Aftermarket Aluminum FE Blocks

[ERA Chas]

Myth busted...

[undy]

Originally Posted by ERA Chas

Myth busted...

Nope, now we need to run it with no oil and a 500hp shot of Nauzzzzzzz. We'll get that puppy to fail.

[ERA Chas]

Originally Posted by undy

Nope, now we need to run it with no oil and a 500hp shot of Nauzzzzzzz. We'll get that puppy to fail.

Yup-those asses have to blow up EVERYTHING in the end-busted or not.

[RICK LAKE]

Rodknock Some one on the SCCA forum is either getting jerked around or just doesn't know anything about motors. LS motors from GM, we are told they should last a min of 200,000 miles, this is gas. Duramax is a 300-500K milage motor with the correct maintainance being done.
I have 12 years of racing of SCX#58. It is on the 2nd build. I went from a 452 motor to 482 stroker. The leak down was 5% on 7 cylinders and 7-8% on cylinder that has a scratch in it before honing. This cylinder is back to 5%. This is a race motor built for endurance and torque, not 700HP. Max rpm is 6,500. I see no problems with cylinder or core shift in this block.
I don't quite understand the over maintainance by Jack? Oil and filter get changed every 3rd race. The car gets autocross, roadracing and some 1/4 mile. It gets ABUSED HARD. I have a 12 quart oiling system in the car 8 in the oil pan, 1 in the lines and cooler and 3 in the accusump for preoiling and high "G" turns to maintain good oil pressure. HVHP oil pump with 100 psi spring. Racing pressures are 70-80 psi. This motor needs and like alot of oil flowing. 15W-40 11 quarts, 1 bottle of EOS and Lucas oil suppliment.
Demending on the Al;uminum block you are talking about, (5) different ones I have heard of over the years. Shelby is the strongest for design and strength. Every thing is tighted into the main cap area. HP rating on this block is over 2,200 hp. the others are in the 1,300-1,500. This is more than enough for most people and cars. Shelby block also cost 1K more that the others.
Does a aluminum motor need to be rebuilt in 8-10K miles,,,,,,,,,,,maybe if heavy abused and overheated a couple of times. No oil changes. A leak down check is the easiest way to check a motor for how good the compression and valves are. I would say no to this question. Motors live and breath more so in Alumium than iron. Rick L

[Woodz428]

I understand the reasoning for the question and think the comparisons to the Mod motor or Late model Chebby stock engines are irrelevant to that. I think both of those engines underwent substantial high mileage testing, because the mfg's have to warranty their stuff. Something that is probably unlikely with any aftermarket Aluminum block, most I've seen only warranty against mfg. defects. If for no other reason than the number of variables involved. Once you assemble it and add your parts, they are pretty much in the clear, it could be attributed to any number of things other than just the block. I could expound on the amount of miles some of the bike engines that I serviced over the years achieved, but that is hardly applicable. I feel the same way about the comparison to new factory engines.
I'm a big FE fan, but have avoided any aluminum block because of shortage of longterm info. For me, the little extra weight isn't as much of a concern.

[4pipes]

My block has 12,000 miles on it. It's been rebuilt for reasons not attributable to the block. The only issue I know of with the Shelby block is liner movement. According to my builder, they can move axially with temperature cycling. My block was never decked until now and some liners were up or down by about .003 preventing a flat sealing surface for the heads. Common practice is to attach steel torque plates to new blocks for a couple of days to stabilize the liners, then decking them.

[RodKnock]

So, there's no one out there with a real life FE aluminum block that has traveled 8,000-10,000 miles. It may take me 5 years before I can rack up that kind of mileage. Now I hope to break that mileage barrier as quickly as possible.

[FUNFER2]

Like with boat engines built with different metals, should we use a sacrificial anode ? (maybe in the radiator)

[rodneym]

C'mon, RodKnock. Let's get some clarity here.
SAAC forum...dogs aluminum...pugnacious post...
He probably takes iron supplements so his blood can rust.

[maurice19]

Rod,

M Shelby block has over 13,000 miles on it and still runs great but , I had the same problem that Dave just mentioned at 2500 miles

Maurice

[RodKnock]

Originally Posted by maurice19

Rod,

M Shelby block has over 13,000 miles on it and still runs great but , I had the same problem that Dave just mentioned at 2500 miles

Maurice

Well, then, maybe the guy over at the SAAC Forum is right. 8,000-10,000 is about it? Machining with any block is important, but even more critical with an aluminum block it sounds.

