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Re: Obama - What does it mean to you?
« Reply #199 on: March 13, 2008, 06:29:51 PM » Quote

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by Ken Blackwell - Columnist for the New York Sun

It's an amazing time to be alive in America . We're in a year of firsts in this presidential election: the first viable woman candidate; the first viable African-American candidate; and, a candidate who is the first frontrunning freedom fighter over 70. The next president of America will be a first.

We won't truly be in an election of firsts, however, until we judge every candidate by where they stand. We won't arrive where we should be until we no longer talk about skin color or gender. Now that Barack Obama steps to the front of the Democratic field, we need to stop talking about his race, and start talking about his policies and his politics.

The reality is this: Though the Democrats will not have a nominee until August, unless Hillary Clinton drops out, Mr. Obama is now the frontrunner, and its time America takes a closer and deeper look at him.

Some pundits are calling him the next John F. Kennedy. He's not. He's the next George McGovern. And it's time people learned the facts.

Because the truth is that Mr. Obama is the single most liberal senator in the entire U.S. Senate. He is more liberal than Ted Kennedy, Bernie Sanders, or Mrs. Clinton. Never in my life have I seen a presidential frontrunner whose rhetoric is so far removed from his record. Walter Mondale promised to raise our taxes, and he lost. George McGovern promised military weakness, and he lost. Michael Dukakis promised a liberal domestic agenda, and he lost.

Yet Mr. Obama is promising all those things, and he's not behind in the polls. Why? Because the press has dealt with him as if he were in a beauty pageant. Mr. Obama talks about getting past party, getting past red and blue, to lead the United States of America . But let's look at the more defined strokes of who he is underneath this superficial "beauty."

Start with national security, since the president's most important duties are as commander-in-chief. Over the summer, Mr. Obama talked about invading Pakistan, a nation armed with nuclear weapons; meeting without preconditions with Mahmoud Ahmadin eja d, who vows to destroy Israel and create another Holocaust; and Kim Jong II, who is murdering and starving his people, but emphasized that the nuclear option was off the table against terrorists - something no president has ever taken off the table since we created nuclear weapons in the 1940s. Even Democrats who have worked in national security condemned all of those remarks. Mr. Obama is a foreign-policy novice who would put our national security at risk.

Next, consider economic policy. For all its faults, our health care system is the strongest in the world. And free trade agreements, created by Bill Clinton as well as President Bush, have made more goods more affordable so that even people of modest means can live a life that no one imagined a generation ago. Yet Mr. Obama promises to raise taxes on "the rich." How to fix Social Security? Raise taxes. How to fix Medicare? Raise taxes. Prescription drugs? Raise taxes. Free college? Raise taxes. Socialize medicine? Raise taxes. His solution to everything is to have government take it over. Big Brother on steroids, funded by your paycheck.

Finally, look at the social issues. Mr. Obama had the audacity to open a stadium rally by saying, "All praise and glory to God!" but says that Christian leaders speaking for life and marriage have "hijacked" - hijacked - Christianity. He is pro-partial birth abortion, and promises to appoint Supreme Court justices who will rule any restriction on it unconstitutional. He espouses the abortion views of Margaret Sanger, one of the early advocates of racial cleansing. His spiritual leaders endorse homosexual marriage, and he is moving in that direction. In Illinois , he refused to vote against a statewide ban - ban - on all handguns in the state. These are radical left, Hollywood , and San Francisco values, not Middle America values.

The real Mr. Obama is an easy target for the general election. Mrs. Clinton is a far tougher opponent. But Mr. Obama could win if people don't start looking behind his veneer and flowery speeches. His vision of "bringing America together" means saying that those who disagree with his agenda for America are hijackers or warmongers. Uniting the country means adopting his liberal agenda and abandoning any conflicting beliefs.

But right now everyone is talking about how eloquent of a speaker he is and - yes - they're talking about his race. Those should never be the factors on which we base our choice for president. Mr. Obama's radical agenda sets him far outside the American mainstream, to the left of Mrs. Clinton.

It's time to talk about the real Barack Obama. In an election of firsts, let's first make sure we elect the person who is qualified to be our president in a nuclear age during a global civilizational war.

6 months, plenty of time for folks to get educated...I hope.

