We really do need a change..........

[427 S/O]

So, let me get this straight.........

'O' agrees with the Ca. 9th circuit at overturning the gay marriage ban!. So the voters in Ca. were wrong?, the 9th says they were!. Why even have the people decide when it means nothing?. Who would vote for a candidate who agrees with the 9th, and regards your vote as meaningless?.

[tcrist]

I don't think it matters which state you are in. Your vote means nothing. They will overturn it if they feel like it. As far as the voting for the President. That don't mean a thing either. The SUPER DELIGITS (sp) will vote for who ever they want. One of them here actually said to the news one day that the people in Calif dont know how to vote and do not know the issues. He is going to vote the way he wants to and he doesnt care what anyone else wants. I vote just so if I do not like what the government is doing I can at least say that at least I did not vote for them or boy did I screw up by voting for them. Either way, I feel that if you dont vote, don't gripe about who is in office and what they are doing.

JMHO, Terry

[427 S/O]

Sounds like you've given up Terry?, I simply don't subscribe to your conclusion. You, me and everyone else can make the courts obey the majority.

[tcrist]

I still like to hope that things can change and I still try. I know that I will do no good but thats not going to stop me from trying. I just needed to vent.

Terry

[Ron61]

Perry,

Please explain just how we the people are going to MAKE the courts obey the majority. That Gay Marriage Bill the people passed was passed by a large majority and the courts just ignore anything they can get paid to. We can't vote out the judges. And if we did they would just declare it as invalid since they are above the law.
I am sick of this local rag that claims to be a news paper filling the front page with how great it is that Gays can marry now and they had to place a police guard at the marriage license office in Redding. That I fear is the only way the people will ever have any power again is with violence. I think the world and society, if it can still be called that, which we knew is gone and now we are moving more toward the people serving the Govt. than the Govt. serving the people.

Ron

[427 S/O]

I read that Ca. voters collected over a 100K signatures for a constitution amendment to ban gay marrige. This is not something judges can screw with....correct?.

[Ron61]

Perry,

Supposedly not but I will wait until until I see it happen before I count on it.

Edited to correct wording

Ron

[RalphSchmalph]

Interesting thread for this site but let me weigh in as a retired lawyer. I think the court overturned one of those referendums that CA is so famous for. The state constitution, once amended cannot be overturned by the 9th Circuit (federal court) unless they find that banning gay marriage is a violation of the U.S. Constitution. Which, of course, would never withstand a challenge to the U.S. Supreme Court. But the bottom line is that there's probably a lot of litigation ahead and more wasted money that the taxpayers are ultimately responsible for.
I'm opposed to gay marriage.........haven't they suffered enough?!!

[Ron61]

Ralph,

Thanks for the answer on that. The state is already $15 billion in debt if the reports are close, again this is reports by our news media which is about as accurate as Hitler's press was. Redding, which I know for sure is millions in the hole is budgeting for a new jail, over $100 million if I remember correctly, a new police station as the roof on the old one leaks, another $70 million, and they are laying off city workers and cutting back on the police and fire departments. Now they have hired a panel to determine how they are going to collect money to pay for this as there aren't enough businesses or people up here working for them to get it in tax increases. The small city that I live in, Shasta Lake, is broke and has sold everything they had except a couple of old fire trucks and one bucket truck so the city council could have a substantial pay raise and now they are asking people if everyone would be willing to donate $100 dollars for them to buy a new fire truck. Our local Govt. at work.

Ron

[RalphSchmalph]

Ron,
I feel your pain. I left Massachusetts after 58 years and know how incompetent government and a corrupt press go hand in hand......you can't have one without the other.
Ralph
P.S. I love the beauty of your area. I wish we give you some of our Florida weather and you could give us some of your beautiful curving roads.

[Ron61]

Ralph,

That is the one thing that I like about this area over the other parts of the state I have lived in. There are some great parks in this state, but here we have mountains, desert, and great curving roads that follow the old stage coach trails all within a 30 minute drive. Plus many old Gold mines and other historical sites. On the downside we have Fires. Yesterday the smoke was so think that the sun couldn't break through. But I still love it up here.

Ron

[trularin]

This has been evident for several years.

We are not really a republic.

[clayfoushee]

Originally Posted by trularin

This has been evident for several years.

