Street to race conversion-Newbie

[solly]

I recently bought a Superformance Brock coupe, and am awaiting delivery. It was set up as a weekend cruiser by the builder, and has 17 miles on it. It's got all the right mechanicals (351W stroked to 427, 515 hp, T-56 tranny, adjustable coilovers, PBR performance brakes, etc.)

However, I want to convert it to race mode- changing all glass except windshield to Lexan, adding roll cage and harnesses, fire system, etc. (see pic, Daytona racer)

Does anyone know of a reputable shop in the NY-NJ-CT area who can do the work? Does the factory sell these parts?

Thanks for the help.

[Coupecrazy]

Has it arrived yet????

[solly]

It's here, and at my race shop getting new race seats, harnesses, Accusump, slicks, and trying to shed a few pounds.

Track days next week at Watkins Glen. Can't wait!

[RACER X #99]

What shop did you use and which club are you running with at WGI.

We need more Cobras to run with us at Apex.

http://www.apexperformancedriving.com/2005%20Events.htm

[John McMahon]

solly,

Not sure which outfit you're running with, but if you can make the Apex event on 8/3 & 8/4, Club Cranky will be there and can show you the line.

Apex is a very well run driving school with excellent instruction and more track time than most other driving schools.

[solly]

I belong to the following:

FCA (they let me bring non-Ferraris as I have run a 360 Challenge for 3 years and still have some of the street cars).
PDA
Trackmasters-this is the event at the Glen next week. Most track time around (4-5 hours a day) once you get certified for Open Track.

Would love to join other Cobra owners, but unfortunately I'll be away August 3-4. When and where is the next event?

I usually run at Lime Rock, Pocono, the Glen, Sumit Point in the summer, and Sebring/Moroso in the winter. I think I'll join Apex. Thanks. Hope to meet you guys.

[solly]

The guy who has been maintaining my race cars is Mike Agnifullo at Stonebridge Classics in Bethel, CT. Great guy, races himself, knows everything.

Anyone know about replacement rotors for the pin drive system on Superfromance wheels (18"). Looks like any aftermarket Corvette C5 replacement should fit, but I'm not sure about the spacing. Hubs and rotors are all C5 based. I want to put in slotted floating rotors and decrease some unsprung weight.

What pads are you guys using for track? I just installed EBC Red Stuff (street/track), but if it's not enough I'll go to Yellow Stuff, but the Yellow is not a great street pad.

[RACER X #99]

Solly,
This is the only Apex event at WGI this year. I will be with Phoenix CMR, August 22.23 also at WGI. And of course the 3 day PDA event in October.
I'm running Performance Friction 01 pads on my 6 piston Wilwood Superlights.
RD

[solly]

How do I join Phoenix CMR? Love to do the glen in August.

I'll be at PDA in October.

[RACER X #99]

Link to August event,

http://www.smcrinc.org/glen_event_frame.htm

[DealsGapCobra]

If that thing ran the One Lap...17 miles may be a low estimate :-)

Rob

[TIGER 6]

Solly,
I'm curious about the photo of your Coupe.It looks identical to a FFR Coupe which ran in this year's One Lap of America.My son and I did the OLA this year and there were only 2 Coupes in the event-Olthoff's red one and one FFR.If your Coupe did the OLA,it will have a minimum of 3400 miles on it.

[solly]

Tiger, you are correct. That pic is of Dennis Olthoff's car, which i am trying to emulate. Lexan windows, stiffer springs, etc.

My car has been in the shop for a week getting fitted with an Accusump, race seat, harnesses, fire system etc. The one thing i can't find are 2 piece slotted rotors that will fit.

Click on my profile for a pic of my car.

[TIGER 6]

Solly,
Wish you luck with your project.I have tracked my SPF Coupe #19 at 5 different track weekends-Summit Point,VIR,Carolina Motorsports Park.While getting the car ready for this year's One Lap of America at VIR,I blew a rod through the oil pan.The engine is being rebuilt by Roush now,including an Accusump.Better late than never.If you are interested,I'll send along the new engine specs when I receive them.The original motor was a 401 Windsor with a Dart block.
A couple of thoughts.I would try the "stock" rotors and see what you think.The braking with these is excellent.
The biggest problems with the Coupe are a real loose rear end and power application coming out of turns. The car does NOT trail brake,and it has taken some time for me to learn what the car is telling me through my butt!It is a real handful on a track,but loads of fun.
Best of luck,and maybe we'll see you at Summit or VIR.