These are from his book.
Doesn’t look like he likes to say anything about his white side.
From ‘Dreams of my Father’, “In Indonesia, I had spent two years at a Muslim school”
“I studied the Koran..”
From ‘Audacity of Hope: “Lolo (Obama’s step father) followed a brand of Islam ....”I looked to Lolo for guidance”.
From ‘The Audacity Of Hope, “I will stand with the Muslims should the political winds shift in an ugly direction.”
From The Audacity Of Hope, “We are no longer just a Christian nation,” “We are also a Jewish nation, a Muslim nation, a Buddhist nation, a Hindu nation, and a nation of nonbelievers.”
From Dreams of My Father, “ I FOUND A SOLACE IN NURSING A PERVASIVE SENSE OF GRIEVANCE AND ANIMOSITY AGAINST MY MOTHER’S RACE”.
From ‘Dreams of my Father’, “The emotion between the races could never be pure..... the other race would always remain just that: menacing, alien, and apart.”
From ‘Dreams of My Father’,
“I ceased to advertise my mother’s race at the age of 12 or 13, when I began to suspect that by doing so I was ingratiating myself to whites”
From Dreams Of My Father, “never emulate white men and brown men whose fates didn’t speak to my own. It was into my father’s image, the black man, son of Africa, that I’d packed all the attributes I sought in myself..”.
From Dreams Of My Father:
“That hate hadn’t gone away,” he wrote, blaming “white people — some cruel, some ignorant, sometimes a single face, sometimes just a faceless image of a system claiming power over our lives.”

Interesting quotes posted above, I see no problem with them. It shows a varied past and an unusual upbringing. Like statistics, which are easily manipulated, or 'bible' versus taken out of context the above selected quotes carry little weight by themselves.

"I look to Lolo for guidance". His step father, as he SHOULD, it's called 'parenting'. I don't agree with all the things my Dad said, but I looked to him for 'guidance'.

Same goes for any of the above quotes, as presented here, in this context, they are little more than 'spam'. Six months long enough to get 'educated'? Probably not, if your so easily swayed all ready by such obviously biased statements.

Uhhh. Did you read them all?

“I will stand with the Muslims should the political winds shift in an ugly direction.”
He is stating that he has no backbone nor force of will and will merely ally himself with whomever he thinks has more power.


"I FOUND A SOLACE IN NURSING A PERVASIVE SENSE OF GRIEVANCE AND ANIMOSITY AGAINST MY MOTHER’S RACE.”
So it's ok for a presidential candidate to openly express hate against a race not his own as a black man but nobody else can?

In fact. The first second and fourth ones are the only ones I don't have a problem with

So easily duped by simple statements taken at face value with no further consideration...

You never had to struggle, as a young man, trying to figure things out in life, who were you, where did you come from, what was your heritage. I guess it was all very clear for you from an early age? For most white folks of course, it is all ready much clearer than for many blacks living in a white mans world. But some of us understand the delima, those who don't missed important lessons in life. When I was growing up I asked these questions about my own heritage, my American Indian (Cherokee), German, Irish blood. To whom did I owe allegiance? To what nationallity would I identify with? I learned to question authority, still do, and rightfully so. I learned tolerance, though it was difficult when I lost my job in Washington D.C. because of reverse discrimination. Should I then 'hate' the blacks? I certainly did for a time, not anymore. It was a lesson learned, 'people' can be pigs, regardless of color or religious affiliation, cops DO lie, the government cannot be trusted. I don't 'hate' them, but I'm not stupid either! Muslims are POTENTIALLY dangerous, but not all of them, I don't trust them, not all of them, but I don't automatically assume their all terrorists either.

Again, these statements without an understanding of their context are nothing more than spam. Such radical idealism statements could be made against virtually anybody. It worked exceptionally well during the crusades, the Salem witch trials, post 9-11 attacks against ALL Muslims and will continue to work in the future. Nothings changed in that regard.

cobra de capell, in particular from watching YOUR posts over a long period of time, this latest 'quotes' on Obama are par for the course. It is my opinion, that your views are anything but 'balanced' and tend to be sharply critical of any number of topics and people. Your prolific use of the "Joke" thread is appropriate, and clearly where you latest post attacking Obamas character by these wild quotes without proper context belong. Forgive me if my personal opinion of your posts rubs you the wrong way, sometimes the truth hurts.