We are not really a republic.

Actually, we ARE a republic, and NOT a democracy because the framers of the Constitution were concerned about a simple majority of the public voting to infringe on individual rights, among other things.

Thus, they created a system of checks and balances by establishing 3 completely independent branches of government.

[4RE KLR]

Originally Posted by trularin

This has been evident for several years.

We are not really a republic.

I think it has been many, many years since we were.

[J. T. Toad]

Originally Posted by clayfoushee

Actually, we ARE a republic, and NOT a democracy because the framers of the Constitution were concerned about a simple majority of the public voting to infringe on individual rights, among other things.

Thus, they created a system of checks and balances by establishing 3 completely independent branches of government.

If it looks like a duck, walks like a duck, quacks like a duck, it must be a platypus. Just because it is labeled as something, doesn't mean it IS that same thing.

I would wager, the founding fathers, if present today would organize a revolt.... ah heck, they would have done it years ago.

[J. T. Toad]

I forgot, and to prove my point... no one cared when Proposition 187 was reversed by the court.

http://www.ssbb.com/article1.html

and look where we are at today (not only in California)

http://www.cnsnews.com/ViewCulture.a...20050808a.html


If THIS is a republic... I wouldn't want. A far cry from some dressed up Indians in Boston vandalizing a shipment of tea. That was for freedom of man... don't pay your property taxes, tell me how free you feel in 6 months.

[1ntCobra]

As a white republican with an korean democrat for a wife, I have a feeling that at some point in the prior century, inter-racial marriage was illegal in some parts of the USA. Thank goodness it is not illegal anymore (or at least I hope it isn't).

If we are talking about our founding fathers fighting for freedom. Why is it that we want to impair the freedom of gay people from getting married in the eyes of our government?

To me a lot of this stuff is based on rules from various religions. There are a couple of religions that disallow eating pork. I think one of them is part of our good old judeo-christian background. I have not visited the middle east, but I doubt I could get a BBQ pulled pork sandwich in some countries over there because the religious rules are pushed into government laws. Thank goodness in the USA, I have the freedom to eat a BBQ pulled port sandwich right up the street from my office if I want to.

If gay people want to get married, I don't want to mess with their freedom, the same way I don't want someone else messing with my freedom of choice when it comes to what I eat for lunch. And if we allow gay marriage, then gay couples they get the freedom to have messy divorces and child custody battles too.

Perhaps this issue should be a bigger deal to you if your religion recognizes that gay marriage. You can always switch to a different brand of religion that disallows gay marriage. You can do that because of the freedom of religion we have here in the USA. Freedom is a good thing!

Hey if one of your children turns out to be gay, you have the freedom to disown that child too.

Hmm... I think I get myself in trouble whenever I post in the lounge. I should remember not to do this again.

[427 S/O]

1ntcobra, when I see my dog (male) and the dog (male) next door, smoking each other,
I'll accept it. Until then, I'll continue to believe animals know right from wrong far better than humans

[1ntCobra]

Originally Posted by 427 S/O

1ntcobra, when I see my dog (male) and the dog (male) next door, smoking each other,
I'll accept it. Until then, I'll continue to believe animals know right from wrong far better than humans

My mom used to have a miniature french poodle. It was indiscriminate. Female dogs, male dogs, furniture, stuffed animals, people's legs... You think it could be the "french" thing?

[J. T. Toad]

1ntcobra, interesting point.

May I further the point by asking a question, if gay is ok, then why not Polygamy? if Polygamy is ok why not a family run brothel? why have any moral law....

(which doesn't effect another person harmfully ie. murder, cannibalism, etc....

(actually I should add "unwillingly" as I am sure there are plenty of masochists (yay for spell check!) who want to be harmed deliberately))

....for that matter? Shouldn't suicide be legal then? Euthanasia? Rights/protections for a minor?

An interesting dilemma happened when tax payer money went to treat and legislate morality, (speed laws, helmet law, abortion, smoking, alcoholism, etc.) Father Government decided that it would know better than the publics individual rights. (consider if you will recent changes in eminent domain law)

The Greeks played around with a no-moral legislative government, it led to child cannibalism for entertainment just before they fell.

On a side note, I have no idea WHY they would want to become DINK's. OF COURSE the IRS is for this... revenue generation.