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Engine builders
I own a superformance mkiii cobra replica,which i purchased used about a year & a half ago.it has a small block 427 in it,(a 351 windsor stroker motor).i want to eventually swap out the motor for an aluminum fe big block and i want to find the best person to build it for me.i've narrowed it down to two choices:keith craft or robert pond and i'm leaning towards keith craft,(just because i've heard a lot more about him).any advice and/or suggestions from anybody out there? I'd also be interested in anybody's opinion about a shelby aluminum block vs.a robert pond block.i'd also like to compare edelbrock stage ii heads vs robert pond stage ii heads.
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I went with Keith Craft as he did a small block 427 stroker for me in the past that was awesome and many engines for friends of mine her in Texas.
My new Cobra I just finished has a Keith Craft 496 FE with a Pond Aluminum block with Edelbrock Aluminum Heads - Stage III by Keith. Solid Roller Cam, T&D shaft mounted rockers, steel crank and rods, Quickfuel 850 carb and lots of other cool stuff. Chassis dyno was 681 HP. I bought the motor totally setup, alternator, pulleys etc, flywheel, clutch/pressure plate and TKO600 trans from Keith. He set it all up including dialing in the clutch/bellhousing/trans alignment. I would not spend the extra money for a Shelby block as the Pond block is great and you could use those funds for additional items on the motor.....Keith has built a ton of these aluminum FEs and can work with you on what combination you want. Additional pics of the motor and Cobra in my gallery... http://www.clubcobra.com/photopost/d...m/SDC10485.JPG |
Keith built my Pond 482 and the workmanship's great.
Just to mention a few other top-o-the-line FE builders worth considering... Brent Lykins (Blykins), his customer service and "board assists" are second to none. The man exudes integrity. Not that it's a plus, but he even befriended Patrickt... (for a cam)%/ BarryR (Survival Motorsports) Arguably the most "published" FE engine builder around and an Engine Masters Challenge "FE" entrant winner. He eats, drinks and sleeps FE... He's been known to change a diaper and lap some valves at the same time!:LOL: T'wer me, in this economic climate, I'd set my sights on what I wanted then put it out to quote among the reputable few... |
Thanks for that info guys! Here's another question,(maybe a stupid one): Can you take a robert pond block out to 526 or 527 c.i. (like you can a shelby block)?
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Blykins knows his stuff, and so does Keith, call each for a quote and get them into a bidding war, just kidding, i really like the motor combination you have now, its awesome, just drive it, there really is'nt a better set-up
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Yes they can be bored and stroked to over 500 cubic inches, pond blocks and motors are nice, very nice.
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Yeah,my 427 sb stroker's got plenty o'power,but i'm goin for that orig. Look.(i think the big-block body style should have a bb motor in it! It just looks right)! Have you ever heard of coast high performance out in cal? Evidently that's who built the motor that's in there now.the ca.plate that the car had on it when i bought it said:585hp,but i question that!
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that's not nice...
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Is it really necessary to play them off each other. I'd be happy to pay either, their due amount knowing the support they give for free. Sorry mate, that doesn't seem kosher to me. My 2 cents. |
How much can i save on a pond alum.block compared to a shelby?
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I think the Shelby block is about $1,000 more. Check Keith's new website tomorrow (KeithCraft.com) and I think you will be able to interact with the site and build your motor and see what the cost would be.
I agree with the earlier post...these guys provide the kind of service that the low bidder builder won't provide. I for one don't do business that way. We all know that these guys have to find a way to stay in business. |
can you read
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Apologies,
It was not meant to be directed at yourself, but more a matter of general observation, for anyone considering such an approach. Once again, apologies for offending. Best wishes |
Thank you i accept, that is very nice.
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Here's a few differences between the Shelby and the Pond... If you want the Shelby name, big cubes and max power go for the Shelby block. If you want an original looking block with actual correct casting numbers on it and a true "side oiler" go with the Pond block. The Shelby block is not a side oiler. The Shelby block will readily handle a 4 3/8" stroke where the Pond block is limited to 4 1/4". (496" vs 527") The $1K saved, the "correct" appearance, it being a true side oiler and my modest HP goals (600+) steered me towards the Pond Block. |
There are a couple other differences between the Shelby and Pond blocks that merit mention. The Shelby uses a very long special head stud that concentrates load and bore distortion down toward the main bulkhead - better for cylinder roundness and ring seal. The Shelby uses double cross bolts on the main caps - looks impressive but cannot really add much since side loads are nominal in comparison to vertical.
The Pond uses 1/4" dowel pins alongside the main bolts. I really like dowel pins - they positively locate the cap in all directions. Pond blocks also require a special head stud with addded thread engagement length. The Pond block does look a bit more original, but still is not a reproduction piece. The Shelby is available in a 4.375 bore version, while the Pond is only up to 4.310 last I knew. Both will accomodate teh 4.375 stroke with minimal work. I currently have a Pond cammer project in the works with a 4.750 stroke....news at 11 on that one.... Both will handle quite a bit of power - I've run several of them around 800 naturally aspirated with no issues. |
Seriously guys don't get hung up by HP numbers because you won't be able to use most of them unless your intent is to do some serious drag racing or long (Road America type) races. IMO anything in the 500 HP range is useable and managable but beyond that is just bragging rights. There is an edge for everything and I have found it best to stay a safe distance from that edge if you want some sense of dependability.
I have turned my first FE engine in the 7500 rpm range just to achieve a position at Texas Motorsport Speedway. I got that position but my engine let go coming out of Nascar turn 4 and I crossed the finish line very quietly and promptly loaded my car on the trailer, my weekend was over. Either of those engines are great choices, as are a couple others, so make sure you do all your homework and know what you are going to do with your Cobra. Have some fun and be safe. Clois Harlan |
Thanks for the info guys,i knew about the double cross-bolts,(from the pictures) and kinda had a feelin that you couldn't take the pond block out to quite as many cubes as the shelby,(because you never hear pond advertising anything over 482 ci).but i didn't know that the shelby block wasn't a true "side-oiler".it does sound like you can make a little more power with it though,(for an extra $1000)! But hey,if you're gonna be spending $25-35000 on an engine,what's another $1000? But pond says he can make 750 hp out of his 482's,(on pump gas),whadya think?
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The Shelby block has priority main oiling as well.
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The pond website says there blocks are able to be bored over 500 inches
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Motor choice
Hey,i wanna thank all u guys for your input! You've helped me make make my decision! I'm going with the shelby big-bore block,(527 ci) and i'm gonna have keith build it,(for a number of reasons),1:there's no replacement for displacement,2:the shelby name,3:kieth craft is on of the best names in fe engine- builders out there,(maybe thee best) and last,(but not least),the old saying:(too much horse-power is almost enough)!
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