building a cobra from basically scratch - Page 5

thefordguy · #81 (**permalink**) 01-10-2011, 09:45 PM

thanks for the support guys. I've actually never "built" a car, I've restored quite a few though and I do care. Today I built the seat brackets and got the door latches installed, and I found out my boss is too cheap to even buy a non shiny pulley that fits so I had to fabricate one for the water pump. It was hard to get it square. I cut a section out of an existing pulley and welded them back together.

tcrist · #82 (**permalink**) 01-10-2011, 09:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by thefordguy

thanks for the support guys. I've actually never "built" a car, I've restored quite a few though and I do care. Today I built the seat brackets and got the door latches installed, and I found out my boss is too cheap to even buy a non shiny pulley that fits so I had to fabricate one for the water pump. It was hard to get it square. I cut a section out of an existing pulley and welded them back together.

You should not weld that pulley together. It has a good chance of coming apart (balance) and knocking off every other item on the front of not only the engine but also the steering.

Think about it. That thing is could be turning 5-6k+.

thefordguy · #83 (**permalink**) 01-10-2011, 10:00 PM

also, not sure if you guys know but I'm only 21 years old, Cars are basically my life, I can't keep a girlfriend because I care more about cars than anything. I've fully restored 5 cars and I'm an ASE certified master mechanic. I do the best I can, but I lack experience. so I'm sorry if I ask stupid questions or or make amateur mistakes. I'm still learning.

thefordguy · #84 (**permalink**) 01-10-2011, 10:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tcrist

You should not weld that pulley together. It has a good chance of coming apart (balance) and knocking off every other item on the front of not only the engine but also the steering.

Think about it. That thing is could be turning 5-6k+.

I don't see it coming apart, it's pretty thick metal and it's welded from both sides, do you know this from experience, or are you assuming?

fastraxsg · #85 (**permalink**) 01-11-2011, 06:25 AM

I'm with tcrist on the matter of a lawsuit, at least change your location and try not to have any thing in the back ground of your photos that can id where the photos are taken. Gotta watch your backside everyday with times the way they are. Keeping photos stored somewhere might be a good idea to protect yourself in the future. At least with this forum, you are making an attempt (a darn good one) to get it right, document everything, and protect yourself, but easy on what you say about the boss, you don't want that to come back at you if he ever signs up on CC.

ken

BBQCYCLEWERKES · #86 (**permalink**) 01-11-2011, 06:47 AM

The level or quality and workmanship is measured on what is normal and customary within the automotive field and within the accepted standards of the automotive repair industry. In the case of welding together a water pump pulley, this is not an accepted practice within the repair industry. In the event this part fails, which it may very likely, both you and your boss could be held liable. Depending on the pulley diamater and crank shaft pulley diamater, your pulley can be turning in excess of 6000 rpm. If not perfectly aligned and balanced you will not only receive vibration stress but possibly sonic metal fatigue which could cause the pulley to shatter, not to mention metal fatigue and molecular realignment at the weld area. Best case is if it brakes and only damages the vehicle. What if the new owner is working on the car and say timing it while running at a high rpm and the pulley shatters and flys apart. This would possibly cause injury and possible death to the person working on the car. That could come back against you and the business owner. This type of suit could cost millions of dollars and who do you think the business owner will blame. In the end, the tech doing the work is most responsible for the quality and liability as he should know better and therefore open to a huge judgement in the event of damages. I've seen too many product liability cases where the jury award has been great so that a message is being sent to the entire industry. Just my 2 cents though. Be careful.

rustyBob · #87 (**permalink**) 01-11-2011, 07:52 AM

I'm with BBQ2 on this one.....

Heres a long story for you....
my brother in law has a 53 Chevy, about 10 years ago he did a repaint on it...
i went to his place 1 day after he got it all put back together and he had the hood
up and was cleaning things up under the hood and i noticed one of the fan blades was bent...i told him to put a different fan on it because bending the 1 he had back into shape WAS NOT a good idea...he bent that blade back where her thought it belonged 2 days later that blade came off and he still has that dent in his hood from the blade flying around under his hood with fresh paint on it...

tcrist · #88 (**permalink**) 01-11-2011, 09:00 AM

I am not trying to ba an a$$ here. I have been behind you on the whole build and up to now I think that you have done a good job especially with what you have to deal with.

