Why do I have high fuel pressure... - Page 4

steve meltzer · #61 (**permalink**) 03-05-2017, 07:25 PM

I actually have some, and an eye dropper as well, so i'll do that. The old pump was a Carter 0-3000. Great help! Thanx so much. steve

patrickt · #62 (**permalink**) 03-07-2017, 05:52 PM

That fuel pump should just slip right on your block in a jiffy. And the rebuild of the secondary side of the carb is a breeze. Have you ordered that rebuild kit?

steve meltzer · #63 (**permalink**) 03-07-2017, 06:23 PM

The M6905 (this is correct for a 427, right?) pump came in the mail today, and I hope to put it in this week. I did order the rebuild kit, so depending on stabbing the pump, plus other projects, I might get to that this weekend, not sure at this juncture. thanx again. s

patrickt · #64 (**permalink**) 03-07-2017, 06:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by steve meltzer

The M6905 (this is correct for a 427, right?)

Yep, fits everything from a 352 to a 428 and all numbers in between, so long as they're an FE.

steve meltzer · #65 (**permalink**) 03-07-2017, 06:47 PM

OK, i'm all set. just need some time, always a precious commodity. s

steve meltzer · #66 (**permalink**) 03-12-2017, 10:09 PM

OK, new Carter fuel pump installed and I drove the car, secondaries blocked. Fuel pressure a constant 6.25 +/-0.25 PSI. Whether the e-pump was on or not, the car held at same 6+ PSI. I assume the sl. bit above 6 is the gauge or, within spec. Install was a bit of a fight, as there's not much room on a Kirkham, but it's done and dry. Carb on the bench for new gaskets and needle/seat this week. More later. thanx again. s

patrickt · #67 (**permalink**) 03-13-2017, 04:39 AM

Excellent. That pressure is right where you want it. Now, you know, the odds are very, very high that the only thing you need to do now is replace the needle and seat valves ,because of the previously high pressure. On your 4160, you can do that without removing the carb from the manifold or, for that matter, even pulling the bowls. It's literally a five minute job and then you set your floats and mixture screws and you're done -- just check for leaks. I think that's what I would do.

steve meltzer · #68 (**permalink**) 03-13-2017, 04:47 AM

Glad to hear i'm on the right track...but, the carb is off so I might as well do the gaskets as well as the needle/seat. Good experience in any event. thanx again. steve

patrickt · #69 (**permalink**) 03-13-2017, 04:50 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by steve meltzer

Glad to hear i'm on the right track...but, the carb is off so I might as well do the gaskets as well as the needle/seat. Good experience in any event. thanx again. steve

OK, if you don't have a 5/32 (I think it's 5/32) clutch head bit, stop off at your local auto parts store and pick one up. You need that on the secondary side. I have the Holley tool for doing that, but it's just an overpriced screwdriver with a clutch head bit on the end.

steve meltzer · #70 (**permalink**) 03-13-2017, 06:26 AM

i seem to have lost my 5/32 clutch head bit, but found a small screwdriver that works fine
(heresy, I know) s

patrickt · #71 (**permalink**) 03-13-2017, 06:36 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by steve meltzer

i seem to have lost my 5/32 clutch head bit, but found a small screwdriver that works fine
(heresy, I know) s

If you can wiggle it in, then it will do.

I think the only reason Holley chose a clutch head for the six secondary screws was so that they could sell a $20 screwdriver to stupid people like me.

patrickt · #72 (**permalink**) 03-16-2017, 09:48 AM

You might as well rebuild the primary side, since you have the kit and carb sitting there on your dining room table....

If you haven't cleaned off your metering block in a few years you might be surprised at what the ethanol in the fuel does to the Holley coating. I've written a zillion posts on clogged air bleeds and here's a perfect shot of the crap that's in there that clogs them up. Yes, Ellie's butt in the background there is cleaner than that metering block.

Just use carb cleaner, a toothbrush, and compressed air and it'll be almost as good as new. If it is horrifically bad, just buy a new metering block.

steve meltzer · #73 (**permalink**) 03-16-2017, 11:35 AM

I came to the same conclusion and the carb is ready for the reinstall. Blew out all passages with compressed air, new needle/seats, gaskets and new power valve. Floats set to horizontal with bowl upside down. thanx...more later. s

1795 · #74 (**permalink**) 03-16-2017, 05:11 PM

Steve,

I have been following this thread from the start. Patrick is a great resource (don't let him know that I said that) and it is nice to see how much you have learned and are progressing. Can't wait for the post that says "She is running like a champ!"

steve meltzer · #75 (**permalink**) 03-16-2017, 06:25 PM

Yep and this isn't the first (nor probably the last) time Patrick has rescued my sorry glutes!
Set the carb in the turkey pan this PM, but didn't have time to plumb all of the stuff....gotta walk the mutts, don't you know! Thanx for your interest. More later. s

patrickt · #76 (**permalink**) 03-18-2017, 10:36 AM

Here's a factoid of which you are probably unaware, but since you wrote that you set your floats "dry," it came to mind, so I went down and pulled my bowls off to snap this pic.

