Cobra and C5 Corvette Suspension, Driveline Project

[rat_rod_russell]

Guys thanks for all the feed back in the other post. I wanted to show you guys what my father and I are playing with in our cobra so I started this post to keep the Admin happy. And keep the other post on track

My father and I have a shop in central Texas our bread and butter is replacement frames for different older Chevy’s using the vette stuff. We were doing some fiberglass cars but we have really stopped there just not worth it with all the work they take, to make half way decent. Plus we are welders and fabricators by nature and fiberglass is itchy as hell so please don’t thing this post is a hard core ad campaign, we might sell the first one on EBay just because we could do 10 times better on the next one and so forth. And we might do it because we have the mold later on, after we can answer all the question I’m going to be asking you all but until then we just have a little more room in our garage and some cool tool.

I’m Russell, the computer nerd son who works with Jim aka, dad aka old guy. We have fun so don’t ever come to our shop and expect to take us seriously and if you ask a question expect a very long very serious answer.

We don’t have much Ford practice so that’s why I’m here showing what we are doing and getting some feed back on parts and what you guys might think about it.

This Cobra will have the suspension and driveline from a 2002 Corvette. For the guys who haven’t seen a striped vette suspension here a great shot of a striped down C6 which is the same thing with a smaller torque tube. Sorry all of ours are all apart.



This is the chassis we stared Monday and yesterday we dropped it on the ground and put a suspension on it. After talking with all of you and playing more with the body we decided to drop some of our “real” work to play with this. So here are some photos I took before we left the shop today. I turned the brightness way us so things could be seen in the dark areas. The body is just sitting there nothing is in stone before people start screaming about how the body is off some where. You’ve herd of the measure twice cut once well we measure about 50 time before we do anything, do it right or not at all.

Thanks again

[fasterpatrick]

She's looking good to me. May need a little more room for wheel travel in the wheelwells.Don't worry if the frame shows a little at the bottom, the pipes will hide that, other wise looks like a cobra so far once I get past those rims You have to lose the dunebuggy seats please keep up the good work. Patrick

[LMH]

Hey Russell
I think it's a neat idea to use the Corvette running gear. It's proven, lots of aluminum and cool for the "street rod" kind of car.
If your thinking of making the cars and selling them to the public, could I make a suggestion though; stick with a Ford engine and adapt it to the Corvette suspension. In the Cobra replica world, it's been my experience that most are after a car with Ford power. We tend to be a little different than a lot of the custom car world and tend to want to stay within the original idea of Ford power. It's a proven idea to use a modern suspension and an Ford V8. Backdraft does it and makes beautiful cars using BMW suspension.
I'm not trying to knock your work by any means. It looks first class. I just don't want to see you put forth a huge amount of work and have them not sell. That's only my opnion of course.
Of course, if this is a project for yourself, make it the way you want it!
Larry

[rat_rod_russell]

Ya ive looked at the cobra motorsand thought about adapting them to the vette bell. I have a friend Micheal who races a 2003 cobra mustang and knows about that stuff. i'm just shy about the wireing and computers for the fords. The program i use is proven on all the GM stuff but some guys have just had lots of problems wrighting the custom OS's for the Ford's. In my experiance we have no problem making almost 50 HP with the LS motors with the computer and then we can bolt on the rest to ad it up, But i will move it up my priorty list to look into. This one get's the GM LS1 because I have them laying around. Thanks Larry

[elpontoge]

It looks good very to me ....
Continues posting project's photos ...

Bye

[Ital-cobra]

Hey, rat Rod, I'm useing C4 suspention for my build..check out my gallery, let me know what you think...

[LMH]

Nice gallery you have there!
Larry

[rat_rod_russell]

Here’s the transaxle mounted. I was surprised with how little we needed to remove to fit it. It will make a nice arm rest I think. The shifter rod will be very short and the torque tube will only be about 1 foot long so you will have killer weight distribution. We’re double checking all of our wheel bases, pinion angles and the approximant bump steer front and back before we do any more to the frame. We are also going to look into a radiator and fuel cell soon so we can get the front and rear mounts and functional jack hooks front and back set up. And a C5 Corvette seat for
fasterpatrick













This is the tunnel we re built using the old political signs. They are poly-ethylene and fiberglass resin won’t stick to them and they are free 10 days after the elections  (hint-hint) that and clear packing tape and you can make custom fiberglass pieces to fin anything. We will be fiber glassing the tunnel and the inner cockpit in the morning and the rear inner trunk in the next day so look for more photo’s then.



This is the LS1, T56 Trans painted old school metal flake silver and the red thing is the plastic intake I’m very proud of it’s my third candy paint job, and I think that the photo does it no justice at all. These are for our 32 Ford Roadster with C4 Corvette suspension like Ital-cobra’s ride. We’ll be running around in it in 2-3 weeks. Painting a aluminum motor is the only way to go its low maintenance and looks great and WHEN it gets dirty wash it with a hose. (I hate Chrome and Polished Aluminum I don’t mind stainless in the right place where it helps accent pieces or helps the actual performance of the car, but that’s just me. Dad and I butt heads a lot here)







Ital-cobra that frame looks beefy as hell, I’ll bet it just squats and goes. Who did the original frame and who did the mod?