It would be great if Keith Craft could chime in and hear his longevity (or lack thereof) stories with the CSX, Genesis and Pond aluminum blocks.

[Stentor]

Originally Posted by RodKnock

It would be great if Keith Craft could chime in and hear his longevity (or lack thereof) stories with the CSX, Genesis and Pond aluminum blocks.

And what would he have to gain by doing that? If he posts anything on this I doubt it will be negative.

He sells a lot of aluminum FE engines and I suspect he would prefer to keep it that way.

[601HP]

Originally Posted by Stentor

And what would he have to gain by doing that? If he posts anything on this I doubt it will be negative.

He sells a lot of aluminum FE engines and I suspect he would prefer to keep it that way.

Let's see which way he goes with a response.

I've spoken with him a couple of times and made a few purchases from him. He seemed to be "up front" with his information.

David

[RodKnock]

Originally Posted by Stentor

And what would he have to gain by doing that? If he posts anything on this I doubt it will be negative.

He sells a lot of aluminum FE engines and I suspect he would prefer to keep it that way.

Well, I thought since he sponsors this FE Forum, he may or may not respond. I think he builds about 80-ish FE's per year, so there must be a few that have exceeded 8,000-10,000 mileage.

[ERA Chas]

Originally Posted by RodKnock

Well, I thought since he sponsors this FE Forum, he may or may not respond. I think he builds about 80-ish FE's per year, so there must be a few that have exceeded 8,000-10,000 mileage.

Rod,
Have you spoken to Tom about his engines in service?

[patrickt]

Originally Posted by RodKnock

... so there must be a few that have exceeded 8,000-10,000 mileage.

Miles would probably be misleading. If there's anything to it at all, it would probably be "heat cycle" related. Meaning, if I'm going on a nice leisurely "country cruise" with my all aluminum FE, there's likely no more additional wear to the engine from driving 500 miles than there is for only driving 100.

[maurice19]

I should have been more specific when I said I had a problem.

My liners checked out ok and the only problem was the intake gasket leak on # 5, I believe ,and that was early on.

Maurice

[eschaider]

I heard aluminum blocks begin to become radioactive at 1500 miles unless you are running 91 octane then they start to become radioactive at 786 miles. By the time they have 3500 miles on them the whole car is radioactive - which in a way is an advantage because they are easy to find at night in the parking lot if you forget where you parked. You just look for the soft blue glow and presto!

The Yucca Mountain complex has a special parking lot for Cobra's with aluminum blocks, so safe storage is always available.

There is also some concern about the aluminum attracting interdimensional and transdimensional beings from an alternate universe, which of course is always problematic.

Well that's about all I heard. Time for another adult beverage ...


Ed

p.s. That other joker that's been pissing on your block probably had too many adult beverages (hic) you shouldn't let him near your car that stuff is corrosive!

[RodKnock]

Here's a dumb somewhat related question. Won't the bronze distributor gear for roller cams wear out and potentially ruin any block, if not checked? Not that replacing a bronze distributor gear is surgery for an aluminum FE, but it would seem that a failure could ultimately reduce the chance of a "high mileage" aluminum FE.

[patrickt]

Originally Posted by RodKnock

Here's a dumb somewhat related question. Won't the bronze distributor gear for roller cams wear out and potentially ruin any block, if not checked? Not that replacing a bronze distributor gear is surgery for an aluminum FE, but it would seem that a failure could ultimately reduce the chance of a "high mileage" aluminum FE.

Bronze gears are "self-sacrificing" with your roller cam. They need to be changed out every so often, but that's not a big deal. I'm pretty sure most of the builders switched over to the Poly-Composite Gears years ago, which last much longer. If you have a PC gear in your FE, it will probably last the life of your car while you are driving it. Now, that's not true for Rick Lake, but I think it would be for you. But marking and pulling the distributor and eyeballing the gear next to a brand new one that you have in your hand is not a difficult job. It's just one bolt, and less than a half-hour total. If you do have to actually replace the gear have your machine shop do it for you. As I recall, you have the MSD billet distributor and I'm pretty sure that MSD puts an extra-fat pin in there as well. If I'm wrong on that, I'm sure I'll get corrected....

EDIT -- And "No," a stripped gear, or broken pin, doesn't usually result in the engine getting ruined. The engine stops and your natural instinct is to throw in the clutch and coast over. There is usually no damage.