Current FFR Bilstein Shock Issue!

[jhv48]

Originally Posted by GTA

I just got off the phone with FFR. Lucky me, I have the shocks that are on the list. I was told that Dave is having a meeting with Bilstein today. I was also informed that FFR did not spec the shocks. I was told that FFR gave them a car and told them to design a shock to fit it. After the shock was made , FFR questioned Bilstein as to whether the shaft was large enough.Bilstein said it was .That does'nt let FFR off the hook with me, they sold me this crap, but if someone were to lawyer up,Bilstein has does have a dog in this fight. All's it's going to take is one person to get hurt or killed and the $#!t will fly, and a bunch will fly Biltein's way as well.Roger

This is new info. Who is your source?

[GTA]

I don't know the guys name . I did'nt ask him for his name, and he did'nt offer it. I called and ask for someone who could help me with the shock problem and the guy that answered the phone said he could help. He infromed me that FFR adviced me not to drive my car at this time. He said that he thought that Dave was having a meeting with Bilstein today. I ask him directly who spec'ed the shocks.He told me that FFR did not spec the shocks. He said he was pretty sure that FFR gave them a car for them to design the shock to fit. He also said that FFR questined the size of the shaft . You guys can call and ask the same as I did.I wished I had thought of asking the guy for his name. Roger

[Tugboat]

Being a business owner and not having a dog in this fight I was just enjoying reading this thread and all the post and I had a thought. What is the amount of cost in this matter being discussed! How many of these shocks were sold and what would it cost either of the companies involved to resolve. Thousands, Hundreds of thousands or maybe millions? I am curious what this amount of bad Publicity could have been saved by just trying to resolve this problem more quickly. How many potential customers read this forum (my thoughts are alot) and make decisions based on others experiences. I know that you have to read between the lines on this entire issue, BUT!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Just a curious observer, Any guesses out there?

Larry

[Maricopa]

Easily in the hundred of thousands. I know Dave mentioned 'quarantining' 60K worth of B-Steins recently. That was just stock on hand, not counting the 3 years worth of cars wearing them.

Edit: Latest news posted at FFCobra

To all FFR Customers

If you are driving a FFR chassis kit that uses Bilstein shock absorber part number: F4BE3 A273-T0, F4BE3 A273-T1 or F4BE3 A273-T0 SR, we recommend that you stop driving your car immediately. This recommendation is based on the fact that fifty of these shock absorbers have broken with one having broken as recently as this past weekend. The shocks have broken primarily at the shaft and the cause for such breaks appear to be varied. The above shock absorber part numbers are stamped on the shock body and these shocks were used on the front suspension and the rear independent suspension in kits sold from approximately 2003 to August 1, 2008. If you do not know how to determine if your car is affected, please call us at 508-291-3443 and ask for technical support.

Factory Five has attempted in good faith to negotiate a resolution to this shock issue with Bilstein. Indeed, our engineers have been in constant contact with Bilstein for two years, and I have been communicating with Bilstein’s President, Doug Robertson for the past two months.

Unfortunately, despite Factory Five’s best-efforts to work on a resolution with Bilstein, Bilstein has refused to accept responsibility or to undertake any kind of action to replace the affected parts. Factory Five has gone so far as to provide Bilstein with customer’s broken Bilstein shocks for diagnosis and testing. However, Bilstein has been mostly silent as to its findings. Rather, Bilstein has blamed every single possible factor for breakage (the shock coil-over kits, washers and zip ties, customer assembly procedure, customer abuse, improper springs, etc.) on someone or something other than its own product. Regardless of whether the product is defective or not (this is a point of contention with Bilstein) what is NOT in doubt is the fact that they have broken and that Bilstein has the ability to make and provide stronger parts... parts that their own engineers have admitted will not break when subjected to the same conditions that seem to have caused breakage in the current parts.

Bilstein now has our samples of broken shocks and reports and data from our customers. Further, we are aware customers have spoken to Bilstein and its team directly about these broken parts at trade shows. Notwithstanding the patently obvious, Bilstein has gone silent and will not return correspondence from Factory Five. This is particularly frustrating inasmuch as Bilstein’s President has represented to Factory Five that he would imminently arrange to meet with Factory Five in Wareham to attempt to work through these issues. Two weeks have elapsed and still no word as to when this purportedly will occur.

We at Factory Five are concerned for your safety. While we cannot speak as to Bilstein’s concern, or lack thereof, we are at least cautiously optimistic that their sense of moral obligation and mutual concern for your safety will lead them to help us and our customers.

Please know that Factory Five is exploring potential means by which we can provide you with a replacement shock absorber that will be more resistant to such breakage. Frankly, the cost of doing so, without the assistance of Bilstein, is such that it could threaten the very existence of our company. As matters currently stand, Bilstein has already engineered a stronger version of the exact same shock. This was our request of them more than two years ago and we were told it was not possible. Imagine our consternation when their engineer informed us that they could easily make these shocks stronger after we were told by other Bilstein representatives in the past that this could not be done. This new shock was made for us some weeks ago and our engineers concurred with theirs that this would have been (and is now) the right part for the job. This new shock has a thicker 14mm shaft (in lieu of the current 11mm shaft) and improved bearings. This new design was determined by Bilstein's engineers to be significantly stronger and better suited for the foreseeable uses in the Factory Five kits assembled by both novice and more sophisticated customers. We are actively seeking these replacement shocks to provide to all customers who have the above referenced part numbers.

Therefore, at least for right now, we strongly recommend that you do not drive your Factory Five car containing the above-referenced Bilstein shocks. We will continue all efforts to obtain and provide replacement product with or through Bilstein and will keep you fully apprised of any developments as soon as they occur.

[convincor]

It was said in one of Daves post that if he where to do what most wanted, which was to replace them with Koni's cost would be around $1.4 mil.

[jhv48]

Bilstein has officially "lawyered up"!

[jmimac351]

It may be that Dave's biggest mistake was to place too much faith in what Bilstein was telling him about these breakages - re: "we can't make them stronger... the shocks are up to spec", etc - and instead go with what his gut probably told him about these parts a while ago.

Here is the post where Dave mentions the cost of swapping everyone to Konis. It's only $1.3 million.

http://www.ffcobra.com/forums/showthread.php?t=193060

[ICBomber90]

Originally Posted by convincor

It was said in one of Daves post that if he where to do what most wanted, which was to replace them with Koni's cost would be around $1.4 mil.

Less if Bilstein coughed up their part on good faith.....