[LMH]

Nice candy job!
Larry

[rat_rod_russell]

I think this will just make some people sore when they see it but you can do the same thing with the twin piston Cobra brakes.
1) Sand the Caliper
2) Primer
3) Base Coat
4) Candy Coat
5) Wet sand the logo, Start with 800 and work to 2000 and go all the way to the aluminum so it shines
6) Clear coat the caliper.

Most high grade Urethane paints will hold up to the heat generated by a caliper during braking.

[rat_rod_russell]

Like these

[fasterpatrick]

Thanks for using a more appropriate seat. Built lots of off road buggies and used those other seats. That is the only place they look right. Looking good now, you're not acquiring those signs a little early, probably the best use for them any way. Keep us posted Patrick

[bkozlow]

I understand that the Corvette torque tube is made of a ceramic aluminum and requires very special welding. Also, I am not aware of anyone making a scattershield for that setup presently. It could cause serious injury as close to your back as it is in a 90" wheelbase, if the clutch lets go. You might consider some sheet steel across that rear bulkhead if you plan to do anytype of racing, as I believe both the NHRA and SCCA would find fault with it at inspection.

Bill K

[rat_rod_russell]

The torque tube it’s nothing special, Just plan old aluminum, turn it and Tig it. Ceramic aluminum is a type of high temp header coating that looks like chrome, kind-of. I have never herd of it as a stand alone material. This will be the third tube we’ve had done and never any problems. The special welding comes with the other suspension parts from a C6 when they are magnesium aluminum then you just need to use the specific type filler rod to that metal, and the green tungsten and let it rip.

We have looked into integrating a sheet steel reinforcement into the roll cage and body for that very reason. The only thing you need to worry about is in the automatic the torque converter is in the back with the transmission, in the manual the clutch is up front with the motor. The reason you don’t see a scatter shield is because the Corvette has one built in to the car and because of the very low numbers of people using the C5-C6 suspensions for their cars, so I don’t think even the SCCA or the NHRA would catch that one until some one lost it.

Thanks
Russell

[Tommy]

I'm enjoying this thread a lot. Keep it coming please.

[Aussie Mike]

Good project Russell,

I'd like to see the rear suspension pickup points brought in a bit and some shorter axles used. I'm not keen on the tyres hanging out of the guards look.

I looked at using the vette transaxle and torque tube but it was too much work to change my chassis to accept it. It would have made maintenence a pain too. Your car will have a more rearward weight bias than most Cobras. Most seem to be near 50:50 or 52 rear 48 front. Th LS1 only weighs about 400 pounds so that will make for even more rearward bias. It should hook up well.

Bill,

The clutch on one of these engines is in the conventional position with the flywheel on the back of the motor.

In my opinion the torque tube setup is safer than a conventional gearbox setup. There's no universal joints just a straight shaft with greek couplings or similar between the engine and gearbox. This is all contained in a sturdy aluminium tube in case something does brake. That's unlikely though because there's no uni joints which are the weak link in a drive shaft. It's also a lot smoother because there's no vibration induced by uni joints changing angle. Therefore it's more efficient.

In a conventional car setup you are far more likely to have a driveshaft failure catastrophic results than a clutch explosion these days. There's no danger of this with a torque tube.

A scatter shield could be very easily incorporated into the tunnel around the bell housing negating the need for a big heavy steel bell housing. This could be done with a balistic blanket or just steel sheet welded into the tunnel area in the right spots. Clutch explosions are a rare thing these days anyway.

Clutch and flywheels have come a long way sinc the days of grey iron flywheels breaking apart at high RPM. Billet steel flywheels are essentially explosion proof and rated to huge RPM. I put an SFI approved billet steel flywheel in mine and it only weighs 15.5 pounds which is about the same as an aluminium flywheel.

Cheers

[bkozlow]

Coilovers can be used on C-4 suspensions that were setup originally for the transverse leaf spring. Please see the picture. These are a bolt in with only one change needed in the rear. The diameter of the half shaft must be reduced to 3 1/2 inches or less to avoid coilover spring interference. The numbers are Bilstein Shock numbers B36-0228 and B46--0238.
Coilover kits #193117 and #193102 are needed. Call Bilstein,tell them what you want, ask them to GROOVE the shocks for the coilover kits, I think, they charge about $40 for that. They may ask you to get them through one of their dealers, I used someone in Mass., last time I ordered some. Cost is about $600 without the springs. This change over will give you the freedom to change ride height and spring rates easily.


Bill K

[rat_rod_russell]

Tommy, What kind of vette suspesnion are you using?

[Tommy]

RRR -
The builder (not me) told me my car has steering and front and rear suspension from a 1987 Corvette on a 1995 vintage Everett-Morrison frame. The front monospring appears to have been shortened and the rear assembly appears to be basically stock. When I replaced brake pads, I discovered they were for a 1988 Corvette. So, it's possible they are 88 suspension parts.

[rat_rod_russell]

Tommy
you have a C4 corvette suspension. 1984-96 We love those because those vettes are butt ugly and 1000.00 can get you a complete front and rear suspension, Disk brakes, Rack the whole 9 yards. And Places like Baer Brakes offer up grade kits for the C4 Corvettes for bigger brakes. Me personally we ditch the Carbon fiber spring and replace them with Coil over shocks, easer to tune. The only reason we went with a C5 is because we had it, and I’ve never seen one under a cobra before. This is the roadster we are building with the C4 vette suspension I have to have it ready before Jim’s Birthday on the 7 of November so he can do birth day donuts

This is one of our C4 Roadster Chassis With Baer Brakes