Nationalized Health Care in 2 weeks? Rise up people!

[cobra de capell]

Nationalized Health Care in 2 weeks? Rise up people!

We need a coordinated effort to stop socialized healthcare.

Go to the link above...it's a good place to start.

http://www.handsoffmyhealth.org/


Another video...

http://bighollywood.breitbart.com/sc...ed-healthcare/

[cobra bill]

If nationalized healthcare is such a terrible thing, how come there has not been one country that has a nationalized healthcare, has EVER rejected it, in favor of a for profit system?

[cobra de capell]

They were already socialist countries - once you go socialist, like you - you never go back....

By the way, please go away.

[joe g]

Those country's on AERvage have tax rates of over 50% and as mentined before are socialist. Just like every program started by gov here in america Once in place it NEVER goes away.
I'm sure you have gone to theDMV in your state- now there is a perfect example of how gov med would work. Why do canadians pay big money for faster service by going to the usa. Ever go to the post office an see HOW UNEFFICEINT they are or amtrac. If you want gov medical , move to france or canada
Even the military which i love is grossly wasteful.
joeg

[cobra bill]

You all forget we won! so suck it up.

[Wayne Maybury]

Joe

The biggest problem with the medical system in Canada is over loading which in part is caused by the fact that medical care is free. I am a great beliver that a charge should be imposed for individuals seeking medical care. This charge would help in 2 ways: firstly it would put some additional money into the system, secondly it would make many people think twice about going to the ER when they really are not sick.

It is true that some Canadians do go to the US to get quick medical attention as they do not want to wait for care in Canada. It is also true that many non-Canadians come into Canada for the sole purpose of getting free medical care that they cannot get in their own country. So it is a two way street.

I have never said that our system is the best there is, but it is not nearly as bad as some American politicians would have you believe. By the way, isn't the medical system in France rated as one of the best in the world?

Wayne

[cobra bill]

And by the way CDC, as long as you are spewing out lies hatred and prejudice rhetoric I will never go away! Normally liberals are quite passive and rarely speak out, but I was once a right winger too, until I saw the light, so I am you nemesis, your nightmare whatever term you wish to use I will not go away.

[RAZOR]

Nationalized health care will be the nightmare, our system needs help but not the governments solution. My son in law is a doctor and knows from experience the difference in the systems, having been in Australia, which has both private and national system. In Australia he had a patient that needed a treatment (forgive my non technical jargon) on a heart/lung machine, their was one in all of Queensland which is five tines the size of California, where as back in the states in the heart department of his hospital there were over 30 of the same machine, bottom line was the treatment his patient needed was not available, but here it would have been routine.
We have heard the complaints about how lacking VA hospitals have been,although their are good people that work their, the system is not a model, but that is exactly what we are headed for with big brother stepping in more obtrusively. The compassion of the IRS, and the efficiency of the Pentagon. Why who wouldn't want that

[cobra bill]

No one is taking away your present health insurance, there has to be a public plan, to keep the for profit ones in check, and for those that can only afford the public plan they have nothing now, and anything is better than nothing. it should be something modeled after the German system, with both private and government, I think there system is rated in the top ten. at this point we are 37th

[cobra de capell]

Originally Posted by cobra bill

And by the way CDC, as long as you are spewing out lies hatred and prejudice rhetoric I will never go away! Normally liberals are quite passive and rarely speak out, but I was once a right winger too, until I saw the light, so I am you nemesis, your nightmare whatever term you wish to use I will not go away.

so I am you nemesis

I didn't know that you are black, Cobra (space) Bill, not that there is anything wrong with that.....also, sorry - you cannot possibly be my nemesis...

In addition, I've selected ComputerWorks as my Arch-Nemises on this site. He's not only a liberal, he's crazy with power.....

[cobra bill]

Either way I'm not going any ware!

[cobra de capell]

Originally Posted by cobra bill

Either way I'm not going any ware!

Now, "any ware" - what does that mean on the street?

You're making this way too easy.

[Bobcat]

Cobra Bill ... I`m going to disagree somewhat with your statement that not one country that has nationalized healthcare has rejected it in favor of a for profit system . While they haven`t rejected it totally , it seems that the UK is now encouraging private clinics, letting the people go to them instead of the Govt system and paying them to use the clinics instead of the NHS , which has broken down badly with waits of up to 12 weeks to see a Doctor .
Maybe Wayne can comment on this , but I head that Canada is also allowing/encouraging private clinics ??

[patrickt]

Originally Posted by Wayne Maybury

Joe

The biggest problem with the medical system in Canada is over loading which in part is caused by the fact that medical care is free. I am a great beliver that a charge should be imposed for individuals seeking medical care.

Unfortunately, there is a prevailing belief in the United States that an adult is entitled to state-of-the-art health care simply because they are an adult American. It is politically incorrect to suggest "different standards of health care" based on one's ability to pay or their health care coverage. It is also politically incorrect to suggest waiving one's right to sue the health care provider in exchange for lower priced medical care.

[Wayne Maybury]

Originally Posted by Bobcat

Maybe Wayne can comment on this , but I head that Canada is also allowing/encouraging private clinics ??

Bob I am no expert so all I can do is give my opinion.

There are lots of private clinics for various procedures like X rays, etc. You can get an X ray for free in a hospital or pay to have one done in a clinic. Having said that, the government is unequivecal in stressing the fact that the system is universal and there is no parrellel private system.

