have photos).

With the Heidts lower Arms installed (keep in mind, I'm staying with lower strut rods from the Pinto Suspension), the side to side ball joint measurement is 46-5/8! Almost one inch narrower than factory OEM. Just for kicks, I bolted on upper OEM and Heidts upper A-Arms and they look OK for inclination angles for Caster and Camber, well within adjustable range (I have an inclination level that I can rough in positive or negative angles from the spindle and ball joint angles).

Problem is the shortened lower ball joint dimension and ALSO the fact that the lower Heidts tubular A-Arms interfere with the spring tower upright on the front of the car due to the "sweep" of the tubes not being as drastic as the factory curve. This would cause me to "bend" the angled shock tower steel slightly to provide for clearance of the new lower Heidt's tubular A-Arms through their travel. Both not good.

I'm going to be on the phone with Heidt's first thing tomorrow morning to determine if their A-Arms are intended to be geometrically the same as Mustang II parts or if they are engineered to work with their suspension components, period.

This test does not make me very happy as I didn't need this hassle. Oh well, it's been said that the build, or rebuild in my case both ways, is as much fun as driving it. At this point in time, I don't agree.

At least I didn't paint the parts yet....Ooops, sorry for that, it wasn't meant negative.

First of all big Thanks to you and everryone else with the advice. I am a commercial contractor by trade and build buildings. I feel like your speaking chineese when reffering to suspension though. I think I just opened up a can of worms, but followed your advise and I think I got it dialed in with no pull, a little toe in and straight. Atleast long enough to get through the weekend for an alignment scheduled Monday morning with another reputable classic car shop. Ugh!!

One thing I can happily say is the shocks and spring setup are simply incredible. No more nightmares at the dentist to replace disloged fillings. I can hit bumps, cracks, small woodland creatures, mariachi bands, barn swallows, neighborhood solictors, Kardashian family members whatever with no issues what so ever. WOW!

[rbgray1]

Redhawk,

You're welcome. It's good to share ideas and fixes when we both are doing very similar things to our cars. I know I'll like the final outcome as well, just want to confirm that some of these engineering changes in the parts are for the better and don't cause me headaches down the road. Hopefully I will have pictures in the next few days of all the new suspension, coilovers, and Wilwood brakes on the car. I figured out a great easy way to convert the rear to QA1 coilovers with some very simple and strong brackets I'm welding on the upper frame in the rear and changing the lower shock mount on the rear. I'll send pics when done.

BTW, if you hit a Kardashian.....make sure you put your car in reverse and do it at least 4 more times......then repeat!

[rbgray1]

Redhawk,

One more thing I forgot to mention.

Since you were less than satisfied with your previous shop's performance, I'm guessing they also installed your Wilwood systems?

I ran into something in very small print when I built up all my components for my rear drum to 12.19 rotor conversion from Wilwood. Apparently Ford used at least 10 different axle sizes for the 8.8 rears. The outermost portion of the axle has a raised area that the drum centers on to index in to eliminate runout. There are no fewer that 10 different sizes of these. Wilwood ships with the kits only one set of "rotor hat indexing bushings" with their kits (most common size, 2.83"). My axles are 2.52 indexing hubs and I had to special order these from Wilwood (kinda crappy since they cost $15 each plus shipping).

Reason for my comment is you may want to double check these from your buildup since you were less than satisfied with your previous shop. With the wrong ones installed, the rear rotor hats will have excessive runout during braking as the only thing centering the rotor would be your lug nuts and wheel.

Easy to check. Remove the rear wheel and look at the center of the rotor hat where it meets the axle. You should see a small aluminum "rotor indexing bushing" that centers the rotor hats on the axles. Based on numerous axles used by Ford, odds are not in your favor that the correct ones came with the kit.

Take a close look at the Wilwood instructions. Better to be safe than sorry, especially when it comes to brakes.