No, I have not had a pully come apart because it was welded, because there is no way I would have a welded pulley on my car. You being a mechanic, know what harmonics can do.

My suggestion, as your boss will not spring for a new one, is go to a wrecking yard and get the pully that you need. You have the one welded so you know the dimensions that are required.

I am off this thread.

ACademic · #89 (**permalink**) 01-11-2011, 01:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by thefordguy

and I found out my boss is too cheap to even buy a non shiny pulley that fits so I had to fabricate one for the water pump. It was hard to get it square. I cut a section out of an existing pulley and welded them back together.

Your boss has just redefined the definition of "cheap skate." You should call the History Channel, because they need another reality TV show on fabbing stuff with a boss who's an ass. And I wish I had your fabbing skills when I was 21.

fasterpatrick · #90 (**permalink**) 01-11-2011, 05:36 PM

I must speak up now, Why don't we help the guy out, I personally don't have any pulleys laying around but given the crowd around here some one has the right pulley collecting dust on a shelf right now. Post up the back spacing you need and see if anyone has one they could ship you. Beats the heck out of the pain you could feel if it all goes wrong. By the way I feel your pain, I had the opportunity to work as a private mechanic for a person who could afford it, he own a driving school and a high-end auto service center also had many vintage race cars including a few Ferrari's, that I was to work on. BUT the man was so tight he ate pennies and sh*t dimes. he was a disorganized mess, heard stories about having someone drive a vintage in the parade at Monterey with out brakes.
Needless to say I ran from that like the wind didn't need the bad karma I was way above that. My suggestion to you is build your resume and get the hell out of there as fast as you can. Your skills are better served not having things like that hanging over your head.
Patrick

thefordguy · #91 (**permalink**) 01-11-2011, 06:52 PM

good points about the water pump pulley. The back spacing is 1 5/8", from front of water pump to the middle of the groove, and the largest diameter I can have is 4 3/4". I went to the junk yard and searched for an hour and was unable to find one that would work, the one I modified was the closest I could find. any help locating one would be great.

thefordguy · #92 (**permalink**) 01-11-2011, 06:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tcrist

I am not trying to ba an a$$ here. I have been behind you on the whole build and up to now I think that you have done a good job especially with what you have to deal with.

No, I have not had a pully come apart because it was welded, because there is no way I would have a welded pulley on my car. You being a mechanic, know what harmonics can do.

My suggestion, as your boss will not spring for a new one, is go to a wrecking yard and get the pully that you need. You have the one welded so you know the dimensions that are required.

I am off this thread.

I'm sorry I pissed you off, that was not my intent.

thefordguy · #93 (**permalink**) 01-11-2011, 07:10 PM

The windshield is on, but I haven't built the brackets for it yet. It's starting to look more like a car. My co-worker is starting on the body work. ( notice the wooden structure in the background of one of the pics, that's my bosses idea of a paint booth)

thefordguy · #94 (**permalink**) 01-12-2011, 06:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BBQCYCLEWERKES

The level or quality and workmanship is measured on what is normal and customary within the automotive field and within the accepted standards of the automotive repair industry. In the case of welding together a water pump pulley, this is not an accepted practice within the repair industry. In the event this part fails, which it may very likely, both you and your boss could be held liable. Depending on the pulley diamater and crank shaft pulley diamater, your pulley can be turning in excess of 6000 rpm. If not perfectly aligned and balanced you will not only receive vibration stress but possibly sonic metal fatigue which could cause the pulley to shatter, not to mention metal fatigue and molecular realignment at the weld area. Best case is if it brakes and only damages the vehicle. What if the new owner is working on the car and say timing it while running at a high rpm and the pulley shatters and flys apart. This would possibly cause injury and possible death to the person working on the car. That could come back against you and the business owner. This type of suit could cost millions of dollars and who do you think the business owner will blame. In the end, the tech doing the work is most responsible for the quality and liability as he should know better and therefore open to a huge judgement in the event of damages. I've seen too many product liability cases where the jury award has been great so that a message is being sent to the entire industry. Just my 2 cents though. Be careful.

