Longevity & Reliability vs. Power

[patrickt]

Originally Posted by zrayr

so the consensus is, consistently hitting a 6000 rpm redline in a 427 FE will put cross country reliability at risk.

Z.

I think that's what broke my balancer earlier this year, but ERAChas says it was a POS balancer anyway. I think you can bang 6000 quite a bit with a well built FE and still get across country. BUT, before you set sail for the coast, you have to have had at least one full driving season with absolutely nothing breaking down on it. So far, I haven't passed that simple test.

[zrayr]

I guess I've been taking my Hi-Po 289 reliability for granted. Nine years & 43,000 miles since the engine was overhauled, and I really have been enjoying it (6500 redline). The longest trip I've taken was 1550 miles roundtrip, 12 hours each way, no Interstates, 2 lane roads only.

Z.

[blykins]

The short answer is, yes.....you can.

[392cobra]

Originally Posted by zrayr

so the consensus is, consistently hitting a 6000 rpm redline in a 427 FE will put cross country reliability at risk.

Z.

Well....hell yeah it will put a 427 FE's reliability at risk.

Consistently hitting redline with ANY engine is going to put it's reliability at risk.

[Z-linkCobra]

Originally Posted by patrickt

I think that's what broke my balancer earlier this year, but ERAChas says it was a POS balancer anyway. I think you can bang 6000 quite a bit with a well built FE and still get across country. BUT, before you set sail for the coast, you have to have had at least one full driving season with absolutely nothing breaking down on it. So far, I haven't passed that simple test.

How long is your driving season Patrick? Our driving season down here is year round with the exception of a few days a year.

Last night was in the 40's right now outside its probably mid to high 70's.

[patrickt]

I don't drive her after Thanksiving, nor before Easter.

[ERA Chas]

Originally Posted by zrayr

...
all I want(ed) to know is can I have a 427 FE motor (stock displacement) that can reliably hit the red line as often I choose and still have enough reliability to drive across the country w/o undue worry. Or do I need to limit my fun to low & midrange torque-type excitement?
Z.

I thought I answered that in post #59. Your question mimics my combination and usage exactly. I'm the only guy here that answered you with actual experience and component facts-not hypothetical BS.
Not to the point enough for you??

[zrayr]

Originally Posted by ERA Chas

Z,
I really like your car. And I offer my own experience to help you decide the answer to your question. But after that I have to address the rampant nonsense which has jacked your thread. Forgive me-"I can't stands n'more" as Popeye used to say.

I've pushed 550 HP at 427 inches around the streets and track-for a long time. Since '03 when I installed Shelby heads, it's run 11's at the track, had 4 valve adjustments (.600"+ SFT cam) and no broken parts. Goes to 6800 when I feel like it and I've had to change a clutch disc in '09. Since the previous disc in '95. Considering the performance, I'd say that it's reliable. You decide.
....................."

thanks for reminding me. Yes, your answer is to the point, and well taken. I was hoping to hear this side of the discussion. thanks for taking the time ......

Z.

[blykins]

Are you looking for components and advice or a complete engine?

[zrayr]

I am gathering information for my next project. A 427 powered '63 Galaxie. I will be wanting to have an engine built.

Z.

[blykins]

For a heavier car like that, you would generally want to keep the torque curve a little broader and the horsepower curve shifted a little lower. But the answer to your question is yes, you can have a reliable FE and still hit the peaks whenever you want.

The FE market has really went nuts in the past 5-6 years and the aftermarket has lots of great parts available now.

Are you planning to use an existing 427 block, or will you be going aftermarket? Some of the older blocks will handicap you in your choice of camshafts.

Feel free to pick my brain. I'm a Ford engine builder and have FE experience.

[Barry_R]

A 6000 RPM FE that will live a very long time and deliver 500 HP is pretty much "boilerplate" these days. A basic 390/445 stroker with a decent set of heads and a solid or hydraulic roller cam will do this with ease.

I've built and dyno'd a lot of these 390 based combinations - probably dozens this year that meet your goals. And many, many others that are 427 or 428 based where the reliability is the same but the power level is comensurately higher. As the cubes go up the strain on parts at any given power level goes down as a function of RPM.

Reliability comes from a conservative approach to cam and compression. When you do that, the power peak drops into a safe RPM range and other valvetrain and bottom end related issues take care of themselves. Assembly is one of those things where the true benefit lies more in the process than in the absolute numbers. Checking every bearing is more important than the variance between .0024 or .0028. Same holds true for every other item in the engine.


Everybody has a different definition of streetworthy. Some customers want to go down the freeway at 1800RPM, cold start like their new BMW, and idle smoothly at 600 in gear. Others are not happy unless every car alarm withing a mile goes off when they fire up, really enjoy a 1200 RPM idle that sounds like a Top Fuel car, and will shift at 8500 while going to Wal-Mart for a gallon of milk...

[zrayr]

Originally Posted by blykins

"................. Are you planning to use an existing 427 block, or will you be going aftermarket? Some of the older blocks will handicap you in your choice of camshafts.

Feel free to pick my brain. I'm a Ford engine builder and have FE experience.

thanks for the offer. My initial thoughts are to go with vintage block & heads w/ a mechanical flat tappet cam. I'm really not looking for a monster HP engine. Just want strong enough internals so I can accelerate fully thru the gears when I feel like it.

Even 450 HP would probably be plenty.

Z.

[blykins]

Getting 450hp out of that combination shouldn't be a problem. Unless you're set on exactly 427 cubes, you can also throw a 428 crankshaft in that block for a "factory stroker" combination of around 454 cubic inches. You would also have your choice of the aftermarket crankshafts that are available, which would provide you with closer to 500 cubic inches.

[Excaliber]

Flat tappet, original 427 side oiler block, original high rise iron heads, OEM alloy dual four intake, 6,500 rev limit (which the motor OFTEN see's), 428 crankshaft for the torque monster in me. Reliable as the sun coming up and going down. I've beat this motor hard, it don't care. I'd take it across country without a second thought, run it hard at some event, and drive it home.

[vector1]

barry r has some good advice as always, bring up some of his posts and there is a lot to learn.

[Keithc8]

You have to decide what budget you want to spend on the engine. Then you will have to decide on the parts to use that will fit your budget. It is no problem with todays parts and tech to do a 600 HP engine that will run up to 6000 rpms and do fine for a long time.
Again it comes down to what you want to do with the engine and what you want to spend. You get with the right person and design the engine for your application. You can do it with a 390 block and one of the stroker cranks and get the power you want with no problem. If you want an original 427 block that is where the hunt and finding a good one makes it a little harder and will cost you more money. There are new 427 block options but that will add about 3500.00 or so to the cost over a 390 block.
Doing an FE engine to do what you want is no problem. Just get what you want and you will be happy in the end.

Good luck, Keith Craft

[RICK LAKE]

zrayr You have a P-M in your mail box.

[Jeff Frigo]

Originally Posted by Hotfingrs

So Donohue didn't really need 1400 horse in his 917-30 ??

Thank You.

[Bruce M]

I built my Contemporary in 1982 and had a Jack Merkel prepared LS-6 454 525HP Chevy with 9.5 pistons and repowered with 502 Crate motor 675HP and both run on 93 octane pump gas. I just replaced a set of Hoosier's, Centerforce Dual Friction Clutch and a Clutch Slave Cylinder in the past 15 years. I guess the car is pretty dependible but it also depends on the way you drive it. Bruce M