[solly]

Thanks Tiger.

Bummer about the rod! you'd think they would at least put some good baffling in the oil pan. This WAS a famous race car.

I figured that without a dry sump the Accusump was #1 priority. I got the elctric (ECP) high pressure valve (35-40 psi) hooked right into the ignition. Pretty idiot-proof. I'm running the stock rotors, but with street/track pads (EBC Red Stuff). Also put in Kirkey lightweight road race seats (they are terrific and not expensive, and save 20 lbs.), Sparco harnesses and a fire system. And I maxed out the castor and camber settings.

I understand from Dennis Olthoff that the springs are a bit soft for track, but if the rear is that loose you may want to go to a smaller rear sway bar, or a bigger front one. What tire pressures were you running front and rear? Does it come around predictably where you can catch it, or does it just go into a spin? I just sold the worst oversteering nightmare of a race car ever made (Ferrari 360 Challenge), so i'm real used to loose rears. I'm not real big on trailbraking anyway, having been taught by Skip Barber, but I can do it when I need to-turn 1 at Lime Rock, last turn before front straight at Sebring.

My biggest problem is my oil and water temp gauges. They are totally off. They show 280-290 degrees when we measure 180-190 degrees at the coolant, oil lines and radiator. Pressure is fine. Don't know if it's the senders or the gauges. Also, the overflow tank loves to vent itself of a few pints of coolant if I let it sit running for too long. I guess i'll get some baselines tomorrow then back to the shop.

The Roush motors are supposed to be excellent units (despite his failure at IRL). Are you going with the 402 or the 427? I'm very familiar with both.

I'll probably be at Summit Point in the early fall. hope to meet you. Good luck with the rebuild!

Steven

[TIGER 6]

Solly,
We have tried several combos of sway bars-didn't seem to help.I have had a BIG red light installed on my dash which will illuminate should the oil pressure reach a certain level.Just a little insurance in case the Accusump fails or some other problem arises.
One problem I had some time ago.While I was running at G&W's Fall Fling at VIR last year,several corner workers noticed I was dumping something out of the rear of my car when I was going through corners.There was a black "sludgey" coating under the rear where the exhaust pipes exit.Turned out that my fuel was sloshing out the rear.We replaced the stck exhaust gas cap with a ventilated one and that cured the problem.
I'm sure you know that the Roush engines in the Coupe do not have a rev limiter,which I found to be incredible.I have set mine to 6200 rpm.
The oversteering seems to just happen.I am running Pirelli P Zero tires as I also drive the car a lot on the street-9000 plus miles.No "tire warning." I have,however,noticed that there is a light "twitch" from the rear before it cuts loose-feel this through the seat.The car WILL rotate,which is helpful.
I have not tried any adjustments to the caster or camber settings,which should help your car.
I installed a Steeda close ratio shifter which shortened the throws and helped what I thought was a problem going from 3rd to 4th and not pulling it into 2nd.Probaly more my tecnique than anything else.
The "new" engine will be a 427 with the Dart block.I am told that the Nascar guys at Roush changed just about everything in the internals with the exception of the Holly 750 carb.It will not be quite as streetable as before but will be more reliable on the track.I don't have any dyno numbers yet,but Dennis said it will be a stronger engine.The "old" engine dynoed at 423 hp at the rear wheels.
I enjoyed your comment on the Challenge car.We have a Ferrari Club Track Weekend coming up in several days at Summit on the new circuit,and I will take our new 360 Spider up for some fun.I have not tracked this yet,and it will be interesting to see how it does on this track.We ran the new track on this year's One Lap of America in my son's C6 'Vette,and it is a difficult one.Not a track suited to high horse power cars,limited run off areas,lots of walls,off camber corners etc.Did you run in the Ferrari Challenge series?
I would appreciate any thoughts you have on the 427.Thanks.
Steve

[solly]

OK, first of all let's talk about the Ferrari. I ran my 360 spider on the track before I bought a Challenge car, and it's a blast. The street car is actually MUCH safer than the race car, because street tires will give you plenty of warning before breaking loose. Slicks don't. The 360 Challenge is definitely not for novices, it's a real handful with a steep and scary learning curve (I'm not implying that you are a novice), but you'll really enjoy the spider. Just remember: YOU HAVE NO ROLL CAGE, and crazy things happen, so start out easy. I no longer track the spider because I got tired of repainting the front end, even with 3M Stoneguard. Now I use it just for cruising. It has the best brakes of any production car I have ever driven. But pump your tires up 4 lbs. over factory settings and listen to them. When the squeal becomes a howl you are at the limit. I have even tracked my Dino, and while it's a bit underpowered, it's a blast to drive on a track.

