How to i.d. a 428

[Rickster]

Hi all,

I am a new member on your site with many questions. I will start with this one: I am going to look at a '67 t-bird tomorrow, in the off chance that it might have a 428 in it. How can I identify the block while it is still in the car? Are there any telltale clues/i.d tags, etc.

Thanks in advance.
Rick
rruthman@yahoo.com

[Woodz428]

Because of shared casting #'s, there is no way to tell for sure if it is a 428. You almost need to pull a head and check bore size.

[FFR428]

Sure you can check the vin number and engine tag but you really have no way to tell other than pulling the head and measuring the bore as woods428 advised. What condition is the car in? If it's not a driver and really just good for the engine the seller should not mind the head coming off. So feel him out and try to get some numbers off the heads and intake too. This will help ID what is there. As many parts can be swapped there is a good chance it might have been done at some point. Take a look see what he has and says about the car. Post some of the numbers you can find. You might have to crawl around the engine a little to see the block numbers but they are there. Where are you in CT? Glenn.

[USrowboy]

Which brings up another question I had when looking for my 428.
I read somewhere, probably one of the Ford Engine books I have somewhere....., but it mentioned a "428" casting inside one side of the freeze plug. I looked when I purchased the block. It was there. So i bought the block fully convinced the motor was a 428. The engine builder confirmed the bore and that it was not bored out 390. Any input?

[ted]

The "428" cast in the bottom of the water jacket at the center of the block and and below the center freeze plug is indeed a good indicator of a 428 block but next to impossible to see with an engine in the vehicle even with mirrors and the freeze plug out and the motor mount removed. Even on cleaned blocks, the "428" many times is eroded away by the years of sediment that's settled at that spot.

If not pulling a head, the easiest indicator for identifying if that the motor is a 428 while in the car is to look for the counterweight on the auto trans flywheel. With the TDC on the damper at the six o'clock position, then the counter weight on the flywheel should be visible at the six o'clock position.

The exception to this is that the '66 T-Birds had a two piece flywheel on the 428's that had the ring gear on that flywheel being extra wide (1½ or 2"?) and bolted to the stamped steel flywheel. I don't remember if the '67's had this same flywheel or not but I'm guessing not. The two piece flywheel is definitely a 428 item in the T-Bird but could also make the engine a transplanted 410 from a Mercury. The 410 is unlikely as it would have been put there after the fact but you never can tell. Besides the tell tale two piece flywheel for the auto trans, the wide starter ring will have a visible row of holes at the six o'clock position on the flywheel when the damper is at the twelve o'clock position.

On the other hand, someone could have internally balanced the 428 and used the 390 flywheel which will also throw you. Not likely, but every 428 I've built for myself and many for customers was internally balanced so any zero balanced flywheel could be used without worrying about the balance of the rotating assembly at a later date.

Hope this helps.

[Woodz428]

The 428 cast in the coolant passages isn't on all blocks. I did finish one last week that did have it but the others in the shop don't. It happened that the one with the # was a service block.

[kingair]

WDZ,
Not to steal your thread but I notice you have Brock Coupe 37. I leave in the morning to pick mine up from RPM in New Orleans.
Please send me an email with any items you have had to deal with since delivery.
You can call if you wish 817-946-6889, email aviary@comcast.net
Thanks
Greg

[Rickster]

Thanks for all the info. My brother went to look at the car yesterday, here is the VIN: 7Y84Z176838. what does the "Z' stand for, a 390?

[A Snake]

I think Z is 390 and if I remember right, M is 428. Not sure on this.

You can also tell by the harmonic balancer. It has a heavy counterweight on a 428. While there is some counterweighting on all FE's, the 428, being externally balanced has a much larger one. Go find one from a 390 and compare it with what is in the car.

Al

[Woodz428]

The 428 actually uses an unweighted damper like all the others. The 428SCJ uses a weighted hatchet behind the damper. The flywheel is where the weight is put on all 428s but the SCJ,which because of the 427 type rods requires the hatchet weight.

[FFR428]

Yep Z code is a 390.