I have a question I thought of today. I'm not saying any of you are wrong at all. You say metal fatigue and molecular realignment at the weld, driveshafts are welded together and they spin in excess of 6000 RPM all the time. I'm not trying to be a smart ass, I just want to know why a driveshaft welded together is OK but a water pump pulley is not? It spins the same RPM and has much less load. Again, not saying your wrong or trying to be a smart ass, just curious.

mickmate · #95 (**permalink**) 01-12-2011, 07:18 PM

There's a lot of welded together rotating components on a car drivetrain. If it spins good by eye it'll be fine. There are fans pulleys and all kinds of parts that are welded and even spot welded together. If there's a lathe handy to true it up on that helps a lot. Windsheild angle should be 45 deg at the centre of the glass. Spend a minute getting that right as it makes a huge difference to the appearance of the car.

thefordguy · #96 (**permalink**) 01-12-2011, 08:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mickmate

There's a lot of welded together rotating components on a car drivetrain. If it spins good by eye it'll be fine. There are fans pulleys and all kinds of parts that are welded and even spot welded together. If there's a lathe handy to true it up on that helps a lot. Windsheild angle should be 45 deg at the centre of the glass. Spend a minute getting that right as it makes a huge difference to the appearance of the car.

Well the way I built it is kind of like being turned on a lathe. I built it like this: First I tack welded 4 tangs onto the center section of the pulley, then drilled and tapped a whole in each one. Then I slid the outer section into the tangs and secured the two together with bolts through the holes that I tapped. Then I used a feeler gauge between the crank pulley to true it up and down. Then I put the belt on loosely, just enough to turn the pulley and pushed a sharpie into the pulley with the engine idling to find the high/low spots and adjusted it until it was true that way. Then I tacked the two pulley halves together, removed the tangs and had a co- worker run water over the pulley as I welded it so that it would not warp. It is currently installed and is very true. I just don't see it coming apart. but having a correct pulley would help me sleep a little better at night. Thanks for the degree on the windshield, I had no Idea, I will measure tomorrow, how far from the dash is it supposed to be? Right now I have 8 1/2" from dash to windshield and 4 1/2 from windshield to hood.

boxhead · #97 (**permalink**) 01-12-2011, 09:06 PM

Not trying to be a downer, but if your boss is tight on the pennies, I dare say the time you spent, driving to scrapyard, searching scrapyard (only to find nothing) then the time to modify your pulley, probably cost more than it would to jump on the phone and order a new one.

I am not sure if the Ozzie way of thinking is over engineered, but I have been reading this thread form the start, and there is some scary stuff happening.

Good luck with the build, hope it does not bite any potential drivers.

mickmate · #98 (**permalink**) 01-12-2011, 09:06 PM

I think you've done fine with the pulley although it's easy to get more $ into it than getting the right one. Sounds like the windsheild is a bit far forward. I think the back of the post slots measures about 3 1/2" in from the curves by the doors. That's measuring the shortest distance straight in from the edge to the screen width, that is it's not measured straight forward.

thefordguy · #99 (**permalink**) 01-12-2011, 09:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by boxhead

Not trying to be a downer, but if your boss is tight on the pennies, I dare say the time you spent, driving to scrapyard, searching scrapyard (only to find nothing) then the time to modify your pulley, probably cost more than it would to jump on the phone and order a new one.

I am not sure if the Ozzie way of thinking is over engineered, but I have been reading this thread form the start, and there is some scary stuff happening.

Good luck with the build, hope it does not bite any potential drivers.

let me know what stuff you thought was "scary" about the build, I will re think and re engineer. The thing I've noticed about my boss is he is willing to pay more in labor than in parts. weather he realizes it or not.

thefordguy · #**100** (**permalink**) 01-12-2011, 09:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mickmate

I think you've done fine with the pulley although it's easy to get more $ into it than getting the right one. Sounds like the windsheild is a bit far forward. I think the back of the post slots measures about 3 1/2" in from the curves by the doors. That's measuring the shortest distance straight in from the edge to the screen width, that is it's not measured straight forward.

I can't picture the specs you quoted, some pics would be great. I was thinking it was a little too far up but it works well for the brackets in my case, which is why I put it there.