The first post in this thread said Obama talked of 'invading' Pakistan. Now that statement is SO 'out of context' I would have to call it like it is, a bold face lie. Which then begs the question, what else is this author lieing about? His credibility is lost. But it sure makes a good sound bite to those who take it a face value. It's a cheap shot.

If you want a policy that Obama supports and doesn't deal with race or religion check this out...

It's where I left him.

http://www.worldnetdaily.com/index.p...w&pageId=56405

scott s

Thats a good report Scott, thanks for posting it, scary stuff attempting to blot out 'world poverty'. The poor will always be with us. Perhaps the question should be, should we spend the money on WAR or PEACE?

Bush has buried us in war debt, will McCain continue that? Somethings gotta change.

[quote=Excaliber; When I was growing up I asked these questions about my own heritage, my American Indian (Cherokee), German, Irish blood. [/QUOTE]

DAMN!your monthly alcohol bill must be thru the roof!:eek:

:o

I just have my German ancestry to worry about and my nerve medication bill would buy several nice cars. I don't pretend to know what is true and what isn't . I quit long ago believing anything any politician says when running for office. They won't do any thing but get in and start planning the next election anyway. I was a Reagan fan and voted for him because he at least kept the military strong enough to protect us and I have a feeling if he was still in the Muslims wouldn't be running the county today.
Off my soap box now. Please address all sarcastic comments to Ernie. :LOL:

Ron :CRY:

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Ron,

Heck, I've got to give Ernie a lot credit. He's got a lot of b@lls talkin independent, even progressive, on this way conservative forum. :LOL:

The weird thing about the public is they are so easily bought by money. The privilaged class can, and does, buy entire TV networks, political consortiums and glossy websites to try and convince us all that the poor are the main burden, thee burden that is carried by the working folks. But the truth is that the bottom 5th is a lot cheaper to carry than the top 5th and always has been. Heavy advertising always makes me suspicious, real suspicious. :rolleyes:
I guess the bottom 5th still can't afford to buy the finest propaganda money can buy. Duh. Propaganda: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Propaganda .

I like what Obama says also, sticking up for us, the working class, the tax payers, the American consumer and all ...but I just don't think he can pull it off at this point. Just a little too young and idealistic. A nice guy, but a "read my lips, please read my lips" kinda guy.

McCain, ever idealistic and definately not young, has gotten away with so much crap and lived to tell about it, that I believe he could pull off just about anything. According to Wikipedia, "He was a friend and leader for many of his classmates, and stood up for people who were being bullied...". ( http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/McCain )
A "Read my lips, now, unless you wanna fat lip" kinda guy. Doesn't give a damn who has the thickest wallet. I believe a young man that stands up for those who can't, or won't, carries that throughout his life. If Obama actually does so, he'll carry it too. ;)

This McCain guy not only went into the armed services, he stayed long enough to deliver, to give, so much that if he had given an ounce more, he would be dead. Ike would be proudest of this guy, of all his fellows-in-line. A live leopard does not change his spots.

And the Iraq War? Well, I'm sure John felt the same way G.W. did when G.W. started that silly barfight ...but I don't think John would have foolishly gone over there without harkening the silence of absolutely dead weapons inspectors. Discretion is the better part of valor and he knows that by now. And even then, Mic wouldn't have promised to do any more than a forced look-see. But now that some idiot has promised "it all", well John is an honorable man. Can't easily walk away from a barfight fully promised and half done. Never has before. :cool:
But one hundred years, you say? Well John, like a lot of folks, realizes that the IRA terrorist group war went on for 80 years, a few miles from Buckingham Palace. Not that England wanted or planned it that way. Realistically, the die is cast. :(

Afghanistan? McCain despises terrorists, I believe he would never have pulled any troops at all. Saddam Hussein might of lived but not Osama bin laden. Mic would have at least listened to his front line military advisers. He's been to the front.

Hillary? None of the normal propaganda has ever bothered me much. Rush Limbaugh is just a funny guy with another ho-hum smear agenda. But Bill signed NAFTA. I don't care if he sleeps with Monica(s) ... but he also sleeps with powerful $pecial interest groups that promote burdens like NAFTA. And so does Hillary. A threesom. A "New Yawk City" Ménage à trois except apparently Bill wasn't getting any. :rolleyes:
Like Scott says, "Scr*w you very much NAFTA". :mad:

Six months. I think McCain ...but maybe Obama. Obama has six months to impress me the way it usually takes a lifetime to do. We'll see.