I had some minor skin surgery in a private clinic 2 years ago for which I had to pay $100. I could have had the same thing done in the hospital for no charge but I would have had to wait a few weeks. However major medical procedures are all carried out in hospitals.

Wayne

[Bobcat]

Wayne .... thanks for a first hand perspective . A lot of times , word of mouth and other factors come off as being fact . Not trying to put words in your mouth , but would it be fair to day there are clinics for "minor" procedures for those who don`t want to wait for the system and the govt. hospitals for the major procedures ? Maybe a gross oversimplification on my part.
Jumping around somewhat , the press here has "reported" that colon cancer cure rates in Canada are about 17% lower than here and one of the reasons is that the approved drugs in Canada are not the latest generation that is being currently used . True ???? or do you know ? I have some , unfortunately , first hand experience with colon cancer treatment here as my lady`s daughter died of that two years ago at 32 .

Bob

[LoBelly]

Originally Posted by RAZOR

Nationalized health care will be the nightmare, our system needs help but not the governments solution. My son in law is a doctor and knows from experience

.... In Australia he had a patient that needed a treatment (forgive my non technical jargon) on a heart/lung machine, their was one in all of Queensland which is five tines the size of California, where as back in the states in the heart department of his hospital there were over 30 of the same machine, bottom line was the treatment his patient needed was not available, but here it would have been routine.
...

Hello Razor

Its an interesting comparison

Although the land size of Queensland is (almost) 5x that of California (424,000 sq.km v 1,853,000 sq.km) the Population comparison is probably more relevant.

Queensland Aust: 4,048,467 http://www.oesr.qld.gov.au/queenslan...er/index.shtml

California US: 36,756,666 http://quickfacts.census.gov/qfd/states/06000.html

The population of California is greater than the whole of the Australia (about 22 million) http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of..._by_population

Population levels and population density has a dramatic effect on the revenue base that medical services can be funded from - whether public or private.

It may be true that the health care available in Queensland (or any part of Australia) is below that available in the US however the main arguement is how much care you (the population) get for your $.

LoBelly

[Jamo]

Originally Posted by cobra bill

And by the way CDC, as long as you are spewing out lies hatred and prejudice rhetoric I will never go away! Normally liberals are quite passive and rarely speak out, but I was once a right winger too, until I saw the light, so I am you nemesis, your nightmare whatever term you wish to use I will not go away.

Wanna bet?

[Wes Tausend]

...

Stop socialized healthcare??? Hogwash.

Here is a good example of what is actually generating the backlash over government health care. The popular site may be somewhat overloaded by truth-seekers.

Private healthcare insurance currently has about a 20% overhead administration cost where Medicare only has about 3%. As a rule, US government run programs are far more efficient than private counterparts, like it or not. For one thing, they don't have wallstreet stockholder leaches to pay ...and another, no huge executive salary/bonus burdens. Most government workers don't get paid as much as the private sector. Of course there is a lot of corporate crying, wringing of hands and the usual false scare propoganda, as large insurance corporations contemplate reduced profiteering.

From the patients point of view, it is better to have a government bureaucrat between you and your doctor than a corporate bureaucrat in the way. The government guy works for you ...the corporate guy works for stockholders and himself. We are the government, we control it, but we can't vote corporate crooks out. Just common sense. Geez.

Imagine what it would cost if police protection was all private ...or fire protection ...or military. Way more than we could ever dream. But then private US health care now cost way more than we ever dreamed too. And if any of you think your current health plan is spending their time thinking up ways to cover you better and cheaper next year, think again.

Time for US government to govern. America sure as hell wasn't built on capitalism. And it sure as hell wasn't built on socialism. It was built with a healthy balance of the two ...and the well-funded capitalists are getting a little heavy and causing her to list.

Time to rise up alright, start over. Meet the challenge with a level head. There is nothing wrong with overgrown arrogant corporations ...they just need a good shellacking once in a while. It'll be good for America in the long run.

Wes

...

[Wayne Maybury]

Bob
I cannot comment on colon cancer cure rates or the medications involved but every country including Canada and the US have drug approval procedures that must be followed. If the drug is developed in the US, I assume that it would be approved there before it goes through the approval process up here. Unfortunately, Canadian Medicare may not always pay for a drug that has received Health Canada approval because of the cost. I assume that there are HMO's and private health insurance policies that do the same in the US. They will say that they do not pay for drug X but they do pay for drug Y simply because drug X costs 10 times as much as drug Y, and both supposedly do the same thing.

Wes
I saw a study some time back where 14 cents out of every medical dollar spent in the US went for administration cost whereas that number in Canada was 1 cent per dollar spent. I am not saying that government employees are more efficient but I have to assume that much of this has to do with lower paid workers in ordinary offices compared to highly paid executives in ivory towers.

One down fall of our system is that many doctors and highly skilled technicians leave Canada after gaining a certain level of experience and go to the US where they can earn much more money. The real kicker is that our education system is also government controlled so they get their education for a fraction of the cost compared to the US. They graduate then they leave and never pay any taxes here.

The best system is probably somewhere in between the totally public and totally for-profit private systems. There is mounting pressure in Canada to allow a parallel private system but the government is resisting any significant change.

Wayne