Most people think that the bowls are the same on both the primary and secondary side (aside from the fuel inlet fitting direction). But you can see from this pic that the sight hole for setting the float adjustment is noticeably lower on the secondary side. And you know you can do "micro-tuning" by turning up the float a bit, which will act like a slightly bigger jet, or turn the float down a bit, which will act like a smaller jet. Now I'm not talking much, maybe an eighth of an inch or so. But you do have to set your floats "wet" as soon as you get your carb fully hooked up. Even if the car is running great, you have to set them. And, of course, start with it set to "just barely a dribble" out the hole when you rock the car.

steve meltzer · #77 (**permalink**) 03-19-2017, 07:59 AM

Patrick, thanx for the trouble you took to shoot the photo. Got the carb on, but the carb flooded, I think....no leaking anywhere, but couldn't get it started. I think I tried too many times and now the starter whirs but won't engage. I've done about 10 Holley's in the past, so I think I rebuilt it right, but there was just too much fuel to light. Again, floats set dry, that is to say, perfectly horizontal with the bowl inverted. s

patrickt · #78 (**permalink**) 03-19-2017, 08:11 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by steve meltzer

Patrick, thanx for the trouble you took to shoot the photo. Got the carb on, but the carb flooded, I think....no leaking anywhere, but couldn't get it started. I think I tried too many times and now the starter whirs but won't engage. I've done about 10 Holley's in the past, so I think I rebuilt it right, but there was just too much fuel to light. Again, floats set dry, that is to say, perfectly horizontal with the bowl inverted. s

OK, that's kind of interesting....

I actually set my floats without ever starting the engine. When you say the carb flooded, are you seeing gas pour out of the boosters? Usually the dry method sets the floats low, so when you crank it a little bit, and stop, you can see the level down below the sight hole. Then I just loosen the screw, adjust the nut counterclockwise, tighten the screw, put my thumb over the sight hole, crank, and recheck. After two or three adjustments, and cranking, it's done. It doesn't take a whole lot of cranking either. What do you mean the starter "whirs, but won't engage?"

steve meltzer · #79 (**permalink**) 03-19-2017, 10:44 AM

First of all, i set the floats on the bench, as noted. Followed the instructions, as I have before. To set the floats with the sight plug, the car must be running, right? Or, can you do it just cranking? And yes, fuel was coming from the primary venturis.

When everything is working correctly, and you crank the car, the sound of the starter is more of a staccato "wha-wha-wha", deeper and not all the same pitch, then the engine fires up. Now, my starter makes this high pitched sound that is constant and makes me think the pinion isn't engaging the flywheel. I wacked the starter a few times with a broom handle, but I probably need to get under there and really whack it with a rubber hammer, and probably take it out. Could it be the firewall mounted solenoid (it's only 6 mos old). I think i burned up the starter, fartin' around yesterday. thanx for seeing me through this saga. s

patrickt · #80 (**permalink**) 03-19-2017, 11:24 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by steve meltzer

First of all, i set the floats on the bench, as noted. Followed the instructions, as I have before. To set the floats with the sight plug, the car must be running, right? Or, can you do it just cranking? And yes, fuel was coming from the primary venturis.

I always do it by cranking. I have a pressure gauge right before the carb and I use a remote starter. First, I remove one sight plug and put my thumb over the hole, then I crank for about three or four seconds to start filling the bowls, then wait, and crank it a few more seconds until I see a steady 6 or 7 psi, which tells me the floats have risen and closed off the needle and seat valve. I wait a few more seconds until I see the pressure drop back down and then I loosen the screw and turn the nut depending on whether there was too little or too much gas in the bowl (it's always too little for me, as I set the floats a little low dry). Then I put my thumb over the sight hole and crank it some more, do the same thing again, until I get it right below the sight hole. I do the other bowl the same way. I never adjust them with the engine running nor with the engine hot. Now, later on, I do double check the levels after driving the car and letting it cool down but I never do anything with the engine running or when the engine is anything but cold. For the gas to be coming out of the boosters, there must be something wrong with the interaction of the float and the needle and seat valve. Or the gas is going right by the little black O-ring. That kit comes with a bunch of valves, more than they show in the picture. Did you cross reference the little markings on your old valve to the correct new one? Did you put a dab of Vaseline on the O-ring before you slipped it in and screwed it down? Aside from using the .097 when you probably need the .110, I don't know how it could be in wrong. How many threads are peeking up above the bowl with the nut off?

Quote:

Originally Posted by steve meltzer

When everything is working correctly, and you crank the car, the sound of the starter is more of a staccato "wha-wha-wha", deeper and not all the same pitch, then the engine fires up. Now, my starter makes this high pitched sound that is constant and makes me think the pinion isn't engaging the flywheel. I wacked the starter a few times with a broom handle, but I probably need to get under there and really whack it with a rubber hammer, and probably take it out. Could it be the firewall mounted solenoid (it's only 6 mos old). I think i burned up the starter, fartin' around yesterday. thanx for seeing me through this saga. s

Well, if the starter is engaging, then the engine should be turning. Of course, that means your fan belt turns, your alternator turns, everything turns. If you suspect a faulty starter solenoid, try using a big thick jumper cable across the two large positive poles, for just a second, to see if the starter will turn normally. If doing that makes the same "high pitched spinning" noise, and you see nothing moving on the engine, then the starter is suspect. Dang, now is not the time to buy a lottery ticket....