Maybe Mic can pick Colin Powell for vp. I still trust him even if he sorta lied about WMD's. He told the truth that he lied, a rarity. :LOL:


...

:)

Wes,

Sorry, but I have just lost all ability to believe anything anyone running for a high office says. And even if they are telling the truth, just what can a president do if Congress won't go along? After all, the power is in Congress. They make the idiotic laws and that statement the other day that their pork crap added to bills was a God Given Right really ticks me off. I don't remember which Senator it was that said it, but he was a Democrat, and they were trying to get them to take 1 (one ) year and pass bills to help the country and economy without all the added personal pork and it was voted down by a huge margin. He even went on to say it was a Constitutional right. By his interpretation of the constitution and God given rights, we all have the right to take anything we want from anyone who can't stop us. Same for the Line Item Veto. Congress will never allow that.

Edit: By the way Wes, my comment of address all sarcastic comments to Ernie was just in fun. He has a far deeper knowledge of politics than I do.

Ron :mad:

Since I'm bulletproof, I don't give a rats butt as to your interpretation of my views. You seem to have tunnel vision when it comes to Obama. All of us make our decision based on all the information that we can gather and those quotes are just part of it. Look to his pastor for more relating to his connection to some very strange views.

Luckily, you are in the minority here.

And yes, I do forgive you as you remind me of when I was young and stupid.

...

Ron,

Don't blame you for feeling cynical. None of them are perfect. I'm just thinking it is likely "Old age and treachery will defeat youth and beauty". ;)

And since I'm old, I am better matched to defend myself from political treachery than political vigor. :LOL:


...

:LOL:

Wes,

The old age and youth part I can see in the candidates. But where is the Beauty? :)

Ron :3DSMILE:

As usual the beauty is in their better half:

( http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedi...ma-Cropped.jpg )
( http://celebrity-pictures-gossip.com...ndy-mccain.jpg )

Also the sole reason male politicians do bad things. If there were no women, us men would all just lay around eating, sleeping and posting in squalor, live and let live, nobody in charge. :LOL:


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I also liked Obama until i saw how much it would cost ME the tax payer-. who according to him i do not pay enough because i'm rich.
Here in ct my small 1650 sq ft house has a property tax of $6000.00 a year, add in 3 cars at 500.00 each, 6% sales tax, 5% state income tax and seeing wife and i both make
good incomes and pay in excess of $24.000.oo in federal tax. Put three girls through college with little aid, pay my own healthcare etc etc
AND HE WANTS MORE OF MY INCOME I need it to retire
I will vote for mccainjoeg

Obama mama is a gifted orator (the only gift) and Ernie bit hook, line and sinker. Obama walks on stage, mentions 'change' 15-20 times and walks off. No one knows enough about him to make an educated decision, his handlers have him wrapped so tight no one can ask a question?. I read while he was in the Illinois senate He voted “present,” 130 times. Evidently he has a HARD time making a decision. He's not even a choice.

Quotes like "Obama wants to invade Pakistan" and the quotes de capell posted are nothing more than spin and bull $hit. Scotts post, in particular, actually had some substance, there have been others. THAT is what is needed, real facts and opinions based on a intelligant understanding of the facts. Questions raised, like voting 130 times 'present' (of which I am aware) need consideration, it is a cause for pause. But I am not pursuaded one way or another by simple minded comments taken out of context which are nothing more than political spin.

This election may not be Obama's time, perhaps in the future, when he is more seasoned. But his presence has sure brought significant 'change' all ready. A fresh way of thinking to the entire political process.

As for my personal opinion, no way I want to see Hillary in office, period. McCain, I don't know, I'll need another six months or so to work that out. His statement, and no context required, concerning we will be in Iraq another 100 years is extremely troubling. Though it may well be true no matter WHO gets into office. Money issues? Also very troubling is the amount of money Iraq is currently bringing in from oil sales, their swimming in money, and spending very little of it for their own infrastructure. Relying instead on American funding, which we continue to pour on. Without relief from this very expensive war we don't have a chance of getting taxes under control in the long run.

Wasn't this Bill Clinton and Al Gore's platform?

Is it too late to ask for some popcorn?