Yuma Wants To Build Moat

[Ron61]

I like the idea but I don't see how using the river is going to restore all the water that Calif. is sucking out of it. I read this article two times and have to be missing something.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/nm/20080313/...border_moat_dc

Ron

[Bill Bess]

Ron, I'm sure that the idea is to provide a good vantage point for border guards, so they can judge accurately the quality and style of Mexican swimmers during the imigration process. You must realize that we (Americans) want only the best and finest (cleanest) imigrants to come to the land of love you neighbor and give them everything to be successful.
So, a very clean and strong swimmer is a good start to demonstrate the old adage, "Cleanliness is required prior to getting a free lunch forever".

I guess I'm just an old hard nose that could just as soon use the new ditch as a good vantage point for target practice.
I'm so sick...Bill

[Ron61]

Bill,

I agree with that, but what I don't understand is the Colorado River is almost dry by the time it reaches the end because of all the water being pumped from it for Southern Calif., and other areas. How is using it to fill the moat going to restore the rivers water? I know that I am missing something in the way I read the article but just can't figure out what.

From Article: The proposal seeks to restore a stretch of the West's greatest waterway, the Colorado River, which has been largely sucked dry by demand from farms and sprawling subdivisions springing up across the parched southwest and in neighboring California

Ron

[J. T. Toad]

maybe they should use water from the Salton Sea and the Alamo/New river out of Mexicali which feed it. Then they wouldn't even have to monitor who crosses.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:S...ea_Tilapia.jpg

[4RE KLR]

Ron,

I think that the thought process is that if you did out the moat and make it wider it would fill up (slowly) and provide more volumn of water.

It would evetually fill up even as LA sucks it down. It would have to be dammed up somewhere in order for it to fill up. The problem is that over the eons sediment has filled the river as well as it being overused, so the overall volumn of water is what is lacking.

I also agree that it would be a great advantage for the immigration control.

[Ron61]

Steve,

The only way I can see to possibly get enough water back into the Colorado River is to cut off some of the places taking it out. And they just keep building and taking more out every year. One of these days there won't be enough for some of these places to get water from the river.
I still think that Southern California should build the desalinization plants and use the Pacific water. It isn't like some new technology as Saudi Arabia gets all their fresh water through those plants.

Ron

[wtm442]

They just want to teach the illegals something other than how to climb a fence. A lot of employers want people who can swim!

[Wes Tausend]

...

Ron,

I can only see one possibility of having water there again ...take somebody elses'.

An example is an ongoing struggle for water rights here in ND. The Missouri River snowmelt water comes out of Montana after it has passed through the Ft. Peck Dam. It passes through the Garrison Dam in ND on to the Oahe Dam in SD. The Missouri River provides a fantastic recreation area in each dam reservoir it passes through plus water for city and agricultural supply. Normally enough water is released to create adequate navigation depth all the way down to New Orleans via the Mississippi. Barge shipping downstream counts on that each year. There is normally plenty of water to go around. Unless there is not much snowmelt several years in a row.

During years of low snowmelt, the reservoirs cannot hold their own and still release enough water for navigation downstream. Docks and boatramps end up a mile from the receding shoreline and shallowwater fish reproduction suffers. Because of this, a fight periodically ensues over how much water should be retained for upstream recreation vs released for downstream navigation. The US Army Corps of Engineers is caught in the middle since they are charged with balancing federal allocation.

It is quite possible that Yuma sees the all-important border ruckus as an opportunity to gain restoration of water rights by reducing levels taken from upstream. That would be an interesting fight.

One might assume water robbery would also be conveniently left out of news releases to downplay it early on. Sometimes there is almost more astute news left in what is not openly said, if you know what I mean.


...