I just got back from Watkins Glen, my first outing with the SPF Daytona coupe. I had a blast, even with street tires. The torque on a 427 is incredible. Doesn't Roush use an MSD ignition? If so, just plug in a 6000 RPM Soft-touch limiter. I knew about the oversteer problems, so I ran 36 psi front and rear cold (40 hot), and did not have any oversteering problems. If your car is constantly oversteering, raise the front tire pressure and lower the rear. I happen to think that the factory recommended psi settings are way too low for any kind of performance tire. Try slowly increasing pressure in fronts and rears over a few days, KEEPING FRONT AND REAR PRESSURES THE SAME!!, and see what happens. You might be very happy at 32-36 cold. This alone can cure most of your oversteer. The reason you are not hearing anything from your tires before breakaway is that they are not "working" at 24-26 psi, or even 29 psi. Those pressures are fine for street driving, but that's about it.

The power steering pump insisted on boiling over every 10 minutes, filling the car with fumes, and spraying ps fluid all over the engine compartment. Since it's flammable, and sits about 2 inches from the headers this is a bad thing. It got so hot that the plastic cap on the reservoir just kind of turned into taffy, so we clamped it back on with a hose clamp, and it ran great for an hour, until the pump failed totally in the middle of turn 9 and locked up the steering. A very interesting moment in my racing history.

Removing the cap revealed a melted dipstick twirled into a spiral shape by the fluid motion. Plus a lot of pieces of plastic floating around in the fluid. The plastic got into the pump, and most likely into the rack as well.

So I call Dennis Olthoff who immediately tells me that the pulley design is faulty, and is spinning the pump so fast that it's boiling over and melting everything. Wish I knew that beforehand. Anyway, he is sending me a special kit with an underdriven pulley that will cure the problem and reduce the steering ratio at the same time (the ratio is WAY too light for any feedback). I'm also adding a billet pump and reservoir. You'd think some engineer would have done his homework on pulley ratios back at the factory.

He also told me to shave the rear roll bar to 7/8" to cure the oversteer, which I'll do, even though I can cure it with tire pressures and some throttle steer. I also ordered a set of front splitters from him. The nose does like to lift over 120.

Alignment setup is crucial. Use the new front upper control arms and get max castor, camber, and toe-it really helps. You can also lower the ride height a bit.

The other thing that really sucks are the temp. gauges. My oil temp read a constant 300 degrees, yet I am still here, and the water pump read 190 on the track, but 270 within 2 minutes after pitting. My pyrometer showed both oil and water at 180-190 into the radiator, and 160-170 back to the engine. So I ordered new gauges and senders. Might go to a Stack dash. I believe the speedo is also off, because I was playing tag with a buddy, and he clocked 155-160 down the back straight with me right behind him, but my speedo never went over 125. The brakes are also nothing to write home about, but then again I'm used to Ferrari race brakes. I'm going to go to EBC Yellowstuff front and rear, flush the system with Motul or ATE, and get some cryo treated slotted rotors made up. If that doesn't do it, it's off to Wilwood or Brembo. The stock PBR brakes are decent, but I don't love sliding calipers in the first place.

In general a lot of fun, VERY unique-I had crowds around me all the time and everyone loved the car. Extremely rigid chassis, monstrous torque all the way through the power band which I think you will either love or hate depending on your driving style,(actually scary sometimes if you get on it a bit early out of a turn), and a bulletprof engine (with the Accusump). Could be a real contender once the steering and brake issues are worked out, and I fit some slicks to it and get some decent gauges. Make sure Roush doesn't make the same mistake with the ps pump. They build excellent engines, but very few of us are tracking these cars, so no builder is getting much high speed feedback.

Now I just need an SCCA class to run it in.

Be careful and enjoy yourself.

[solly]

Tiger-

Get the 3 quart Accusump with the electric ECP valve. There are 3 ECP valves, each set at different PSI. I got the 35-40 which will discharge whenever engine oil pressure drops below 40. Worked like a charm. I wired it into the ignition so I can never forget to turn it on. As soon as you turn the key on the system will pre-oil before you start the motor.

If you play with tire pressures and shave the rear bar and still have oversteer I'd start looking at your suspension settings.