[Ron61]

Wes,

There has been a big fight here for the past several years over water from Shasta Lake. They have already had to shut down one of the generators as the drought we have been in had the lake so low. Now the dam environmentalists want them to stop the water to the farmers because some kind of worthless fish that only gets 1/2" long and is good for nothing lives in the Delta and is about to become extinct unless we let more water out. Since there isn't any more to let out, they want the farmers water shut off. I hate to see any species become extinct, but that worthless fish is not as important in my opinion as food is. Also I think that in the coming years we will see the water to Los Angles from the Colorado shut off. There has already been some talk about it and the Governors of Nevada and Arizona figure their states come before L.A.
We had a pretty fair Winter this year and quite a bit of snow pack, but one year of near normal can't make up for 5 years of next to none. This is the first year in the last 5 that Mt. Shasta and Mt. Lassen have complete snow covers. I took a picture of Shasta the other day as it had been so long since I had seen anything but rock and some small spots of snow down in crevasses.

Ron

[Wayne Maybury]

I visited the Hoover Dam on Saturday and the water in Lake Meade must be about 100 feet below the normal level. In addition, they only had 2 generators working to reduce the flow. I don't know what they will do if the level goes much lower.

Wayne

[Ron61]

Wayne,

Did you take the tour through the dam? I was through it years ago and then to the power house.
If the water gets to low they will have to start shutting down generators as the green people will complain like they did here about them making the water to warm for the fish.

Ron

[trularin]

Maybe it is just bathing suits.

[Wayne Maybury]

Ron

Yes we went way down to the very bottom and saw the old bi-pass tunnels then we went up to the power generation level. They only had 2 of 8 generators working on the NV side, due to the low water level. The flow of water coming out of the dam was minimal. It was an interesting tour.

By the way, the new 4 lane bridge that will allow traffic to bi-pass the dam is coming along nicely.

Wayne

[trularin]

Just don't let Warren roar through it. He shook the tiles off the one by him.

[Ron61]

Wayne,

I thought that the tour of that dam was more interesting than any that I have taken. Maybe because my Father never worked on it and I wasn't there going through it while it was being built. I guess the new bridge will help the traffic a lot.
Here at Shasta they used an old railroad tunnel as a bypass and you could go back into it about 50' before 911 and see the huge concrete plug they used to stop it when the dam was completed. Still has the smoke on the ceiling from the old steam engines. They use the 50' as a storage area, probably machine guns now.

Ron

[Wayne Maybury]

Two things impressed me about the dam. Firstly, that was quite the engineering feat for it's time and secondly, I wondered how many workmen died during the construction.

I was also quite impressed with the cleanliness of the area where the generators are located. One generator was undergoing maintanance so we got to see it all apart.

Wayne

[Excaliber]

I don't get this whole 'moat' idea. You know theres a reason the illegals used to be called 'wet backs'. What? Like they forgot how to swim?

[imagine2frolic]

I took the Hoover tour about 12 years ago. We entered through the center of the damn at the top. It was beautiful all the way down, and through the tunnel to get to the generators. The tour was a couple of hours.

We took the tour 2 years ago, and we entered through the glass building at the side. It was a straight shot to the generators, and a very short tour. One more score for the frikking terrorist. We were searched as we drove over the damn also. Another score for the frikking terrorist.

After taking the first tour the second one made me feel a little bit cheated.......

[HI Cobra]

I took the long tour (in 1994) and enjoyed it. My grandmother's brother was
Frank Crowe who was the lead superintendent on the construction of the dam.
Sounds like they really eliminated a lot of the tour which is too bad - no
wonder you felt cheated the second time around. I have read several books
on the project and it is amazing how something that large and complex was built without computers to track the details - scheduling, materials, man
power, you name it. And the good news - it is still performing - water permitting!

[Ron61]

Wayne,

The history channel has a 2 hour documentary that it shows once in a while on the building of the dam. It is really quite interesting and shows how they had to hang from ropes to drill and blast those canyon walls. I think it also tells how many were killed during the construction of the dam. To bad about them shortening the tours, but they have done the same at Shasta and no cameras, cell phones or anythings else are allowed. For the most part, all power rooms are kept as clean as they can be so there is no dust and junk to fly around and gt into the generators.

Ron